Are Muslims Worshipping the same God as the Jews & Christians?

[eOxy]

Orthodox Christians don’t worship the same God with Jews and Muslims, Roman Catholics and Protestants.

I am not sure if we worship the same God with Oriental Orthodox, but I believe we do.

 

[Qoeleth]

mmmmmmmm you mention you are a catholic, is this sort of new catholicism? Are you defecting from the papal authority and forming your own? Because your writings amazed me. What is Jesus to You?

Jesus is the Messiah, the Christ, the confirmer of the Torah, and the bringer of the Gospel of mercy and compassion. This is perfectly Catholic. It is also in the Koran.

Catholics and Muslims certainly disagree on some theological points. But we agree on most points of moral law. And it is how well we follow such laws, rather than the correctness of our theology, that we will be judged. And this is what matters most, since:
“He will requite each according to his deeds.” (Koran 21:94)
“He will requite each according to his deeds.” (Matt 16:27)

After all, ''the only way we know God is by keeping his Commandments." (1 John 2:3) So, instead of disputing theology, “following the commands, and teaching others to do the same.” (Matt 5:19) Sadly, I think our Muslim brothers are often doing so much better in this regard than us.

 

[NoWings]

Orthodox Christians don’t worship the same God with Jews and Muslims, Roman Catholics and Protestants.

I am not sure if we worship the same God with Oriental Orthodox, but I believe we do.

Wow…

LOL

 

[crazzeto]

The Qur’an was memorized and even today, we have people who know the entire Qur’an by heart…At the time of the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH), he would receive a revelation, then he memorized it and taught it to the Sahabas (his companions)… Show me the evidence where Aisha (peace be upon her) made such a statement?

So even if alll the copies of the Qur’an in the world today is burnt, the Qur’an is still alive in this world… because of memorization… an Average muslim child of less than 6 years old knows at least 10-15 chapters of the Qur’an by heart… So your accusation is invalid.

You can start by reading this

answeringmuslims.com/2008/12/aisha-and-ubayy-ibn-kab-on-100-verses.html

More over, think about what you just said and compare that to the well known history that there were in fact many different Qur’an’s at the time. Each city has it’s own Qur’an, and then someone who was not inspired by God came up with this own and used his political office to enforce that is the official Qur’an.

 

[jakasaki]

Originally Posted by A_Lion_Of_Islam
Who did he borrow scriptures from and why would he need to? I havent seen a single proof to your statements… much of what you say is personal opinion which is not valid in an intelligent conversation… so show us the proof of your statements just like I have in most of my posts…

I haven’t seen any proof in your posts.

I’ve also asked numerous times why one should believe Muhammad is a prophet of God when he contradicts previous scriptures. The best response I’ve received so far is that he was trustworthy in business. Somehow I don’t think that qualifies someone for prophethood. That question and discussion is (I think) in one of the Question about Islam threads (Round 4, maybe ???). You can dig that thread out if you would like to contribute your thoughts.

As to your question above regarding Muhammad “borrowing scriptures”, there was also a whole thread on this topic.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=361136

If you would like to read it and then comment, feel free. As jakasaki said, many of these topics have already been discussed. You just need to search the threads and then you can add whatever comments you would like to the appropriate thread to continue the discussion.

Lion of islam:

Have you had a chance to read the thread that Jay53 posted above?

 

[Geremia]

Muhammad (PBUH) did not write the Qur’an… God revealed the Qur’an to Muhammad (PBUH)…

I would like to see a point-by-point refutation of St. Thomas’s characterization of Islam in an earlier post on this thread.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

How did I miss this??

Orthodox Christians don’t worship the same God with Jews and Muslims, Roman Catholics and Protestants.

I have heard a lot of weird things said about Orthodox Christians since I joined this forum, but this just takes the cake. Wowzers!

Uh lessee…Orthodox Christians believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit in the strictly most Trinitarian sense, we believe Christ is divine, died on the cross, and everything else that the Nicene Creed says, etc etc etc…yeah, it seems that we worship the same God as Roman Catholics and Protestants, probably even more than Jews and Muslims.

Indeed. Recently I was telling someone on PM that I was feeling guilty that many of my debates seem to involve me continually asking someone to cite their source or present evidence, but then I realized that the reason I do so is because the majority of the time the other person doesn’t present their evidence, or doesn’t cite a source. I’m always willing, upon request, to say from which passage of the Bible, Quran, hadith, or any other source that I got my information from. I only ask others be willing to do the same.

