Are Mormons Christians

[iepuras]

Do we have to raise it to the square?

Nope. To the triangle.

 

[mjf001]

If Marduk was a true god to the Babylonians, and El and Baal were true gods to the Canaanites, they were still gods.

After all, Samu-El, Isra-El, and Imannu-El, meant something, otherwise why did their names contain “El”?

See Exodus, when Moses confronts Pharaoh. Each of the ten plagues shows that the Egyptian gods are not as powerful as the Lord.
When the Israelites cross the Jordan, during flood stage, upstream from Jericho the waters upstream are stopped, that shows that Baal is not as powerful as God.

The Israelites who play the harlot with the Midianite women and worship Baal are struck by plaguess and killed by the loyal Israelites in Numbers 25.

The Lord repeatedly instructs Israel they are to worship only him. It doesn’t matter that the nations worship many false gods. Israel was called to be the first born son. They were supposed to set the example and worship the Lord alone. That they failed repeatedly doesn’t change the fact it was revealed to them. That the pagans worship many false gods, doesn’t change their is only one God.
Michael

 

[FrankLJ]

So are these 21 statements not true what Morman’s believe?

17.* Mormons doctrinetaught andbelieved that before 1978 they considered the Negro race inferior, and even one drop of Negro blood prevented a person from entering their priesthood.**Now they will allow men of African decent to be priests butthe factthat they once taught thisprovesthey’re a*False Religion…

There is actually an answer of sorts to that. Mormons think that their god produces spirits who have a pre-existence in heaven. These spirits are then put into mortal bodies on birth. A part of these spirits followed their version of Satan in rebellion, and had to be punished. This was done by putting them in Negro ( to use the old term) bodies, as a mark of their disgrace.
It also made them inelegible for the Mormon priesthood.

In 1978, however, the then-prophet Spencer W. Kimball announced that he had had a revelation that Negros were now eligible for their priesthood. No official reason was given, but many Mormons came to this conclusion: The supply of rebel spirits is now exhausted, but the Negro race continues. Since it is the spirit that is the problem, not the race, the problem has now been solved, therefore Negroes can now have the priesthood. They had dropped any formal belief in racial inferiority as such some time ago ( tho lots of Mormons continued to act that way). The wiki article ‘Black People in Mormon Doctrine’ has a lot of useful background info on the various theories used.

They won’t think your point 17 proves anything. However, you have lots more that will be harder to answer. Point 16 interests me; so Joseph Smith said Jesus was coming in 1891?

How do they explain that? It is as you say; one false prophecy makes a false prophet.

 

[Porknpie]

I did not realize that the Jesus of St. Mark, St. Matthew and St. Luke was the result of intercourse between heavenly father and Mary, a polygamist and the first born spirit son of heavenly father (and spirit brother of Lucifer) and just the latest in who knows how many generations of gods. Which translation of the Bible should I read for that information? I missed that in all my years in the Mormon church.

Me like your avatar

 

[Porknpie]

So are these 21 statements not true what Morman’s believe?

I must admit, there is a certain attraction, especially as a male to the points below. I could even at some level say I want to believe.

1.Mormon’s teach that theycan becomegodsandgoddesses.
2.* Mormon goddesses will spend eternity infull submissionto their god-husband
.3.* Mormon’s teach that*women will give birth “forever and ever”to spirit-babies.
4.**Mormon’s teachmen can have multiple wives in heaven—eternalpolygamy. They intend to have many wives in heaven, carrying on multiple sex relations throughout eternity, until they have enough children to populate their own earth, so they can be “Heavenly Father” over their own planet

But then there are teachings here that are beyond all faith, beyond all reason. To the ex-Mormons, when you were Mormon, were you not doubting at some level, some or all the points below (or the points above)

I ask the same question of current Mormons?

1. Heavenly Fatheris an exalted man who lives with his goddess wife,Heavenly Mother,on a planet near the great star Kolob.
   6. American Indians are descendants of the wicked Lamanites, who were Israelites that God cursed with dark skin.
   7. God the Father had sex with Mary to conceive Jesus. They sayVirgin Mary really wasn’t a virgin at all but had sex relations with their heavenly father to produce the Mormon version of Jesus Christ
   9. Mormons teach thattheyneed 4secret handshakes to get into the Celestial heaven.
   10.* Joseph Smith revealed that the actual Garden of Eden is in Jackson County, Missouri.
2. Mormons believe that Lucifer and Jesus are brothers.
   15. Mormonsbelieve the Archangel Michael came down to earth with several of his celestial wives, and became Adam in the garden of Eden.
   16.* The Mormon founder and theirProphet Joseph Smith prophesied falsely many times. For example, he foretold the second coming of Christ for 1891. The Bible teaches that one false prophecy puts the prophet under death sentence. (Deuteronomy 18:20-22).**
   17.* Mormons doctrinetaught andbelieved that before 1978 they considered the Negro race inferior, and even one drop of Negro blood prevented a person from entering their priesthood.Now they will allow menof African decent to be priests butthe factthat they once taught thisprovesthey’re aFalse Religion.
   18.* Mormonshavebooks other thantheBible that they call scriptures such as the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine and Covenants.* All rthese andeven their official “Mormon Doctrine” statements contradict each other on MAJOR doctrinal points. The King James Bible isalso contradicted by these books.
   19.* Mormons believe Jesus had at least three wives and children while he was on this earth.
3. JoesphSmith taught that there were inhabitants on the moon, and Brigham Young taught there were inhabitants on the sun as well! The fact that these two men once taught this proves they were not real Prophets ofGod. They were false prophets and this religion is leading many souls to Hell still today.
   21.* Mormons also teach that there is no salvation without Joseph Smith.* They teach that Joseph Smith holds the keys to the Kingdom of God. They teach thatJesus’ death on the cross only partially saves the believer. They alsoteach that people will stand before God, Jesus and Joseph Smith on Judgement Day.

