Are Muslims okay with Muhammed actions?

[Reuben_J]

the point is young marriage is valid regarding your own holy book. So , bash a legal marriage using dirtiest words …is it ok ?

If God approves something , who are we to object ? Slaves must not challenge God & should say " We hear & We obey ’ .

The point is - there was never such an incident that was allowed by God for marriage of a six year old child.

6, 7, 8, 9 years old are children, not women.

Mary and Joesph did not fall to this category. By the time she was married to Joesph she was a young woman, not a 9 year-old child.

I know Muslims in their desperation want to use Mary’s age to justify Aisha’s age when Mohammad sexually abused her. No they were NOT the same. In any case in Catholic Tradition’s Mary was celibate for the rest of her life. She was the ‘ever-virgin’.

 

[seraphime2008]

As a Christian who believe in the Divine Sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ (Praise and Glory Be Upon Him)

Now…that’s what we call respect and proper title…!instead of PBUH

Thanks for restating and emphasizing that.

Bless U

 

[Muslim_Woman]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

…Mary and Joesph did not fall to this category. By the time she was married to Joesph she was a young woman, not a 9 year-old child.

She was 12 or 13 , maximum 14. By today’s men made laws , she is considered as too young for marriage . But Chrisitans don’t think she committed a sin by got married at that young age ’ cause she is mommy of your Lord.

btw , what’s the minimum age for marriage ? What should be the maximum age gap between spouses ? Who fixed all these ??

 

[GraceDK]

**Muslim Woman;

She was 12 or 13 , maximum 14. **

Really? Were you there? You have any historical sources to back this claim?
You also might want to take note that there is a big difference between being married at 12 or being engaged at 14.
At any rate, we as Christians are not obliged to defend old Jewish traditions eg. a young age of marriage. Why? Because we don’t hold this as an example to imitate. On the contrary, every Christian Church is per definition against child marriage that is practiced much in the Islamic world. Also, you can point to no place in Jewish or Christian societies where such behaviour is not criminalized.
So is polygami and concubinage. Even in Denmark some Muslim men have the audacity to have severel wives to the shock and repulsion of the rest of society. The problem of Islam is that by divine mandate it eternalises immoral behaviour and holds it up as a God-pleasing example.

By today’s men made laws , she is considered as too young for marriage . But Chrisitans don’t think she committed a sin by got married at that young age ’ cause she is mommy of your Lord.

Mariam of Nazareth was a child of her time in Judea. And no, she did not sin. Neither did Aisha. It was Muhammad that was the only sinner, if you want to talk about these couples, since he is the only one who raped a child… Mariam was a virgin who conceived Jesus through miraculous intervention … which also the Koran teaches.
We of course do not believe the Church to make only man-made rules. The Church is directed by the Love and Spirit of God, thus it says that two people who marry must be able to do so freely, consciously and at the age of reason. Marriage is a huge commitment to a life of exclusive love between one man and one woman. Therefore we also advocate romantic love.

btw , what’s the minimum age for marriage ? What should be the maximum age gap between spouses ? Who fixed all these ??

One eventually wonders, if you Muslim woman, ever ask Love, to define to you what is pleasing in His eyes. God is the One who is Love… Because of His love that is in us we cannot bear to see children misused, women maltreated or humiliated like they are in Islam, nor people killed because they follow their conscience and faith away from Islam…
God fixed what is right and wrong… and in your female sensitive heart, I believe you are repulsed at concubinage, child marriage and polygami, but you dont know what to do if you admit this to your self.

Peace and salaam.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

**Muslim Woman;

She was 12 or 13 , maximum 14. ** Really? Were you there? You have any historical sources to back this claim?

So , how old was she ? 20 , 30 , 40 ???

You also might want to take note that there is a big difference between being married at 12 or being engaged at 14.

If young marriage is a sin regarding your holy book , why mom of your Lord was engaged at such an age that is considered as tooooo young by today’s standard ? If the engagement took place now in the west , both the mommy & earthy daddy of your Lord including your lord himself were in police custody

Even in Denmark some Muslim men have the audacity to have severel wives to the shock and repulsion of the rest of society.

yes , non-Muslims are not shocked when people go around with unlimiterd sex partners . They react when people have partners legally .

Anyway , In Oprah TV show , there were stories of Americans who claimed that they are family members of Jesus (pbuh) . To keep the blood pure , they arrange marriages between members of the group only. Thus , mom & daugthers are sometimes married to same man

]The problem of Islam is that by divine mandate it eternalises immoral behaviour and holds it up as a God-pleasing example.

Marriage is not immoral according to God’s any holy book. Problem is non-Muslims are denying God’s commands ; they think they are more intelligent than Him.

.

