Are we that out of touch?

[palmas85]

Where y’at, Palmas? I know that if I said to you I’m going to Jesuit’s for confession, you’ld know. Got my 40th reunion in two weeks. It has me thinking hard.

Yeah, it is still a good place to go on Sunday evening for the late Mass when all the kids show up. Nothing out of place over there and they seem to getting more and more conservative as time goes by. No dancers or innovations or anything like that. Latin seems to predominate in the responses as well as the Gloria and the Sanctus. The kids all seem orthodox, dressed conservatively and behaving in a proper and most respectful manner as does almost everyone else there. And I haven’t yet seen Lifeteen rear its head down there on Barrone.

So, maybe there is a lot of hope for the next generation coming up.

Hope that your reunion goes well old friend.

 

[brotherhrolf]

Phemie, really, no, Low Masses were silent. But Sunday Masses were High Masses at 8, 10, and 12. The main mass for my parish was the 10 and it could be a dialogue High Mass or a Solemn High Mass depending upon the time of the year. I would never have learned all the chants if I had not been exposed to it. Its what we sang.

I have a young friend here who is pretty much a technical expert on such things. I will pm him. I seem to remember that the US had an indult for the sung masses.

Lizanne, I saw my parents (and our neighbors - 8 out of the fourteen houses on the block were Catholic) marginalized. They ended up at the Vigil Mass on Saturday. I’ll leave it at that.

Palmas, that gives me great comfort. I had hoped to rent a room for the reunion and take oldest son to St. Pat’s for High Mass. The Royal Orleans wanted over $200 a night. Feggetaboutit. We’ll just have to wake up early one Sunday and drive down.

 

[rpp]

also if you really want to have it a language Jesus spoke we should have the mass in aeramic not latin. Jesus never spoke latin the only reason we had it was because it was the world language at the time.

If that is what you want, then you should consider the Maronite Rite. They use Aramaic in their liturgy.

 

[rpp]

dialog mass? sorry i have been going to church for awhile now and i have never been to a mass where you have a dialog with the priest. if you mean the prayers for the intentions thats hardly a dialog. and what great evil did vat II do? i think it made the church more modern. you really want to have all the prayers in a language no one has spoken for thousands of years?

Latin has not been spoken as a language for only a few hundred years, not “thousands”.

Next, actually I think it is great that an old and “dead” language. Just look at how the English language has evolved and changed, where words mean different thing now than they did a generation or a hundred years ago. Latin does not change. That makes it idea to convey ideas in a consistent manner over the centuries.

 

[Love_is_Patient]

As a young adult Catholic, I just want to say I envy all of you who got to experience life before the Novus Ordo Mass, all the beautiful devotions and unity and reverence.

But, I know lots of people of my generation who long for holiness and reverence. I hope to see a revival of pre-1960s faith. There are reasons for hope; three women wear mantillas at my NO parish in a liberal town.

Love is Patient

 

[John_Higgins]

It’s good to see my fellow class of late 60s high schoolers having this discussion.

I served the Latin Mass and the hybrid and was excited by all the changes. I still am. I love the vernacular Mass. I am an EMHC and a lector (Don’t bother to tell me that’s a minor order, you know what I meant).

I’m a member of one of the largest parishes in Chicago and I’m delighted with our NO parish. I hope everybody gets fed at a liturgy that means the most to them.

Blessings, y’all.

John

 

[bostonboy23]

I am amazed. An eyewitness to the life of Christ!!:extrahappy:

Just think of all the questions that could be answered by our friend bostonboy:thumbsup:

Seriously though.

I somehow doubt that bostoboy was an eyewitness to the life and times of Jesus and I hardly think that he is an authority on the languages that Jesus spoke or did not speak. The three languages that were predominately spoken in the area in those days would have been Aramaic Greek and Latin. The readings in the Temple would have been written in Hebrew. It is entirely possible that Jesus spoke or had a knowledge of all four of them. Scripture doesn’t tell us and we really don’t know.
.
So I think that short of an eyewitness account, sorry bostonboy,but that isn’t you:tsktsk:, we really should not be making claims about which languages Jesus did or did not speak.

He wasn’t a roman citizen so he had no reason to speak that. and isn’t the area where he grew up supposedly very uneducated? so i think the only language he would of learned would of been the local one. you don’t have to be an eyewitness to use logic and reason. also it really doesn’t matter how many or which languages were spoken by the apostles and Jesus. thats the only point i was trying to make.

