Are you a Christian or a Catholic

[Usagi]

Here’s my question again. If you are a Roman Catholic who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? If you are a baptized Protestant who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? Isn’t faith in Jesus necessary in order to call yourself a Christian?

It is necessary in order to be saved and join Christ in Heaven.

Whether the saved are the only people who have the right to the name “Christian” on earth is an interesting question.

Catholics tend to cast the net wider than those who believe in “once saved, always saved,” since we do not believe we can actually know who among us will persevere to the end.

We also believe that baptism (whether administered by Catholics or Protestants) imparts a permanent character upon the soul. Even in Hell, they’ll know who was baptized. So the baptized are certainly something worthy of a name. If we don’t want to use Christian, what shall we use? (I guess “the baptized” works…)

Usagi

 

[dnlyle53]

GeminiAngel…my brother is a non-denominational fundamentalist christian. He loves Jesus, and sola scriptura, and sola fida, he loves it his way. Your baptist m-n-l is the same, and she is happy, the Catholic Church doesn’t impugn her beliefs, she is a member of the church, just not a full fledged member. What to do? Just be a servant to them, but never deny Jesus as you know him. If they say something I would very calmly (always) say, the ancient, original teaching on that came from Jesus through the Apostles to us, and it is …the real body, blood, soul, and divinity of our Lord, as an example, not just a symbol. Show them the quote from St Ignatous about this and how the first major erasure of this teaching was by John Calvin because he hated the Catholic church. Do you want to believe what hated bore? Jesus gentle truth is so well founded in scripture it is shameful for a person not to see it, and believe it. Get this one teaching in their face, and challenge them to overturn it with a witness older than 105AD, and if they can’t ask them to simply search for truth. The history of the faith is remarkable. If that isn’t enough just keep praying for the intervention of the Holy Spirit, but be prepared. It is not shameful to have missed this, even in today’s gospel reading Peter was slow to see Jesus until he hauled in a boatload of fish, then he was ashamed. It is for all of us to keep learning of God and living what we learn. You are right, pray and love sinners always.

 

[jake23]

I have heard this question more times than I can stand. It has finally begun to bother me to the point that it is becoming a problem for me. Even “good” Catholics have asked me this.

My question is this: Do you see a dichotomy, or even a break, in whether you are a christian or a Catholic? Also, what would you respond if asked the question “are you a christian first or a Catholic first?” I have gotten this from at least one Catholic and to me there is no difference. That is, to me, akin to asking someone “Are you a man/woman first or a human?”

Just trying to get other thoughts on this.

Pax

FSC

You cannot truely be one unless you are also the other. If one does not already know this then they have yet to have an sincere relationship with the heavenly father.

 

[lutherlic]

The hard part is I have no idea how to respond to this. It shows that they think that to be a “hardcore” or trad-catholic you have to choose whether to follow Christ first or the Church first… I am a convert that cannot understand this false dichotomy which I used to use lol

Of course, there is a lot of common ground but as even a recent convert, Protestantism no longer make sense to me. I just don’t get it.

Perhaps one answer to the OPs question could be “fully Christian”. If the person asking doesn’t understand then it may be a teaching moment.

 

[FidesSpesCarita]

Of course, there is a lot of common ground but as even a recent convert, Protestantism no longer make sense to me. I just don’t get it.

Perhaps one answer to the OPs question could be “fully Christian”. If the person asking doesn’t understand then it may be a teaching moment.

lol, this is actually how I just thought of it. being Catholic is to be FULLY, COMPLETELY, and CORRECTLY Christian. All other Christians live their Christianity incompletely, IMHO. and to call myself Catholic is to say all of the above.

FSC

 

[wisdomseeker]

Of course, there is a lot of common ground but as even a recent convert, Pro****testantism no longer make sense to me. I just don’t get it.

Perhaps one answer to the OPs question could be “fully Christian”. If the person asking doesn’t understand then it may be a teaching moment.

thanks for sharing.

of course it doesnt. Scriptures does not make sense outside the Church. Scriptures without the Church, is another Gospel.

 

[FiberZilla]

Catholicism and Mormonism are ‘christian’ in similar ways. Both use the scriptures and acknowledge them as the Word of God but only allow them to speak through the lense of their traditions. Both add human effort and works to the gospel of grace. Scripture itself forbids this.

