Please go back and read my post. That’s exactly the outlook I am against. When you are against abortion except in cases of rape or incest you aren’t saying that abortion is wrong, you’re saying that if a pregnancy isn’t the women’s fault then she doesn’t deserve to be "punished’ or ‘burdned’ with a child. But if she dared to have sex, then she deserves what she gets. That outlook is anti-woman, anti-child, and disgusting.Children are punishment?
So it is better to murder the child so as to not punish the woman?
No words can express my horror at this mindset.
See that is where Catholics are consistent because we believe contraceptives are wrong as well. We accept the fertility level we have no matter what it is and make a decision based on that information whether to have sex or not. Every act of sex is an acceptance of the chance of creating life at that point or should be.That being said I am pro-choice. I just hate the hypocrisy in the abortion is wrong unless the woman didn’t deserve to get pregnant stance. Children are not a punishment and should not be portrayed as such.
That is certainly not the pro-life position. The posion of the Catholic Church is that abortion is wrong in all circumstances.That being said I am pro-choice. I just hate the hypocrisy in the abortion is wrong unless the woman didn’t deserve to get pregnant stance. Children are not a punishment and should not be portrayed as such.
UOTE=vera dicere;8816795]The primary reason I’ve heard from vegans about this point, is that humans are not endangered and so its better for the planet to kill a human foetus. I pointed out that chickens are not endangered either… and their agrument falls through.
I do not know how many vegans you do know but you would not hear that from anyone on our CAF group “Catholic Vegans & Vegetarians” and I am acquainted with other vegans who do not think in that way.
I"m a proud, animal meat eating Pro-Lifer, but I do admit with some annoyance that a lot of meat eaters today really do themselves a diservice. THere’s so much ignorance out there. And factory farming is just repugnant. Those animals live a horrible life trapped in small cages unable to turn around properly, living in their own filth and perhaps even the corpses of their animal friends and family. If I’m going to eat an animal, I want to know it had a happy life, doing what it was meant to do, free, outside in the open. Not cooped up spreading disease in some heck hole.And having grown up on a farm, I know exactly how to butcher and would do so to ensure my dinner died quickly and as painlessly as possible, withtout overt suffering.
I understand, and I agree that vegans should be pro-life. I just disagree with equating veganism as their reason for it. Just as I disagree with holding Catholic beliefs responsible for one Catholics actions. Being vegan doesn’t make one a dehumanizer anymore than being Catholic makes one a pedophile. Corrupt people with issues become Catholics. Corrupt people with issues become vegans. Being vegan doesn’t give one corrupt issues.I’m simply holding them to their own alleged standards. Rationalizing, ignoring the facts, and pretending = dehumanization.
If the truth is graphic, then what does that say about the act? Does the act not exist simply because we choose to ignore it because we find it to be disturbing or inconvenient? Does the struggle of a 2 inch long fetus deprived of it’s oxygen supply not exist if the woman doesn’t witness it? Sorry, but those who choose to run and hide from these facts can’t possibly claim to be enlightened and open-minded. They’re believing the secular propagandized message.I am not sure about giving graphic details of late term abortion.
FWIW, I don’t eat veal for the reasons you listed and I’m becoming more vegetarian. That’s what prompted my discernment. Thanks for the post.The primary reason I’ve heard from vegans about this point, is that humans are not endangered and so its better for the planet to kill a human foetus. I pointed out that chickens are not endangered either… and their agrument falls through.
I"m a proud, animal meat eating Pro-Lifer, but I do admit with some annoyance that a lot of meat eaters today really do themselves a diservice. THere’s so much ignorance out there. And factory farming is just repugnant. Those animals live a horrible life trapped in small cages unable to turn around properly, living in their own filth and perhaps even the corpses of their animal friends and family. If I’m going to eat an animal, I want to know it had a happy life, doing what it was meant to do, free, outside in the open. Not cooped up spreading disease in some heck hole.
And having grown up on a farm, I know exactly how to butcher and would do so to ensure my dinner died quickly and as painlessly as possible, withtout overt suffering.