 

[bostonboy23]

As a young adult Catholic, I just want to say I envy all of you who got to experience life before the Novus Ordo Mass, all the beautiful devotions and unity and reverence.

But, I know lots of people of my generation who long for holiness and reverence. I hope to see a revival of pre-1960s faith. There are reasons for hope; three women wear mantillas at my NO parish in a liberal town.

Love is Patient

the mass didn’t change. the mass can’t change first off otherwise we wouldn’t have a mass. think of vat II as adding a new coat of paint to your house. its still the same house just looks different. also i for one would like to know what im talking about so im glad we use a language we can understand rather then something that is very very hard to learn. I went to a crowning mass for mary tonight and we sang ave maria. seriously who the heck can pronounce these words. also its good too that they changed it because people then were just blindly saying things no one had a clue what they were saying. you could be saying hail satan and no one would know.

 

[bostonboy23]

A dialog Mass is what we have now: the priest says something, we respond. Before Vat. II my only experience was a silent assembly with the altar servers giving all of the responses. I know that in other places the assembly gave the responses but in the parishes in my diocese it was only the altar servers.

so you would rather be like a statue and just sit there? and the only time you respond to the priest is before communion when we give the sign of peace and at the beginning with the kyrie. oh and when we sing agnus dei or lamb of god.

 

[rpp]

the mass didn’t change. the mass can’t change first off otherwise we wouldn’t have a mass. think of vat II as adding a new coat of paint to your house. its still the same house just looks different. also i for one would like to know what im talking about so im glad we use a language we can understand rather then something that is very very hard to learn. I went to a crowning mass for mary tonight and we sang ave maria. seriously who the heck can pronounce these words. also its good too that they changed it because people then were just blindly saying things no one had a clue what they were saying. you could be saying hail satan and no one would know.

so you would rather be like a statue and just sit there? and the only time you respond to the priest is before communion when we give the sign of peace and at the beginning with the kyrie. oh and when we sing agnus dei or lamb of god.

I am a little confused. In the first post you said the Mass did not change, then in the second you express you appreciation for the changes.

Aside from being off-topic, your posts are not even consistent. It is important to keep in mind that Mass is not intended to be a performance. It is intended to guide people to worship and meditate on the Lord, not entertain.

Again, I would remind you that this topic is about the experiences of those who went through the changes in the Mass and the rest of the Church in the 1960s and 1970s. If you do not have experience to share, then you will not be able to post on this topic.

Off-topic posts and hijacking threads is forbidden on this well moderated forum.

 

[shuzo1189]

Ill just say that one of my biggest draw’s to the EF is the silence that comes with the Low Mass. Being a Teen-Ager its just nice to find an oasis of tranquility. I always found it semi insulting this notion that the mass needs to be watered down and made more engaging to appeal to College Students (Like the Super-Soaker Jesuit at Rochester or the Call to Action masses in Vienna).

In a world continually changing its nice to have a Rock of Gibraltar

 

[rpp]

Ill just say that one of my biggest draw’s to the EF is the silence that comes with the Low Mass. Being a Teen-Ager its just nice to find an oasis of tranquility. I always found it semi insulting this notion that the mass needs to be watered down and made more engaging to appeal to College Students (Like the Super-Soaker Jesuit at Rochester or the Call to Action masses in Vienna).

In a world continually changing its nice to have a Rock of Gibraltar

Thank you. It is refreshing to hear this from a young person.

 

[grandfather]

the mass didn’t change. the mass can’t change first off otherwise we wouldn’t have a mass. think of vat II as adding a new coat of paint to your house. its still the same house just looks different. also i for one would like to know what im talking about so im glad we use a language we can understand rather then something that is very very hard to learn. I went to a crowning mass for mary tonight and we sang ave maria. seriously who the heck can pronounce these words. also its good too that they changed it because people then were just blindly saying things no one had a clue what they were saying. you could be saying hail satan and no one would know.

,
How old are you Boy?

I was born in 47. By the time I was ten years old I knew what was going on at Mass in Latin. So did all of my classmates. We had missals with both languages on the page. We were instructed about every movement in the Mass.

What do you know about what went on and how many people understood it? I was instructed by nuns who loved me and prayed for me and taught me the faith. My wife and I raised four children in the new church and sent them to CCD and they learned zilch. The youngest three are still Catholic, because we woke up and realized if we did not teach them at home they would not learn anything.