“I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!”
(Galatians 1:6-9)

Clearly Catholics and Mormons are sincere, love God and acknowledge Jesus as savior. But are they Christian? In light of Paul’s warning to the Galatians, I’ll let you decide.

 

[Canto]

Catholicism and Mormonism are ‘christian’ in similar ways. Both use the scriptures and acknowledge them as the Word of God but only allow them to speak through the lense of their traditions. Both add human effort and works to the gospel of grace. Scripture itself forbids this.

Catholics hold onto the entire deposit of faith written and spoken. Both is protected from error by the Holy Spirit. This deposit of faith is called tradition (doctrine not disciplines). An example of this tradition is the Canon of Scripture. You won’t find it in the Bible, the Church went outside the Bible for the Canon and decreed a 73 book canon at the Council of Rome in 382 AD. btw there was no 66 book canon before then and the Sadducees accepted only the first 5 books of the Bible rejecting the other 68. St Paul is adamant that we hold onto the traditions handed down, wether written or spoken.

St Paul tells us Jesus will render to us according to our works, reminding us God has created good works for us to walk in, that they are good and profitable and that if we believe in God we should be careful to walk in them and excel in them for necessary uses, so that we don’t become unprofitable. St Peter says they help make sure our calling and election, St James says without them our faith is dead – dead faith does not justify - and yet St Paul notes we can have all faith, even to move mountains, but if there is no charity, which is greater than faith, we are nothing.

So scripture tell us that we are justified by our works and not merely by our faith alone, and it tells us to hold onto tradition. Well I can’t speak for other Christian’s but us Catholics certainly do this. To hold a contrary view is condemned by the Scriptures.

 

[AidanM32]

**. Hello .
Catholic is a type of Christian!

. Aidan .**

 

[wisdomseeker]

Catholicism and Mormonism are ‘christian’ in similar ways. Both use the scriptures and acknowledge them as the Word of God but only allow them to speak through the lense of their traditions. Both add human effort and works to the gospel of grace. Scripture itself forbids this.

“I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!”
(Galatians 1:6-9)

Clearly Catholics and Mormons are sincere, love God and acknowledge Jesus as savior. But are they Christian? In light of Paul’s warning to the Galatians, I’ll let you decide.

Funny, before you ever came to the knowledge of this Passage, the CC has been using this for centuries. so, since you religion came long, long after the CC built by Christ, one can only assume that it is your theology that is another Gospel.

 

[FiberZilla]

St Paul tells us Jesus will render to us according to our works, reminding us God has created good works for us to walk in, that they are good and profitable and that if we believe in God we should be careful to walk in them and excel in them for necessary uses, so that we don’t become unprofitable. St Peter says they help make sure our calling and election, St James says without them our faith is dead – dead faith does not justify - and yet St Paul notes we can have all faith, even to move mountains, but if there is no charity, which is greater than faith, we are nothing.

So scripture tell us that we are justified by our works and not merely by our faith alone, and it tells us to hold onto tradition. Well I can’t speak for other Christian’s but us Catholics certainly do this. To hold a contrary view is condemned by the Scriptures.

Yes, we will be rewarded in Heaven for our good works, not rewarded with Heaven. Good works are an essential part of a saving faith but not the cause of our salvation. Our good works are evidence of a saving faith! This does not contradict James. It affirmes James 2

*"Now when a man works, his wages are not credited to him as a gift, but as an obligation. However, to the man who *does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. David says the same thing when he speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works…" (Romans 4:4-6 )

Using our good works to earn salvation makes God a debtor. God doesn’t owe us anything!We do good works to please him and demonstrate our love for our humanity as we live in humble obedience. Repentence and a hatred of sin is also proof of a saving faith. A lot of evangelical christians miss this point these days. They have a false assurance of salvation.

However, as 1st John declares that we can know: It gives several tests to see if we are in the faith. At the and of the letter John declares:

“I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.” (1 John 5:13)

 

[Canto]

Yes, we will be rewarded in Heaven for our good works, not rewarded with Heaven. Good works are an essential part of a saving faith but not the cause of our salvation. Our good works are evidence of a saving faith!

