Are Mormons (LDS) Christians?

[BartBurk]

They view it basically as the Eastern Orthodox do. The result of the fall is that sin and death entered the world. As a result, people have a natural tendency to sin. To paraphrase the Book of Mormon, “The natural man is an enemy to God.” They do not believe in any inherited guilt because of Adam’s sin.

I need to add that one of the arguments use to support the belief that we are not born with guilt because of Adam’s sin is very Christian. They believe Christ’s atonement paid for Adam’s transgression and so the guilt can’t be passed on to Adam’s children. The only guilt we have is for our own sins. At the same time, our natural tendency to sin assures that we will not remain sinless.

 

[Will_B]

***We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, ***
***maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen. ***

***We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, ***
eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in Being with
the Father. Through Him all things were made.

For us men and for our salvation
He came down from heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit
He was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man.

For our sake He was crucified under Pontius Pilate:
He suffered, died and was buried.
On the third day He rose again in fulfillment of the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and His kingdom will have no end.

We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son.
With the Father and the Son He is worshiped and glorified.
He has spoken through the Prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the
world to come. AMEN.

The creed is above, as said each Sunday in the Roman Catholic Church and is said every day in our church.
I have outlined in blue the part of the creed most Mormons disagree with, however I believe they probably disagree with the entire creed.

 

[BartBurk]

***We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, ***
***maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen. ***

***We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, ***
eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in Being with
the Father. Through Him all things were made.

For us men and for our salvation
He came down from heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit
He was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man.

For our sake He was crucified under Pontius Pilate:
He suffered, died and was buried.
On the third day He rose again in fulfillment of the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and His kingdom will have no end.

We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son.
With the Father and the Son He is worshiped and glorified.
He has spoken through the Prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the
world to come. AMEN.

The creed is above, as said each Sunday in the Roman Catholic Church and is said every day in our church.
I have outlined in blue the part of the creed most Mormons disagree with, however I believe they probably disagree with the entire creed.

The interesting part is the Book of Mormon and most of the rest of Mormon scripture could easily be interpreted to agree with the blue part. The Community of Christ which accepts many of the same scriptures the Mormons do states that it believes in the Trinity. The distance between Christian orthodoxy and Mormonism is not as large as many of us try to make it. With some education and encouragement I think the Mormons could be moved towards orthodox Christianity. Encouraging the dialog is a good thing. I think within the next 50 years the distance between orthodox Christianity and Mormonism with regards to the Trinity could be almost indistinguishable. I think the Mormons will always maintain the Father has a body.

 

[falisrm]

I think your assessment is just a “little” off. For one, it’s impossible to change doctrine. We can’t believe that the godhead is 3 seperate and distinct individuals with physical bodies and then in 5 years believe in the trinity. They don’t change, how is it even possible to do that?

 

[scipio337]

I think your assessment is just a “little” off. For one, it’s impossible to change doctrine. We can’t believe that the godhead is 3 seperate and distinct individuals with physical bodies and then in 5 years believe in the trinity. They don’t change, how is it even possible to do that?

How would you explain the 1835 and 1844 D&C:

“Inasmuch as this church of Christ has been reproached with the crime of fornication, and polygamy: we declare that we believe, that one man should have one wife; and one woman, but one husband, except in the case of death, when either is at liberty to marry again”

Actually, you had that published in the 1844 D&C, yet Joseph Smith claimed to have the plural marriage “revelation” in 1843, so actually, we’re talking about a not a 5 year time frame, but -1 year.

 

[nebula]

I think your assessment is just a “little” off. For one, it’s impossible to change doctrine. We can’t believe that the godhead is 3 seperate and distinct individuals with physical bodies and then in 5 years believe in the trinity. They don’t change, how is it even possible to do that?

falis,

Look at how quickly Mormons were able to adapt to the ousting of plural marriage as a key part to exaltation and their identity- a mere 20 years after official declaration 1 the church started going after those practicing it! Look at how quickly your fellow Mormons reject the notion that heavenly father is exalted, and that was just common theological knowledge 100 years ago in Mormonism. Consider that most of the MOrmon population these days is made up of converts, many of whom think of themselves as monotheists, and they’d be very open to a trinitarian interpretation. It could be done, partly because Mormonism doesn’t have a clear, set orthodoxy, and partly because the prophets could always claim to have revelation to clarify matters.

 

[MelanieAnne]

Sounds more like a club than a church.

 

[BartBurk]

I think your assessment is just a “little” off. For one, it’s impossible to change doctrine. We can’t believe that the godhead is 3 seperate and distinct individuals with physical bodies and then in 5 years believe in the trinity. They don’t change, how is it even possible to do that?