The first priest at the local NO parish, the one who built the monstrosity was sentenced to 15 years in prison for raping altar boys. A subesequent pastor was removed from ministry, same perversion. An associate was the founder and editor of a radical gay magazine. The bishop did nothing. The diocese went through bankruptcy. Guess why? At least four other priests from this parish abandoned their vows. There have been four ex-nuns who abandonded their vows hired to run parish programs and another one who married an ex-priest hired to run adult education. Nothing to worry about though, because when the band plays from the altar, the words of the songs are in English and everyone knows what kumbaya means. Yep, everything was a mess back in the dark ages when Catholics were so ignorant they prayed in Latin and they have got it all figured out now that they forgot about the official church language. Halleluiah, enlightenment has arrived and it is in plain English.

 

[shuzo1189]

Thank you. It is refreshing to hear this from a young person.

Thanks! Its honestly seeing the EF Mass and a Reverent Novus Ordo that makes me want to pursue a vocation, only three more years of Undergraduate before i can apply

 

[rpp]

Thanks! Its honestly seeing the EF Mass and a Reverent Novus Ordo that makes me want to pursue a vocation, only three more years of Undergraduate before i can apply

May God bless you as you discern His call. Are you familiar with te FSSP? (Okay, a bit off topic. Sorry.)

 

[dnar]

Hello,

I am planning on visiting the TLM this Saturday for the first time in my life. What does one do? Just sit silently and reverently? I thought I would ask this here because I don’t want to seem like an idiot when I go.

Thank you.

 

[rpp]

Hello,

I am planning on visiting the TLM this Saturday for the first time in my life. What does one do? Just sit silently and reverently? I thought I would ask this here because I don’t want to seem like an idiot when I go.

Thank you.

If you do not have a missal, I would recommend that you sit near the rear of the Church to pick up the clues of what is going on. Frankly, most Latin Mass parishes have missalettes that help with the Latin Mass.

Just remember the purpose of the TLM (EF) Mass is to promote mediation on the Lord and His sacrifice on the cross, not a liturgical performance.

 

[shuzo1189]

May God bless you as you discern His call. Are you familiar with te FSSP? (Okay, a bit off topic. Sorry.)

Yes I am! However i find the Charism of the FSSP while noble rather limited. I think i am going to try for the Dominicans. The Western Province is very conservative and offers Dominican Rite masses throughout the province (My Spiritual Director is one of these Dominicans). I love the focus on Studying and Preaching

 

[WhollyRoamin]

,
How old are you Boy?

I was born in 47. By the time I was ten years old I knew what was going on at Mass in Latin. So did all of my classmates. We had missals with both languages on the page. We were instructed about every movement in the Mass.

What do you know about what went on and how many people understood it? I was instructed by nuns who loved me and prayed for me and taught me the faith. My wife and I raised four children in the new church and sent them to CCD and they learned zilch. The youngest three are still Catholic, because we woke up and realized if we did not teach them at home they would not learn anything.

The first priest at the local NO parish, the one who built the monstrosity was sentenced to 15 years in prison for raping altar boys. A subesequent pastor was removed from ministry, same perversion. An associate was the founder and editor of a radical gay magazine. The bishop did nothing. The diocese went through bankruptcy. Guess why? At least four other priests from this parish abandoned their vows. There have been four ex-nuns who abandonded their vows hired to run parish programs and another one who married an ex-priest hired to run adult education. Nothing to worry about though, because when the band plays from the altar, the words of the songs are in English and everyone knows what kumbaya means. Yep, everything was a mess back in the dark ages when Catholics were so ignorant they prayed in Latin and they have got it all figured out now that they forgot about the official church language. Halleluiah, enlightenment has arrived and it is in plain English.

Huzzah!!

 

[grandfather]

Hello,

I am planning on visiting the TLM this Saturday for the first time in my life. What does one do? Just sit silently and reverently? I thought I would ask this here because I don’t want to seem like an idiot when I go.

Thank you.

Try to find a missal that allows you to at least follow the ordinary of the Mass. Don’t worry about the propers. The pages will be split with English on one side and Latin on the other. There will be a few places for you to respond. If you miss them its ok. You can either try to follow every move and prayer of the priest and understand where in the Mass he is, but having no background and for a first experience that will probably be confusing and maybe frustrating and you will miss the general overall experience, eyes, ears, nose, soul.

If you get a missal or go online and read the prayers before you go you will get some feel of what it is about and probably like the prayers. They are very beautiful and moving. They convey a lot of theology.

If it were me I would just go and calmly watch and not worry about tracking every word and gesture and figuring out the meaning. Soak it in.

When you receive Holy Communion do not respond amen to the priest. Just be silent. It will not be given in the hand.

God bless you.