One eventually wonders…

I did not see any replies to my questions . So , I am asking again :

** what’s the minimum age for marriage ? What should be the maximum age gap between spouses ? Who fixed all these ??**

 

[Abbadon]

**
Anyway , In Oprah TV show , there were stories of Americans who claimed that they are family members of Jesus (pbuh) . To keep the blood pure , they arrange marriages between members of the group only. Thus , mom & daugthers are sometimes married to same man

** what’s the minimum age for marriage ? What should be the maximum age gap between spouses ? Who fixed all these ??****
Do you remember exactly who this group was called? I would be very interested to check this out.

The age at which a child becomes a grown up and can consent. None over and above the age stated previously. Humanity fixed this, a justice system, courts, rules and regulations and a bunch of people who realized that it was wrong to force a 6 year old girl into a marriage.

I’m still amazed though. How hard is it to say that it is wrong to statutorily rape a 9 year old girl?

Come on I’m sure you could say it if you tried… try a bit at a time… It is wrong… to rape… a 9 YEAR OLD CHILD.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

Do you remember exactly who this group was called? I would be very interested to check this out.

The title of the show was ’ dirty secret of America ’ . It’s about 3/4 years back.

.

It is wrong… to rape… a 9 YEAR OLD CHILD.

it’s wrong to rape anyone . Rape is a major sin in islam . To my knowledge , punishment is death penalty.

Marriage takes place when 2 parties give consent . When will non-Muslims stop bashing a legal marriage ??

 

[Hadi]

Do you remember exactly who this group was called? I would be very interested to check this out.

The age at which a child becomes a grown up and can consent. None over and above the age stated previously. Humanity fixed this, a justice system, courts, rules and regulations and a bunch of people who realized that it was wrong to force a 6 year old girl into a marriage.

I’m still amazed though. How hard is it to say that it is wrong to statutorily rape a 9 year old girl?

Come on I’m sure you could say it if you tried… try a bit at a time… It is wrong… to rape… a 9 YEAR OLD CHILD.

First, in the 7th century,no Jew or Christan or even pagan called that marriage “rape” …why is that??

Second, what about a 90 year old man (Joseph) marrying a 12 year old (Mary) ?? it’s definitely not acceptable by our modern standards whether the sex was involved or not…

Third, Aisha’s age is questionable…read this post forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=5181471#post5181471

 

[jakasaki]

~ ***snip ***~

** quran didn’t mention ** Alexander , quran mentioned Dhul-Qarnayn
may be some of western scholars suggesting that he is alexander , i don’t know why ****, but quran didn’t mentioned that Dhul-Qarnayn is the same Alexander

continue…

• تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn مصنف و لم يتم تدقيقه بعد

---

قراءة الآية
فتح صفحة القرآن
الانتقال الى صفحة القرآن
{ وَيَسْأَلُونَكَ عَن ذِي ٱلْقَرْنَيْنِ قُلْ سَأَتْلُواْ عَلَيْكُم مِّنْهُ ذِكْراً }

And they, the Jews, question you concerning Dhū’l-Qarnayn, whose name was Alexander;** he was not a prophet. Say: ‘I shall recite, relate, to you a mention, an account, of him’, of his affair. **

altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=18&tAyahNo=83&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0

 

[josie_L]

** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

The title of the show was ’ dirty secret of America ’ . It’s about 3/4 years back.

.

it’s wrong to rape anyone . Rape is a major sin in islam . To my knowledge , punishment is death penalty.

Marriage takes place when 2 parties give consent . When will non-Muslims stop bashing a legal marriage ??

God does not make pedophiles prophets, nor will He ever. I need not quote scripture for this is a universal morality, written on the hearts of all humans.

 

[Abbadon]

it’s wrong to rape anyone . Rape is a major sin in islam . To my knowledge , punishment is death penalty.

Marriage takes place when 2 parties give consent . When will non-Muslims stop bashing a legal marriage ??

A 9 year old girl is to young to understand what she is entering into. Having sex with her, I’m sure she wouldn’t object because she would be scared and over powered. And when you tell her she is married to this 60 year old man I doubt she has a choice, she just goes along with it. It’s rape, just legalized rape.

 

[Abbadon]

First, in the 7th century,no Jew or Christan or even pagan called that marriage “rape” …why is that??

Second, what about a 90 year old man (Joseph) marrying a 12 year old (Mary) ?? it’s definitely not acceptable by our modern standards whether the sex was involved or not…

Yes that is also wrong. Mary should have been at an age when she was no longer a child and could fully comprehend the situation she was entering. We have now fixed that with as best we can to stop things like that from happening.

You have to be 16 to drive, you have to be 21 to drink, you have to be 18 to smoke. And you have to be 18 to get married, there are reasons for all this.

