Are you a relic lover?

[Mark121359]

Here you go halogirl. Now keep in mind that photography isn’t exactly my schtick!!!

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[Mark121359]

I don’t know. What do you mean by “what?”

 

[BoomBoomMancini]

You just said that very casually. It’s like if in the middle of describing the weather, someone said, “oh, and of course, I have a talking dragon named Barry.”

If we honestly had a verified piece of the True Cross, I doubt the Church would just let a layman keep it in his home…

 

[Mark121359]

Look at the pictures then. And tell that to Mr. Serafin! I’ve met him. He knows the apostolate that obtained these relics. He displayed a sizable portion of his collection at the Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception a few years back. I’m not here to make you believe.

 

[BoomBoomMancini]

I mean, color me skeptical, but I’m not here to argue with you.

 

[Mark121359]

I’ve edited my above post.

 

[Mark121359]

I doubt the Church would just let a layman keep it in his home…

A few years back, someone on this very forum said similar words to me. So I emailed Thomas J. Serafin the following question;

Recently I was told that lay persons were forbidden to possess First Class Relics, and that it was sinful for me to do so and that only Priests or Churches were permitted to do so. Is it forbidden or sinful for a lay person to possess a First Class Relic?

Here is his exact short reply to that question as I saved that email.;

It is absolutely NOT sinful or forbidden to possess a relic. If it wasn’t for the devoted and faithful laity the clergy would have sold or thrown out all of the relics that have been rescued by lay people!

Still not convinced? Then don’t take my word for it! I absolutely challenge you to email him for yourself. Keep in mind that Thomas J. Serafin is one of the leading experts in the field of Christian Relics as I mentioned in post # 26. He’s forgotten way more about them then you and I will ever know! Good luck!

Edited to add, here is his email;
saintsalive@earthlink.net

 

[BoomBoomMancini]

First, I didn’t say it was sinful. Second, I’m fully willing to believe you have some genuine relics from saints.

What I don’t believe is that you have a verified piece of the True Cross in your living room. Or at least, I find it fantastically unlikely. If you think you do, great.

 

[thistle]

I know for fact that they are authentic because Thomas Serafin knows the woman my mom obtained them from. All came with documentation. And yes, it is perfectly licit for laity to possess first class relics.

The Church has NEVER authenticated True Cross relics. It makes no difference what papers or what individual says they are authentic.
The Church does NOT authenticate ancient relics.

Do you know why? It’s because the Church cannot be 100% certain they are genuine.

 

[CradleRC58]

Thistle, The Shroud is authentic

 

[thistle]

Thistle, The Shroud is authentic

That is for individuals to believe or not. It has not been PROVEN to be authentic so you may not state that as a fact. It is simply your opinion, to which you are entitled!
Please do not derail the thread of the OP. If you want a Shroud debate then join the many existing threads on this subject. It is unfair to the OP.

 

[Calliope]

I think that cutting up the bodies of dead people and distributing them is odd and that touching them or touching something to them hoping to obtain a miracle is superstitious.

Having a piece of garment etc from a loved one is common human behavior. We are sentimental and it makes us feel close to a person. We do it with loved ones and celebrities. As long as it stays in that realm I’m comfortable with it.

The pieces of dead bodies though, I think is weird. I understand protecting the remains of holy forebarers, but the distribution of parts seems to be the opposite of what the church teaches about how bodies are to be dealt with following death.

Cremains are to be buried, bodies are to be buried in one piece whenever possible.

I don’t think mummies should be displayed in museums either.

 

[CradleRC58]

Just messing with ya

 

[Mark121359]

The Church has NEVER authenticated True Cross relics.

Oh really??? This display of the nine Relics of the Passion at the National Shrine of The Divine Mercy, including the True Cross has been reviewed and authenticated by Vatican authorities. (last paragraph of article below)

http://iobserve.org/2017/04/26/nine-holy-relics-of-the-passion-displayed-at-divine-mercy-shrine/

 

[catholiclala]

I think that cutting up the bodies of dead people and distributing them is odd and that touching them or touching something to them hoping to obtain a miracle is superstitious.