PnP

Encourage one to watch the show in my signature on faith and reason.

 

[iepuras]

Me like your avatar

Thanks! It very much represents what I am doing right now.

 

[twopekinguys]

Nope. To the triangle.

 

[iepuras]

I must admit, there is a certain attraction, especially as a male to the points below. I could even at some level say I want to believe.

Because it is Mormonism, it sounds better on the surface than in reality. Think about it. Multiple honey do lists, all those kids bugging you when you just want to watch the game, having to take out all that garbage. Do you really want that many women nagging you? Yeah, you would get all that sex with multiple partners, but is it really worth it?

I jest, because the reality would be more like early Utah. Earlier wives abandoned to take care of themselves and their children while the husband enjoys the newer wives. Dad may come around once a year to check on things and impregnate Mom. The kids barely know their own father. The father hardly knows who are his children. One can call it sacred loneliness.

Porknpie:

But then there are teachings here that are beyond all faith, beyond all reason. To the ex-Mormons, when you were Mormon, were you not doubting at some level, some or all the points below (or the points above)

Absolutely. As a woman, my issue was polygamy. I had a hard time believing that a loving God would force his daughters to be eternally unhappy sharing a husband. I couldn’t believe that woman are equal before God if polygamy was ok because polygamy is inherently unequal. The language about women being given by god to men as wives bothered me. It takes free will away from woman and treats us like property. LDS women will tell themselves that heavenly father wouldn’t command their husbands to have multiple wives. Polygamy would only be for other women to deal with. Tough beans LDS ladies, but your supposed prophets taught that polygamy was required in the celestial kingdom. If you don’t like it, you get to spend eternity with the rest of us unworthy folk.

 

[Porknpie]

Absolutely. As a woman, my issue was polygamy. I had a hard time believing that a loving God would force his daughters to be eternally unhappy sharing a husband. I couldn’t believe that woman are equal before God if polygamy was ok because polygamy is inherently unequal. The language about women being given by god to men as wives bothered me. It takes free will away from woman and treats us like property. LDS women will tell themselves that heavenly father wouldn’t command their husbands to have multiple wives. Polygamy would only be for other women to deal with. Tough beans LDS ladies, but your supposed prophets taught that polygamy was required in the celestial kingdom. If you don’t like it, you get to spend eternity with the rest of us unworthy folk.

So one area of confusion here… what is the Mormon theological thought as to where do all these (extra) women come from for men to have polygamy in heaven? And where does this thought come from?? Nature pretty much makes the numbers even…one male for every one female.

 

[RebeccaJ]

[BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]

So one area of confusion here… what is the Mormon theological thought as to where do all these (extra) women come from for men to have polygamy in heaven? And where does this thought come from?? Nature pretty much makes the numbers even…one male for every one female.

The only logical conclusion Is that more women than men are at the celestial level of Mormon heaven.

 

[iepuras]

[BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]

The only logical conclusion Is that more women than men are at the celestial level of Mormon heaven.

Yes. Mormon leaders always talk about how women are more spiritual than men and that there will be more women in the CK than men. Also, early church prophets stated that men had to practice polygamy in this life in order to get into the highest level in the CK where the men get to keep their wives. That teaching is now swept under the rug. So all those faithful LDS men who only have one wife in this life, don’t get to the highest level in the CK. They end up losing their wives to polygamists and get to be angels for eternity. Also, there are a lot of single, never married LDS women who will need husbands on the other side. They get to look forward to being given to be some man’s additional wife. If LDS apostles become widowers, they are highly encouraged to remarry very quickly, in the temple of course.

So much for forever families.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Yes. Mormon leaders always talk about how women are more spiritual than men and that there will be more women in the CK than men.

How quaint. Like believing women shouldn’t in participate in sports because we’re too delicate.