The use of the term Trinity is not foreign to Mormonism. Go look in Articles of Faith by James Talmadge and you will see it used in that book. Another example is found from Elder Robert Wells in a Liahona article in which he says, “We are Christians because we worship the Godhead, the Christian Trinity …”

lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=f318118dd536c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=13da0e46d0bdb010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

There are numerous examples which can be found. The doctrine of the Trinity is not destroyed if each member of the Godhead has a separate physical body. The Trinity describes the ontological oneness of Father, Son and Holy Ghost and their eternal Being as God. I don’t believe the Father has a body, but that issue is not addressed in the Nicene Creed or the Apostles Creed. The important aspect of the Nicene Creed is Jesus’ oneness with God as God from all eternity. Nothing stops the Father from creating a physical body for himself when He creates the universe.

 

[scipio337]

Mormons believe that unless one is baptized according to the Mormon tradition one cannot attain the highest degree of glory in the Celestial Kingdom. So they baptize their dead ancestors by proxy to attain this qualification for them.

Unfortunately, the practice is not limited just to direct decendants. See LDS proxy baptism (and marriage, and other LDS ordinances) to several Popes, etc.

Mormon friend of mine once had a conversation with a Catholic priest where she quoted him as saying, “well, you know, either you’re right, or we’re right, but no one else is right”.

That’s and urban legend associated to Orson F. Whitney.

google “Many years ago a learned man, a member of the Roman Catholic Church, came to Utah and spoke from the stand of the Salt Lake Tabernacle. I became well-acquainted with him, and we conversed freely and frankly. A great scholar, with perhaps a dozen languages at his tongue’s end, he seemed to know all about theology, law, literature, science and philosophy…”

Of course, the name of the “member of the Roman Catholic Church” is never mentioned, or the account substantiated. Its a tactic by LDS to give some relevance to their beliefs.

 

[Contarini]

Are Mormons (LDS) Christian? Moreover, if they are, aren’t they Protestants as well?

Their historical origins certainly lie in Protestant Christianity. Since I use “Protestant” only as a historical umbrella term, I have no problem saying that they are Protestants.

“Christian” is more complex, because it implies certain key doctrinal beliefs. Mormons are confusing because they adhere to the basic affirmations of Christian salvation history (that Jesus was born of a virgin, died and rose again, etc.), but interpret them in radically different ways than traditional Christianity (and, of course, add a number of other affirmations, including a whole new body of scripture!). Mormons claim that Christianity is about these historical affirmations and that the metaphysical principles by which orthodox Christians interpret these statements (i.e., that believing in God as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit means believing in three persons but one essence) are corruptions stemming from Greek philosophy. Therefore, they see their faith as a purified and restored Christianity.

Given their radical break with traditional Christian faith and their inability to affirm basic Christian affirmations in the sense that orthodox Christians do, I would say that Mormons are not “Christians” in the sense that they are not in any sense members of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. They are a separate religion deriving from Christianity, as Christianity derives from Judaism and as Islam derives from both Christianity and Judaism. But that’s a theological, not a historical judgment, and it should not keep us from recognizing the many ways in which Mormonism is Christian.

Edwin

 

[Reformed]

Are Mormons (LDS) Christian? Moreover, if they are, aren’t they Protestants as well?

In addition, what is the story with the, “Looking Glass Trial"?

How do Mormons view Orignal Sin and what happened in the Garden of Eden?

What is, “Blood Letting?”

Do all Mormons become “gods” when they die?

What is the fig leaf dance?

Why do Mormons baptized dead people and do they belief that that process actually makes those people Mormon?

Do Mormons believe in the Holy Trinity?

What do they have to say about Catholicism?

I guarantee that official Mormon doctrine is much closer to Roman Catholicism than Reformed theology.

http://www.soft3k.com/imgs/My-Basset-Hound-Screen-Saver-w300-5085.jpg

The main Mormon site is lds.org, and mormon.org. Study it and see if my statement is true. The best stie to understand historic biblical Christianity (Reformed Theology) is

monergism.com/

Roman Catholicism and Mormonism are synergestic, and not monergstic.

 

[MelanieAnne]

That’s and urban legend associated to Orson F. Whitney.

google “Many years ago a learned man, a member of the Roman Catholic Church, came to Utah and spoke from the stand of the Salt Lake Tabernacle. I became well-acquainted with him, and we conversed freely and frankly. A great scholar, with perhaps a dozen languages at his tongue’s end, he seemed to know all about theology, law, literature, science and philosophy…”

Of course, the name of the “member of the Roman Catholic Church” is never mentioned, or the account substantiated. Its a tactic by LDS to give some relevance to their beliefs.

There may be an urban legend as you describe, but the mother of a childhood friend of mine actually had such a conversation. Perhaps they were discussing the “urban legend”, I don’t actually know the context or extent of the conversation. I do know that she told me she had the conversation and that she wouldn’t have lied about something like that, or lied about anything for that matter.