Having a piece of garment etc from a loved one is common human behavior. We are sentimental and it makes us feel close to a person. We do it with loved ones and celebrities. As long as it stays in that realm I’m comfortable with it.

The pieces of dead bodies though, I think is weird. I understand protecting the remains of holy forebarers, but the distribution of parts seems to be the opposite of what the church teaches about how bodies are to be dealt with following death.

Cremains are to be buried, bodies are to be buried in one piece whenever possible.

I don’t think mummies should be displayed in museums either.

Exactly, this was the point of my post.

I get the veneration part and even find some aspects of relics as a unique, but blessed devotion. But the distribution of pieces of a body on mass scale seems odd. To go further and think some blessing will be granted even odder and does fall into the realm of superstition. Just because it’s Catholic doesn’t grant immunity from false notions. I do like the fact that Catholic church’s are supposed to have a relic as it promotes continuity and symbolizes Momento Mori and the importance of the body and resurrection. But for any individual to be able to collect pieces of people can be problematic. Then it becomes like collecting stamps or coins, not reverent and more like possessing a spiritual treasure.

 

[Irishmom2]

There is no “distribution off pieces of a body on a mass scale.” That is not correct.

 

[catholiclala]

My apologies that was worded wrong, what I’m getting at is that it seems like the parts have one level become a commodity to collect.

 

[CRM_Brother]

Personally, I am not a ‘relic lover’. I respect them and venerate them when they are displayed, but I do not feel the need to seek them out on my own. I do recognize, however, that they are a legitimate form of expressing one’s faith.

Relic veneration and possession are directly taken from scripture: 2 Kings 20-22 (1st class), Mark 5: 27-29 (2nd class), and Acts 19:11-12 (3rd class). It too was practiced in the early Church as testified in the Martyrdom of Polycarp and the graphiti inscribed upon the walls of the first shrine and reliquary of Saints Peter and Paul (circa 250 AD) near the Catacombs of San Sebastiano outside of Rome.

Relics, however, are not meant for collection, but rather veneration. I always advise people who possess relics that if they end up just sitting in a drawer somewhere to pass them on, either to another person or to the local Church for public veneration. The Church no longer allows first-class relics to be issued to an individual but only to institutions like churches, dioceses or Religious orders for this reason: to stop first-class relics from being treated as something akin to baseball cards. It was this treatment of relics as collectibles which helped spur on people like Martin Luther in their objections to them.

God Bless,
Br. Ben, CRM

 

[catholiclala]

Personally, I am not a ‘relic lover’. I respect them and venerate them when they are displayed, but I do not feel the need to seek them out on my own. I do recognize, however, that they are a legitimate form of expressing one’s faith.

Relic veneration and possession are directly taken from scripture: 2 Kings 20-22 (1st class), Mark 5: 27-29 (2nd class), and Acts 19:11-12 (3rd class). It too was practiced in the early Church as testified in the Martyrdom of Polycarp and the graphiti inscribed upon the walls of the first shrine and reliquary of Saints Peter and Paul (circa 250 AD) near the Catacombs of San Sebastiano outside of Rome.

Relics, however, are not meant for collection, but rather veneration. I always advise people who possess relics that if they end up just sitting in a drawer somewhere to pass them on, either to another person or to the local Church for public veneration. The Church no longer allows first-class relics to be issued to an individual but only to institutions like churches, dioceses or Religious orders for this reason: to stop first-class relics from being treated as something akin to baseball cards. It was this treatment of relics as collectibles which helped spur on people like Martin Luther in their objections to them.

God Bless,
Br. Ben, CRM

Thanks for these words. You summed up much of my thinking on this better than I could. I’m glad to know the Church has addressed these concerns.

 

[thistle]

Oh really??? This display of the nine Relics of the Passion at the National Shrine of The Divine Mercy, including the True Cross has been reviewed and authenticated by Vatican authorities. (last paragraph of article below)

Authentic as per that article does not mean the Church has declared them to be 100% genuine!

Authenticity of Relics

Ordinarily, a relic exposed for public veneration is authenticated by a cardinal or bishop or other delegated person. This appears to no longer be a strict requ...

www.catholic.com