**nickybr38;
- Although she was a great speaker she was often so consumed with being ‘fair’ and ‘ecumenical’ that I couldn’t respect much of what she said. You know what I’m talking about?**
Oh yea, I had a Jesuit priest. He was mentioning revelations of other religions as equally being God’s Word, and said the stories in the NT about demon-possesion were fables written before the age of science. I certainly didn’t respect his oppinion any more than you did that lady minister’s, and if I was as rude as those parishioners you talk about, I’d have shouted out loudly during the Mass. But instead I talked to him in the sacristy.
Those people who speak powerfully but are unwilling to say; THIS is truth…’ I never saw a male pastor who ever compromised what he believed to save offending someone in the audience.
I experienced that many times with both male priests, they are often afraid to say anything controversial because someone might get hurt or offended. At least thats a problem in most catholic Churches in N-Europe.
2. Her parishioners had no respect for her. This had NOTHING to do with her personality.
No apparantly just her gender made her the victim of such disrespectful behaviour.
** she was the kind of lady I would have NEVER back talked (despite her ecumenism). But I saw, on several occasions, members of her congregation SPEAK UP during church services to correct her IN THE MIDDLE OF THE SERVICE. It was disturbing and I hate to say it but I truly doubt this would have happened had a man been at the pulpit.**
Looks like these people were not decent Christians. I have sat in many services lead by women pastors and no one ever interrupted their preaching. Also these pastors were as knowlegable and good preachers as their male colleagues. There is a saying among children if a big guy hits a smaller guy: “Why dont you go beat on someone who is your own size?” The same with the people you saw, if they publicly humiliated a female minister but wouldn’t have dared to conduct themselves like that if she were a man, shame on them… double shame for their behaviour and their cowardice.
3. On a few rare occasions we had guest male speakers and every time we did, without fail, members of the congregation would comment on how NICE it was to see a man in the front of the church.
When I sometimes go to a non-Catholic church and experience a non-theologian or a non-male preacher I say, how nice it was to see an unlearned person or a female preacher… its refreshing and it can give some different perspectives.
4. She couldn’t seem to decide if we were at a Christian church, Buddhist, Native… etc. She’d use traditional worship motions from other religions…
Again that’s then the problem, and a problem I have experienced with male priests too who are syncretists (“all roads lead to heaven” kind of folkes).
**
I am not offended when I see female clergy. but I do wonder how effective a female can be in that position. No matter how much we scream about equality the bottom line is men in leadership are given a certain amount of respect just by being male that women have to work HARD to earn and sometimes the only way a woman earns that respect is through behaving in very masculine ways. **
Yea, isn’t it sad? You are right, many people really fall into that trap. And that is what continually causes negative feminism. It reminds me of my mom who is a teacher. She would always be respected but over the last ten years when young Muslim men started to attend the school, she told me: “These young men come from patriarchal societies. They state quite openly that they don’t respect the women teachers and they lie to our faces and make trouble in class”.
In my own school years I saw the same tendency what you describe. Boys were favourized, even by women teachers, and always held to be more intelligent, their oppinion mattered more during class discussion. Male teachers were more pupular than women teachers and they also had more self esteem due to the whole upbringing of the system. And I think selfesteem is a huge factor. When women are costantly told they have to be pretty, little pleasers to be loved they become that, and loose respect from men when they try to function professionally. And by the way, knowlege and standing firm are not natural masculine traits more than feminine. Another thing about respect. There is a different between respect and fear, as you know.
Whether it’s right or wrong for this to be so, it’s what I’ve seen in my experience and I really don’t think female clergy can be as effective as male clergy because of this innate desire we ALL seem to have to respect male leadership more.
I respect people for their character, virtue, courage and knowlege. A man has to earn the respect just like a woman in my eyes.If I have prejudice, like also if I have racial prejudice, I know the problem lies in me, and not in the person infront of me.
To the person who made the comment about female clergy leading to gay clergy and etc…do you have any real data you can provide to support that position?
Pentecostalism is again an example.most of them are very against homosexual behaviour but pro women in leadership and they are growing everywhere.
I think traditional Protestant churches, most of them, are vulnerable to the spirits of the times because they don’t have a common authority like Catholics do.
Now as for gay clergy per se, I am a bit confused. We seem to have a high number of gay Catholic clergy in my country.
Anyway, I have a funny taste in my mouth dialoging with someone who has so clearly stated that my views and oppinions matter less than the male posters here, simply because of my gender. It saddens me, and frankly, if people think the way you do, I’d rather not know too much about it, because I might, in turn, loose respect for them.
)