Now, you may be right that she took some sort of confidence in her Mormon faith from the conversation. But I reject the notion that she made up the event. Since she passed away a few years ago, I can’t ask her about it.

I find it hard to understand how you can so confidently say that my friend’s mother could never have had such a conversation. Have you had a video camera on her for her entire adult lifetime?

 

[RebeccaJ]

The use of the term Trinity is not foreign to Mormonism. Go look in Articles of Faith by James Talmadge and you will see it used in that book. Another example is found from Elder Robert Wells in a Liahona article in which he says, “We are Christians because we worship the Godhead, the Christian Trinity …”

lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=f318118dd536c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=13da0e46d0bdb010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

There are numerous examples which can be found. The doctrine of the Trinity is not destroyed if each member of the Godhead has a separate physical body. The Trinity describes the ontological oneness of Father, Son and Holy Ghost and their eternal Being as God. I don’t believe the Father has a body, but that issue is not addressed in the Nicene Creed or the Apostles Creed. The important aspect of the Nicene Creed is Jesus’ oneness with God as God from all eternity. Nothing stops the Father from creating a physical body for himself when He creates the universe.

That is Mormons, redefining the word Trinity to mean something else.

 

[rpp]

The use of the term Trinity is not foreign to Mormonism. Go look in Articles of Faith by James Talmadge and you will see it used in that book. Another example is found from Elder Robert Wells in a Liahona article in which he says, “We are Christians because we worship the Godhead, the Christian Trinity …”

lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=f318118dd536c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=13da0e46d0bdb010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

There are numerous examples which can be found. ** The doctrine of the Trinity is not destroyed if each member of the Godhead has a separate physical body.** The Trinity describes the ontological oneness of Father, Son and Holy Ghost and their eternal Being as God. I don’t believe the Father has a body, but that issue is not addressed in the Nicene Creed or the Apostles Creed. The important aspect of the Nicene Creed is Jesus’ oneness with God as God from all eternity. Nothing stops the Father from creating a physical body for himself when He creates the universe.

Referring to the Statement in bold, this is not correct.

Three persons in one being is the Trinity. Christ is the only one with a physical body, however, His divine portion was never separated from The Father and The Holy Spirit.

Mormonism is not monotheistic. Mormonism is not Trinitarian. Mormonism is not a form of Christianity.

In addition, Mormons do not believe that God existed from all eternity. They believe that the Father was simply the first person to ascend to Godhood. This is utterly incompatible with all forms of Christianity.

 

[Jerusha]

No.
They are Mormons.

Saying a Mormon is Christian is similar to saying a Muslim is Christian…

Though, as it was mentioned, I do believe a lot of them truly try to follow in the footsteps of our Lord and our God, Jesus Christ.

I agree, the best of them are Christian. The hierarchy of their church won’t read their personal statements of belief because they would have no choice but to “ex” them.

 

[BartBurk]

Referring to the Statement in bold, this is not correct.

Three persons in one being is the Trinity. Christ is the only one with a physical body, however, His divine portion was never separated from The Father and The Holy Spirit.

Mormonism is not monotheistic. Mormonism is not Trinitarian. Mormonism is not a form of Christianity.

In addition, Mormons do not believe that God existed from all eternity. They believe that the Father was simply the first person to ascend to Godhood. This is utterly incompatible with all forms of Christianity.

You are using the terms “being” or “substance” as terms referring to the physical characteristics of God when they are philosophical terms. The Nicene Creed is not concerned with the physical attributes of God the Father.

 

[AMDGtoo]

The Nicene Creed is not concerned with the physical attributes of God the Father.

The Nicene Creed is concerned with truth. Jesus is “God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God eternally begotten, not made, one in Being with the Father.” Jesus is God. God and Jesus are not two separate “personages” acting with one accord (as Mormons believe). Jesus and God are of the same substance–they are one in being. Jesus is the great “I AM”.

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

No, they don’t believe in Christ as God.

 

[BartBurk]

No, they don’t believe in Christ as God.

From the introduction to the Book of Mormon:

And also to the convincing of the Jew and Gentile that JESUS is the CHRIST, the ETERNAL GOD, manifesting himself unto all nations

2 Nephi 26:12:

And as I spake concerning the convincing of the Jews, that Jesus is the very Christ, it must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God;

Alma 11:44:

Now, this restoration shall come to all, both old and young, both bond and free, both male and female, both the wicked and the righteous; and even there shall not so much as a hair of their heads be lost; but every thing shall be restored to its perfect frame, as it is now, or in the body, and shall be brought and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil.

The Mormons don’t understand that based on the testimony of their own scripture they should believe that Christ is God.

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

From the introduction to the Book of Mormon:

2 Nephi 26:12:

Alma 11:44:

The Mormons don’t understand that based on the testimony of their own scripture they should believe that Christ is God.

Doesn’t matter what their book says, its what they believe.