 

[crazzeto]

How did I miss this??

I have heard a lot of weird things said about Orthodox Christians since I joined this forum, but this just takes the cake. Wowzers!

Uh lessee…Orthodox Christians believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit in the strictly most Trinitarian sense, we believe Christ is divine, died on the cross, and everything else that the Nicene Creed says, etc etc etc…yeah, it seems that we worship the same God as Roman Catholics and Protestants, probably even more than Jews and Muslims.

Indeed. Recently I was telling someone on PM that I was feeling guilty that many of my debates seem to involve me continually asking someone to cite their source or present evidence, but then I realized that the reason I do so is because the majority of the time the other person doesn’t present their evidence, or doesn’t cite a source. I’m always willing, upon request, to say from which passage of the Bible, Quran, hadith, or any other source that I got my information from. I only ask others be willing to do the same.

Citation is always a very good idea… I admit to having been guilty of not always doing this as readily as I should, though at least I almost always do with regard to biblical passages and Cetechism references.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

I remember Googling one of hamba’s posts and finding it on Answering Christianity, which had in fact ripped it off wikipedia. It’s sad when people can’t seem to think for themselves and have to rely on others to make the argument for them.

When I was Muslim, I briefly attended a mosque in Hampton, VA run by two gentlemen. One was an elderly professor who was actually very nice, very kind, very knowledgeable, and had a huge affect on my joining the faith. The other was a younger convert who seemed nice at first, but soon I realized he was borderline Nation of Islam and was big into anti-government/anti-American stuff. As my father was a high ranking military officer with experience in military and government affairs, I knew most of what this guy said was false (and also took great offense to it). He’d make claims that, when I researched them, I found were only a half truth. If you disagreed with him he would talk over you in a louder voice, even if it was in a group discussion, which is a major pet peeve of mine. Eventually I stopped going to the mosque and moved on to the one in Norfolk.

If the first man was helpful in my journey to Islam, the second man was helpful in my journey out of it. He wasn’t the sole reason I left, mind you, but it is people like him who hurt the cause. This is why, as I’ve said many times on this forum, I feel sorry for Muslims like famdigy or hadi who want to discuss Islamic theology in a civil manner but have to post alongside people like planten or hamba, who only hurt their cause. If I went to a Muslim forum and posted alongside Christians who acted the way planten or hamba did, I would be humiliated.

That was something else I was feeling guilty about lately - that I seem to constantly point out logical fallacies in my opponents. Then I realized that the reason I do so often is because my opponents seem to use logical fallacies so often.

 

[jakasaki]

I missed that post (eOxy)as well ~

Jharek Carnelian…

 

[schaick]

Muhammad (PBUH) did not write the Qur’an… God revealed the Qur’an to Muhammad (PBUH)…

“And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed from time to time to Our servant, then produce a Sura like thereunto; and call your witnesses or helpers (if there are any) besides Allah, if your (doubts) are true.” (Holy Qur’an 2:23)

It is simply one man’s word that he received revelations from an angel of allah.

Mohammad has no proof, no eyewitnesses, no miracles and no one else receiving “revelations” to bolster his claim.

 

[schaick]

As Ecumenical Council’s are infallible, I would suggest they have greater insight into the matter than any of us. In fact the documents say that the Muslims Claim (though nothing about actually posessing) the same faith as Abraham.

Please explain - Does this mean they have read the Quran, studied hadith; prayed about it or both?

You can not try and exclude the Muslims without also excluding the Jews at the exact same time

I disagree-

We have adopted Old Testament Jewish Scripture. Muslims even though their Quran says otherwise says both our Scriptures have been corrupted.

Our Scripture[New Testament] quotes Old Testament Scripture. The Quran changes the stories that it copies from the Old Testament.

Jews do not deny the Jesus was crucified. Muslims deny the crucifixion.

There is only one being that would want us to deny that Jesus was crucified.

 

[schaick]

In the name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful…

Some of the posters here do not seem to know the Koran, or even the Bible in any detail. Please study them before making and conclusion.

The only significant difference between Christianity and Islam is a different understanding of the status of Jesus. The Koran describes him as the Messiah, born of the Virgin Mary. Muslims believe he will come again at the end of time. The Gospel’s ascribe the title of ‘Son of God’ to Jesus, but clearly do not mean it in the sense of physical conception, but rather implying a favoured relationship. This misunderstanding is the heart of the the division. But what does it matter? What is important is the moral teachings of Jesus, not whether he was simply the Messiah, or the Son of God.