 

[Abbadon]

I didn’t bother to focus on it because in my opinion what happens between CONSENTING ADULTS. Is their business. However they should not be allowed to have progeny for genetic reasons…

 

[jakasaki]

One of mohamads punishments for theft according to the koran is cutting off the hand. There are hadiths in detail about this as well.

This is the punishment for stealing according to mohamads allah who is known as “the Almighty”, “the Merciful”, “the Creator”, the “All Knowing” and many other names.

Apparently allah “the merciful” has no mercy for his “slaves” as muslims call themselves.

There is no “hand cutting” off in the Torah (OT) Books of Moses for a thief. A thief must be delt with in other ways without “losing any body parts”.

God is sovereign, and could well provide different laws for different circumstances. Were the circumstances different for mohamad to those at the time of Moses? Afterall, stealing is stealing. Whether is a loaf of bread, a piece of jewelry or a camel.

Muslims claim that God did indeed speak through Moses but gave a later, perfect and final revelation through mohamad.

If God’s word to mohamad is inconsistent with His word to Moses - does that mean that God cancelled His first message? Or could it be that the voice that spoke to one of them was in fact not that of God the Creator, or All Knowing and Merciful?

Would the God who knows the worth of His creation order the destruction of one of His most important masterpieces -the hand- for the sake of **property **damage?

And since mohamads allah is “all knowing”, it’s known that you must eat with your right hand and only use your left hand for “bathroom” duties. When allah ordered the hand to be removed, that means the poor soul must eat and wipe with the same hand.

Isn’t that against islam to eat and wipe with the same hand.

It sounds like allah isn’t “all knowing” after all and neither is he merciful. Not only did mohamads allah leave the person who stole with only one usable hand, but now this person cannot do anything in his/hers life with only one limb.

 

[qui_est_ce]

".

Muslims claim that God did indeed speak through Moses but gave a later, perfect and final revelation through mohamad.
{snip}It sounds like allah isn’t “all knowing” after all and neither is he merciful. Not only did mohamads allah leave the person who stole with only one usable hand, but now this person cannot do anything in his/hers life with only one limb.

Hey Pam,
I think communications will be the end of Islam. I can’t help but think that Muslims who are reading about Muhammed here are shocked. Their whole lives they were told PBUH, etc. I, too, used to believe that Islam was an inoccuous religion. Until I read the posts by Sister Amy, Muslim Woman, Planten, et al. I was completely neutral on Islam, and thought anti-Muslims to be misdirected hatred. What these Muslims posted here, and the links they provided was quite an education for me. It’s to the point where I cringe when I see a post from Sister Amy, her cynicism and denials chill me to the bone. When something good and beautiful is posted, the answers are are emotionless denials of Truths in Christianity. It’s as though they have no feelings.
I watched “Lifting the Veil” on CNN last night. The women in Afghanistan are burning themselves because their lives are so miserable. BURNING-they have no feelings left.

cnn.com/CNN/Programs/siu/shows/lifting.the.veil/index.html

How can someone treat their mother, their sister, their fellow human like this?

Below are some claims which are major problems:

The Bible got somehow corrupted, but no evidence other that M’s word

• There should be no age limit to marriage
• It is ok to slap your wife if she doesn’t do what you want her to do
• Polygamy
• Lying is ok as a means to an end.
• A prophet is ok with butchering people, having sex with slaves, having mutliple wives

Jesus is not the son of God, he didn’t get crucified, and he is not resurrected.

I think most people seek to educate themselves and search for Truth. Islam, as presented by Muslim posters here, does not pass as credible Truth. It’s hard to believe how such obvious mistruths have become a religion to so many.

Let’s keep an open and charitble dialog going. Much can be accomplished through the power of the Advocate.

:grouphug:

 

[jakasaki]

Hey Pam,
I think communications will be the end of Islam. I can’t help but think that Muslims who are reading about Muhammed here are shocked. Their whole lives they were told PBUH, etc. I, too, used to believe that Islam was an inoccuous religion. Until I read the posts by Sister Amy, Muslim Woman, Planten, et al. I was completely neutral on Islam, and thought anti-Muslims to be misdirected hatred. What these Muslims posted here, and the links they provided was quite an education for me. It’s to the point where I cringe when I see a post from Sister Amy, her cynicism and denials chill me to the bone. When something good and beautiful is posted, the answers are are emotionless denials of Truths in Christianity. It’s as though they have no feelings.
I watched “Lifting the Veil” on CNN last night. The women in Afghanistan are burning themselves because their lives are so miserable. BURNING-they have no feelings left.

cnn.com/CNN/Programs/siu/shows/lifting.the.veil/index.html

How can someone treat their mother, their sister, their fellow human like this?