“Now when a man works, his wages are not credited to him as a gift, but as an obligation. However, to the man who *does not *work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. David says the same thing when he speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works…” (Romans 4:4-6 )

Using our good works to earn salvation makes God a debtor. God doesn’t owe us anything!We do good works to please him and demonstrate our love for our humanity as we live in humble obedience. Repentence and a hatred of sin is also proof of a saving faith.

If we don’t do the good works God has created for us to walk in will we be rewarded with heaven?

Compedium to the Catechism

1. What is merit?

2006-2010
2025-2026

In general merit refers to the right to recompense for a good deed. With regard to God, we of ourselves are not able to merit anything, having received everything freely from him. However, God gives us the possibility of acquiring merit through union with the love of Christ, who is the source of our merits before God. The merits for good works, therefore must be attributed in the first place to the grace of God and then to the free will of man…No one, however, can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion and justification.

 

[FiberZilla]

If we don’t do the good works God has created for us to walk in will we be rewarded with heaven?

Compedium to the Catechism

1. What is merit?

2006-2010
2025-2026

In general merit refers to the right to recompense for a good deed. With regard to God, we of ourselves are not able to merit anything, having received everything freely from him. However, God gives us the possibility of acquiring merit through union with the love of Christ, who is the source of our merits before God. The merits for good works, therefore must be attributed in the first place to the grace of God and then to the free will of man…No one, however, can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion and justification.

If you have no good works, your faith is dead. After all, demons believe and shudder! Good works is evidence of a saving faith, but not the cause. We really aren’t that far apart!

 

[Canto]

If you have no good works, your faith is dead. After all, demons believe and shudder! Good works is evidence of a saving faith, but not the cause. We really aren’t that far apart!

So we are justified by grace through a saving faith
In order to have a faith that saves it has to have good works
They go togther like a horse and carriage
No good works = no saving faith
So good works play a role in our justification
Thus St James says we are justified by works and not by faith alone

 

[palmas85]

I have heard this question more times than I can stand. It has finally begun to bother me to the point that it is becoming a problem for me. Even “good” Catholics have asked me this.

My question is this: Do you see a dichotomy, or even a break, in whether you are a christian or a Catholic? Also, what would you respond if asked the question “are you a christian first or a Catholic first?” I have gotten this from at least one Catholic and to me there is no difference. That is, to me, akin to asking someone “Are you a man/woman first or a human?”

Just trying to get other thoughts on this.

Pax

FSC

Protestants started this trend years ago by saying at Catholics aren’t really Christians because we owe our allegiance to the Pope rather than to Christ. That is also the reason we used to be called and I suppose still are in some areas “cross or statue worshippers”

The distinction was drawn so that they, the protestants groups, would feel that they were the true representatives of Christ and not the Catholic Church.

A Catholic is indeed a Christian. On the other hand however,not all who claim to be Christian actually are.

 

[FiberZilla]

So we are justified by grace through a saving faith
In order to have a faith that saves it has to have good works
They go togther like a horse and carriage
No good works = no saving faith
So good works play a role in our justification
Thus St James says we are justified by works and not by faith alone

That is absolutely correct. However we do not earn Heaven with our works in a sort of “point system”. Romans says that God justifys the wicked not the righteous! Salvation brings with it a transformed life. Our good works, along with repentance, a strong desire to keep the commandments, a hatred for sin, and a deep love for God are evidence all that we have been saved! Any Christian who claims to be saved yet does not demonstrate these characteristics in their personal life probably has a false assurance of salvation. Without a transformed life there is not likely a saving faith.

Modern evangelicalism is riddled with this.

 

[ron77nyc]

A Catholic is indeed a Christian. On the other hand however,not all who claim to be Christian actually are.

Catholics traditionally never called themselves Christians. They called themselves Catholics so Christians would be the non-Catholics believers. Why read any more than that into it? Every religion has its “name only” members.

 

[ron77nyc]

If my baptism, confirmation and communion are still valid then I’m Catholic.

 

[ron77nyc]

I do not belong to any church but I do attend a Christian church. As far as believing the tenets of the faith; I’ve been on CAF now for quite some time trying to find out what they are and not every Catholic on here knows them either and not all Catholics agree on what they are so who has the complete summary?

 

[ron77nyc]

If you’re interested in attending or want to hear what they teach I can give you the website. It contains thier history and on line sermons. I’m not being evasive. There is no formal membership. Everyone is there to worship and to learn.