I just hate the hypocrisy of how some people think it’s acceptable to show the graphic details of a cute bunny getting sprayed with an aerosol can, but run away from the graphic details of what’s involved with a late term abortion of a human. The hypocrisy and bigotry.That being said I am pro-choice. I just hate the hypocrisy in the abortion is wrong unless the woman didn’t deserve to get pregnant stance. Children are not a punishment and should not be portrayed as such.
I don’t understand how a group of such extremely conscientious people (vegans) comes to have such an uber respect for the struggle of animals first and foremost more than the struggle of a human. You agree than vegans should be pro-life, so it sounds like you agree with me. If they are so extremely conscientious, and that character trait led them to veganism, then their first order of business should have been caring for humans, then animals, IMO.I understand, and I agree that vegans should be pro-life. I just disagree with equating veganism as their reason for it. Just as I disagree with holding Catholic beliefs responsible for one Catholics actions. Being vegan doesn’t make one a dehumanizer anymore than being Catholic makes one a pedophile. Corrupt people with issues become Catholics. Corrupt people with issues become vegans. Being vegan doesn’t give one corrupt issues.
No one is trying to run from the facts. t just serves no purpose here and really, have graphic descriptions and pictures of people being torn apart in war stopped war?If the truth is graphic, then what does that say about the act? Does the act not exist simply because we choose to ignore it because we find it to be disturbing or inconvenient? Does the struggle of a 2 inch long fetus deprived of it’s oxygen supply not exist if the woman doesn’t witness it? Sorry, but those who choose to run and hide from these facts can’t possibly claim to be enlightened and open-minded. They’re believing the secular propagandized message.
Now I have to ask this, but have you or has anyone else here actually been to a factory farm recently and seen these conditions yourself? I have talked with people who actually have been around to these places recently and they do not tell the same story PETA does by any stretch of the imagination. Conditions have changed a lot in 20 years.I"m a proud, animal meat eating Pro-Lifer, but I do admit with some annoyance that a lot of meat eaters today really do themselves a diservice. THere’s so much ignorance out there. And factory farming is just repugnant. Those animals live a horrible life trapped in small cages unable to turn around properly, living in their own filth and perhaps even the corpses of their animal friends and family. If I’m going to eat an animal, I want to know it had a happy life, doing what it was meant to do, free, outside in the open. Not cooped up spreading disease in some heck hole.
Are you claiming that educating the public serves no purpose? Do you prefer that the public be ignorant rather than educated and enlightened? Are you willing to make the fair, equal, and parallel claim that the video of spraying a bunny with an aerosol can also served no purpose?No one is trying to run from the facts. t just serves no purpose here and really, have graphic descriptions and pictures of people being torn apart in war stopped war?
Were you posting to educate the person you were responding to or the rest of us here? Yes, the public should be enlightened, a girl/woman thinking about abortion may well change her mind on realising what is done. I did not see any purpose of posting that to those who are well aware of the facts.Are you claiming that educating the public serves no purpose? Do you prefer that the public be ignorant rather than educated and enlightened? Are you willing to make the fair, equal, and parallel claim that the video of spraying a bunny with an aerosol can also served no purpose?
I can say that, yes, I have been to a local factory farm in the last 5 years. I was on an electrical service call because the panels were having some kind of ‘malfunction.’ It turns out that the high level of ammonia in the air was corroding the copper and aluminum in the panels and literally destroying them. The air the animals were breathing was ‘eating’ metal. Imagine what that would do to the animals themselves?Now I have to ask this, but have you or has anyone else here actually been to a factory farm recently and seen these conditions yourself? I have talked with people who actually have been around to these places recently and they do not tell the same story PETA does by any stretch of the imagination. Conditions have changed a lot in 20 years.
Well considering that the thread has been clicked a few hundred tiimes, we can’t assume that everyone knows what is involved in late term abortions.Were you posting to educate the person you were responding to or the rest of us here? Yes, the public should be enlightened, a girl/woman thinking about abortion may well change her mind on realising what is done. I did not see any purpose of posting that to those who are well aware of the facts.