Pretty much all the moral teachings of Christianity and Islam are identical- except Muslims are a bit liberal when it comes to divorce and marriage. Everything else is the same.

I think Western so-called Christian governments should learn from the governments of Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc. about the importance of enforcing public morality.

Best wishes to all

Muslims define Messiah as simply annointed. Christians and Jews define Messiah as a deliverer.

Jesus did not teach:
9.5 But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem; but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.
9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

Jesus did not teach that this was the only sure way to reach paradise:
9.111 Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs is the garden: they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur’an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.

When reading the Quran everyone must remember that allah send a verse and then later send a similar or better verse.

The Quran is not written in chronological order. The peaceful verses are the earlier verses and all the violent verses are from later.

 

[KathleenGee]

I think Muslims living here who are anti-American, anti-government, should move back to their origins…they are very dangerous and do not understand other people very well…and are very ungrateful to be so insulting to this country that shelters and feeds them…

These Muslims have no honor.

 

[eOxy]

There is nothing wrong with the practice of the said Antiochian Orthodox priest. It would be wrong only if he would offer eucharist to them.

I’ll simply disregard this remark of yours.

I’ll simply disregard this one, too.

The fact is, suspecting about the attitude of an Antiochian priest and knowledge of Jakasaki’s and BW’s position simply aren’t criterion of Orthodoxy to me.

 

[eOxy]

How did I miss this??

I have heard a lot of weird things said about Orthodox Christians since I joined this forum, but this just takes the cake. Wowzers!

Uh lessee…Orthodox Christians believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit in the strictly most Trinitarian sense, we believe Christ is divine, died on the cross, and everything else that the Nicene Creed says, etc etc etc…yeah, it seems that we worship the same God as Roman Catholics and Protestants, probably even more than Jews and Muslims.

lessee…

The understanding of procession of the Third Person of the Holy Trinity as revealed to the Apostoles and defined by the Nicean-Constantinoplean Creed is perverted by insertion of filioque, which was never revealed to anyone, but is a consequence of feeble human wisdom.

BTW, Christ is both divine and human, I hope RCs and Protestants don’t share your mistake.

This is the difference, apart from similarities you listed.

If I would look for similarities, I’ll definitely point that Muslims remember that Christ will come to kill Antichrist / Dajail and I can’t find anything to theologically oppose their expectation of Mahdi. He will come to them, not to us.

Apart from that, there are similarities between Satanist and Christian belief, for instance the worship of one Father. Do you worship the same God with them, too?

 

[KathleenGee]

And Jesus Christ is not coming back to America, or Iran, or anywhere else in this world.

Instead at the end, He will give us a new heaven and new earth.

 

[eOxy]

Done deal.

 

[eOxy]

And Jesus Christ is not coming back to America, or Iran, or anywhere else in this world.

Instead at the end, He will give us a new heaven and new earth.

Indeed.

The Heavenly Kingdom has been promised to us.

Muslims believe they will retain the Earth. I won’t argue with them. I hope for Heavenly Kingdom.

BTW, there is no mention of Rome in Heavenly Kingdom. No mention at all. Neither it is mentioned Christ will discharge his vicar on earth during His Second Coming.

Why is that so?

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

lessee…

The understanding of procession of the Third Person of the Holy Trinity as revealed to the Apostoles and defined by the Nicean-Constantinoplean Creed is perverted by insertion of filioque, which was never revealed to anyone, but is a consequence of feeble human wisdom.

I do not see the filioque as being a sign that myself and Catholic brothers and sisters do not worship the same God. This is a matter of the procession that the Trinity that, I personally believe, has more to do with confusion of words than it does the core of our Trinitarian belief, which is equal in both the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox churches.

BTW, Christ is both divine and human, I hope RCs and Protestants don’t share your mistake.

Orthodox believe Christ is both divine and human. In just a few days I’ll be posting on my blog a writing by St. Maximos the Confessor (the fellow in my avatar) where he affirms the dual wills of Christ. The only reason I said “Christ is divine” and did not elucidate on His human nature or will is because that’s a given for even the most heretical of groups. Muslims and Jews, for example, believe Christ was merely a man. Christians believe Him to be something more. Furthermore, this is something that Catholics and Protestants agree with.

Apart from that, there are similarities between Satanist and Christian belief, for instance the worship of one Father. Do you worship the same God with them, too?

I truly now have no idea what you mean now. Of course we do not worship God with Satan. We worship God with no one else. We worship God alone. The same for Catholics and Protestants.