Are there any members of the Episcopal Church out there?

[PickyPicky]

I haven’t been around Methodists enough to make a comment on the liturgies, beyond that I have seen, on the few occasions I’ve been in a Methodist service, some of the bones of Anglican liturgy. And in older Methodist hymnals, a selection of the Articles, recognizably.

Motley, no doubt. But the genes still are visible, in places

And of course Anglicans as well as Methodists have been blessed by the legacy of superb Wesleyan hymns.

 

[blackforest]

Catholic Social Teaching

Could you and/or @Padres1969 clarify something? This is Catholic Social Teaching. Are you both referring specifically to pro-life teaching, specifically on abortion and euthanasia? From what I know about the Episcopal Church USA, at least the last 6 tenets of it are compatible with it.

I’ve met a couple of former Catholics in the Episcopal Church who were disheartened by the sexual abuse scandals.

 

[AlbMagno]

how existing Methodist ministers, who have of course not been ordained by bishops, could exercise their ministry in the Anglican part of the proposed reunited Church

Couldn’t the be “re-ordained” by the Anglican bishops?

 

[davidharper]

I read Spong’s book a long time ago. Having been raised in the RCC his book addressed a lot of issues which had been bothering me about catholic teaching. The one I remember now was about the word “virgin” as it appears in Isiah 7; 14 “behold a virgin shall bear a child”. It always seemed odd to me that the word would be in the verse. The words “young woman” make much more sense. I think the word “virgin” was a later catholic insertion at the occasion of the translation of the original ancient hebrew into the greek Septuagint. In any case, I left the RCC 40 years ago. My impression of the Episcopal church is that it accepts the findings of modern bible scholarship. Is this correct? Or if not, what is the basic teaching?

 

[Deditus_Domina]

Yes, abortion, being the main social teaching along with moral teachings on sexuality.

I was speaking about local experience as well - we were still trying to figure out girl acolytes at the time and were a bit amazed by the stuff promoted by the former Catholics among us.

While the values which fall into the realm of “Catholic Social Teaching “ are also in line with Episcopal tradition it was expressed in terms of service and noblesse oblige. As an Episcopalian I had no philosophical or catechetical formation in any social teaching and no known resource to turn to. You treated your workers well because it showed you were a benevolent person not because the worker had any inherent rights that the church acknowledged.

 

[GKMotley]

Don’t think so. It could be, maybe, conditionally ordained. Which wouldn’t be satisfactory to the Methodists, I’d think.

 

[ltwin]

My impression of the Episcopal church is that it accepts the findings of modern bible scholarship. Is this correct? Or if not, what is the basic teaching?

Many within the Episcopal Church would definitely embrace a liberal biblical hermeneutic. The problem is that sometimes they go too far and treat the Bible as just another ancient book that can be interpreted as if its a garden variety piece of literature with which we are free to reject the parts we disagree with.

Katherine Jefferts Schori, the former presiding bishop, once infamously preached a sermon on Acts 16:16-34. This is the story of Paul exorcising an evil spirit from a slave girl (whose owners were exploiting her demonic possession for profit). Schori’s feminist take on this sermon was that:

“Paul is annoyed at the slave girl,” Bishop Jefferts Schori preached. “She’s telling the same truth Paul and others claim for themselves. But Paul is annoyed, perhaps for being put in his place, and he responds by depriving her of her gift of spiritual awareness. Paul can’t abide something he won’t see as beautiful or holy, so he tries to destroy it.”

(From “For Episcopal Church’s Leader, a Sermon Leads to More Dissent”, New York Times)

So, Schori and the many Episcopalians in her liberal camp fall into the trap of seeing bondage to sin and evil as “spiritual awareness” and liberation from that sin as intolerance. They also seem completely unmoored from the greater Christian interpretive tradition, and the result is nonsense like the above.

 

[PickyPicky]

Couldn’t the be “re-ordained” by the Anglican bishops?

Don’t think so. It could be, maybe, conditionally ordained. Which wouldn’t be satisfactory to the Methodists, I’d think

@GKMotley has it right. Methodists might accept that ordination by bishops in apostolic succession is a gift of God to His Church (as the Church of England has been known to put it) but not that their existing Methodist orders are invalid and in need of re-ordination.

Both Churches have accepted that

one another’s ordained and lay ministries are given by God as instruments of God’s grace, to build up the people of God in faith, hope and love, for the ministry of word, sacrament and pastoral care and to share in God’s mission in the world.

but episcopal ordination is most certainly required as a matter of Church order by the CofE. Nonetheless, both Churches believe unity to be required.

 

[GKMotley]

Possibly the circle may be squared. Maybe.

 

[AlNg]

Do Episcopalians pray to the Mother of God?

 

[GKMotley]

Depends. Some likely don’t. Some likely pray Rosaries. Some will chant the Angelus. Some won’t.

Same for the more generic concept “Anglicans”.

 

[commenter]

Considering those who convert to Episcopalian…

Is it more common for people to come in because the TEC has more of what they are looking for?

Or do more of them come in because they find it has less of stuff they don’t want (dogmas, moral absolutes, perceived extra cultural “baggage”)?

My guess is that Protestants enter from the first group, Catholics from the second. I wonder if any come in with no Christian background.

 

[EOvsRC1054]

I would say it depends on which type if Anglican or Episcopalian someone is. The Anglo-Catholic tradition still holds Mary and the Saints in high regard and the Hail Mary is said and prayer to her is encouraged.
But, since Anglicanism is very broad in practice, it would depend on a personal preference.

 

[blackforest]

I grew up Anglican and reciting Hail Mary in a Church that believed in the seven sacraments. But Anglicans come in all shapes and sizes.

As an Episcopalian I had no philosophical or catechetical formation in any social teaching and no known resource to turn to. You treated your workers well because it showed you were a benevolent person not because the worker had any inherent rights that the church acknowledged.

Interesting. As a Catholic, I have a love-hate relationship with dogma. It’s a dirty word in our culture. But to the extent that it can provide guidance and clarity, it can be a good thing, as well.

 

[GKMotley]

I grew up Anglican and reciting Hail Mary in a Church that believed in the seven sacraments. But Anglicans come in all shapes and sizes.

Motley, they be.

 

[AlNg]

Do Episcopalians believe in Purgatory or in indulgences?

 

[GKMotley]

It is likely you could find an Anglo-Papalist who believes in both, but the concept of purgation as a process/event (rather than a place and duration ) is certainly known among some Anglicans.

Others, not so much.

If the question is restricted to Episcopalians, formally defined, then…it depends.

 

[EOvsRC1054]

I don’t think indulgences since that was a large disagreement between Catholics and Protestants during the Reformation. I think no, since the papacy is the agency that issues the indulgences.
For matters of purgatory, that still depends on the person.