Also, early church prophets stated that men had to practice polygamy in this life in order to get into the highest level in the CK where the men get to keep their wives. That teaching is now swept under the rug.

Yeah, Brigham Young was clear in his teaching that exaltation requires plural marriage. FLDS still hold to this teaching. Young isn’t swept, he’s thrown under the bus. He had his opinions you know. Good luck figuring out which Mormon teachings are opinion and which are not. Seems largely based on societal tolerance.

So all those faithful LDS men who only have one wife in this life, don’t get to the highest level in the CK. They end up losing their wives to polygamists and get to be angels for eternity. Also, there are a lot of single, never married LDS women who will need husbands on the other side. They get to look forward to being given to be some man’s additional wife. If LDS apostles become widowers, they are highly encouraged to remarry very quickly, in the temple of course.

So much for forever families.

Creepy, is what it is too me.

 

[Porknpie]

Yes. Mormon leaders always talk about how women are more spiritual than men and that there will be more women in the CK than men. Also, early church prophets stated that men had to practice polygamy in this life in order to get into the highest level in the CK where the men get to keep their wives. That teaching is now swept under the rug. So all those faithful LDS men who only have one wife in this life, don’t get to the highest level in the CK. They end up losing their wives to polygamists and get to be angels for eternity. Also, there are a lot of single, never married LDS women who will need husbands on the other side. They get to look forward to being given to be some man’s additional wife. If LDS apostles become widowers, they are highly encouraged to remarry very quickly, in the temple of course.

So much for forever families.

One step forward and one step back. Your answer helped my previous question but now I am a bit confused on how one can lose their wife despite being a faithful LDS male?

 

[iepuras]

One step forward and one step back. Your answer helped my previous question but now I am a bit confused on how one can lose their wife despite being a faithful LDS male?

Brigham Young and other polygamous prophets taught that a man had to live the higher law, meaning polygamy, during this life in order to keep his wives in the celestial kingdom. So if an otherwise worthy man didn’t take a second wife, he wasn’t following the higher law and thus not eligible for exaltation in the celestial kingdom. Exaltation refers to the highest level in the CK where men and women are married and have spirit children to populate future planets. So if he doesn’t make it, but his wife is otherwise worthy, she is given to another man who already has lots of wives. He is relegated to being an angel.

During the days of polygamy, there were not always enough women so young men were sometimes kicked out or castrated so there would be enough women for the more powerful men. In the FLDS and other polygamous communities, they will banish teenage boys so there are enough women to have plural wives. These poor boys are known as "lost boys ". It is extraordinarily sad.

These days, the vast majority of LDS believe that polygamy is allowed but not mandatory for the celestial kingdom. Most believe that if a man only has one wife in this lifetime, he will only have one in the CK. Polygamy is seen as an unfortunate necessity because of all the good faithful women who never marry in this life. (Men who are single in this life are out of luck in the next. They don’t get to marry the “extra” women.) Until I met my husband at age 29, I thought I was going to be one of those single women who would be relegated to being a polygamous wife in the CK. I spent so much of my 20’s sad and worried that I would never marry.

 

[taylorf]

So one area of confusion here… what is the Mormon theological thought as to where do all these (extra) women come from for men to have polygamy in heaven? And where does this thought come from?? Nature pretty much makes the numbers even…one male for every one female.

Polyandry solves this problem. Joseph’s plan was fool proof.

 

[taylorf]

Also, early church prophets stated that men had to practice polygamy in this life in order to get into the highest level in the CK where the men get to keep their wives. That teaching is now swept under the rug.

So much for forever families.

LOL, I think Brigham Young was swept under the rug. The guy pretty much taught nothing but false doctrine.

 

[zaffiroborant]

If Marduk was a true god to the Babylonians, and El and Baal were true gods to the Canaanites, they were still gods.

After all, Samu-El, Isra-El, and Imannu-El, meant something, otherwise why did their names contain “El”?

Should we Mourn for Baal then? Living in some obscure location wasting away from lack of belief? Just how is there a former tense for being god and what happens to these once gods now that they are no longer gods? Did Star Trek have it right?

I just don’t see how any of this shows the LDS to be Christian in any sense. How does restoring ancient henothism make the LDS Christian? It seems JS wanted to restore ancient Judaism as it suited him and not any form of Christianity.

 

[nmgauss]

Polygamy was encouraged in the early days of Islam. The idea was for women to be supported somehow. If a woman lost her husband and she became destitute, marrying a prosperous man who was already married proved that at least the new man in her life was capable of supporting her.

Even in Sigmund Freud’s day, his household contained his wife, their children, and her sister. Although only one wife was permitted in those days, Freud is supposed to have treated the sister as his mistress.

 

[PRmerger]

Clearly, not part of God’s moral law.

 

[CarolNoel]

Clearly, not part of God’s moral law.

Clearly! Definitely.