Below are some claims which are major problems:

The Bible got somehow corrupted, but no evidence other that M’s word

• There should be no age limit to marriage
• It is ok to slap your wife if she doesn’t do what you want her to do
• Polygamy
• Lying is ok as a means to an end.
• A prophet is ok with butchering people, having sex with slaves, having mutliple wives

Jesus is not the son of God, he didn’t get crucified, and he is not resurrected.

I think most people seek to educate themselves and search for Truth. Islam, as presented by Muslim posters here, does not pass as credible Truth. It’s hard to believe how such obvious mistruths have become a religion to so many.

Let’s keep an open and charitble dialog going. Much can be accomplished through the power of the Advocate.

:grouphug:

Christine, beautifully written.

Thank you!

 

[jakasaki]

Hey Pam,

I think communications will be the end of Islam.

I can’t help but think that Muslims who are reading about Muhammed here are shocked.

Their whole lives they were told PBUH, etc.

~ ***snip ***~

:grouphug:

I wanted to comment on this Christinie, if I may, which you know I will…

It’s not communications that will “be the end of islam”, but I feel it’s denial and not finding the truth because they are not allowed to question.

And to your second point, I do not believe they are “shocked” at all. They concur with every action and behavior of mohamads.

And to point #3, the pbuh thing, it’s all well and good, but it’s a robotic saying over and over and over and over and it results to nothing.

I will close with this…

**‘‘For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son."**

John 3:16-18

 

[elwill]

One of mohamads punishments for theft according to the koran is cutting off the hand. There are hadiths in detail about this as well.

This is the punishment for stealing according to mohamads allah who is known as “the Almighty”, “the Merciful”, “the Creator”, the “All Knowing” and many other names.

Apparently allah “the merciful” has no mercy for his “slaves” as muslims call themselves.

There is no “hand cutting” off in the Torah (OT) Books of Moses for a thief. A thief must be delt with in other ways without “losing any body parts”.

God is sovereign, and could well provide different laws for different circumstances. Were the circumstances different for mohamad to those at the time of Moses? Afterall, stealing is stealing. Whether is a loaf of bread, a piece of jewelry or a camel.

Muslims claim that God did indeed speak through Moses but gave a later, perfect and final revelation through mohamad.

If God’s word to mohamad is inconsistent with His word to Moses - does that mean that God cancelled His first message? Or could it be that the voice that spoke to one of them was in fact not that of God the Creator, or All Knowing and Merciful?

Would the God who knows the worth of His creation order the destruction of one of His most important masterpieces -the hand- for the sake of **property **damage?

And since mohamads allah is “all knowing”, it’s known that you must eat with your right hand and only use your left hand for “bathroom” duties. When allah ordered the hand to be removed, that means the poor soul must eat and wipe with the same hand.

Isn’t that against islam to eat and wipe with the same hand.

It sounds like allah isn’t “all knowing” after all and neither is he merciful. Not only did mohamads allah leave the person who stole with only one usable hand, but now this person cannot do anything in his/hers life with only one limb.

Punishment has always played an integral part in the concept of justice. We all know or at least expect that if you do something wrong you are subject to punishment in some way or another. This is only fair.Humankind is charged with the responsibility for the choices they make.

Muslims care less for the callous and continual thief than they do for the poor souls who are mugged and robbed and hurt by the thieves.
Their point is that the cutting of the hand for theft is a very powerful deterrent

 

[qui_est_ce]

I wanted to comment on this Christinie, if I may, which you know I will…

t’s not communications that will “be the end of islam”, but I feel it’s denial and not finding the truth because they are not allowed to question.

There are many who converted to the Catholic Church by their research to proove the Catholic Church wrong. Scott Hahn and Jeff Cavins come to mind.

And to your second point, I do not believe they are “shocked” at all. They concur with every action and behavior of mohamads.

You might be right here, goes with no emotions. One cannot be shocked if one has no feelings.

And to point #3, the pbuh thing, it’s all well and good, but it’s a robotic saying over and over and over and over and it results to nothing.

It’s part of the culture.

I will close with this…

**‘‘For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.**

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son."

John 3:16-18

Love one another as I have loved you. God bless you Pam.

 

[qui_est_ce]

Punishment has always played an integral part in the concept of justice. We all know or at least expect that if you do something wrong you are subject to punishment in some way or another. This is only fair.Humankind is charged with the responsibility for the choices they make.

Muslims care less for the callous and continual thief than they do for the poor souls who are mugged and robbed and hurt by the thieves.
Their point is that the cutting of the hand for theft is a very powerful deterrent

What is your opinion of “enhanced interrogation techniques?” Should they be tougher?