S
Skadi
Guest
Wow this blew up this morning.
Secondly, and this quote up there illustrates this perfectly, we have very different ideas on what divinity is. You believe that a god is an all powerful being, which is esentialy the cornerstone of modern monotheism (although there are some old bible passages that make it sound like old Jews may not have necessarily believed that.) On the other hand most paganism is Polytheistic, where dietys are almost alwase considered not all powerful.
Now Christians are often baffled by this, they say “why worship something if it isnt all powerfull?” and “well my god rules the whole universe”. These are some of the most ridiculous arguments ive come across. One minuet the would be missionary is saying “You should believe in jesus because Thor and Rodin cant realy be real” and the next its “Well my god is all powerful, so why dont you worship him over week gods who had their religion defeated?” These two reasons are totally contradictory. One second its “believe in the god thats most likely to exist” and the next its “believe in the god that claims the most power”. Its all these cliche and incomparable arguments that make some Christians come off as “Souls for the trophy case” kind of people.
Ill tell you a story, my personal favorite actually, and its going to baffle you. You will be sitting here saying “why would you ever worship such a god” and the answer i will give you is simple. Because I think he is real, and I cannot ay the same of a divine Christ. And keep in mind, we view our stories as allegory.
"there once was a troll king named utgard-loki, who sought to humiliate Thor in front of his court. He called apon Thor and challenged him to complete three simple tasks. Thor, being a man of honor, could not refuse.
The First challenge was to simply empty a drinking horn. Thor quickly threw his head back and drank but when he was finished, to his amazement, the horn was just as full as before. Try as he might, the horn could not be emptied.
Second, the king challenged him to lift the paw of a cat. Thor was the strongest among the gods, but try as he might he could not lift this cats paw. Embarrassed before all in utgard-loki’s court, he now prepared for the final challenge.
Finlay, the king asked Thor to wrestle his elderly mother. Thor laughed, but when he pounced apon the woman she easily lifted him and threw him through the air. try as he might, the old woman easily defeated Thor.
Finaly, embarrassed at his defeat, Thor came before utgard-loki in shame. Then, laughing, the king explained how he had tricked Thor into facing unbeatable tasks in order to humiliate him.
Using magic he had connected the drinking horn to the sea,and no one can drink the whole sea.
Likewise by magic he had disguised as a cat, the midgard serpent, which circles round the whole world on the sea floor, and no one can lift something that circles the world.
Lastly, his mother was in fact old age, for time is the enemy which none of us may ever dream of defeating."
The point of this story isnt Thors failure, although im sure thats what you got out of it because from the christian point of view that disproves divinity. But the actualy point of the story, the lessen to be learned, is this. “No one is all powerful, No one can truly defeat nature, and no one can escape time.”
Our gods are not all powerful, immortal entity’s. They are a race of beings, they have children, live, and die. They are the mightiest beings in existence, our spiritual kin, but even they are not all powerful. Only a being that is everything can be all powerful, which is where as a soft polytheist the Is All comes in for me. But the Is All is impersonal, like the force. The gods are personal, real, and watch us every day to see whom is worthy.
Here is where our different view points make it so difficult to debate. Firstly I just want to say that, atleast to me, your whole argument about sacrifice is irrelevant to me because I do not believe Jesus was divine
Secondly, and this quote up there illustrates this perfectly, we have very different ideas on what divinity is. You believe that a god is an all powerful being, which is esentialy the cornerstone of modern monotheism (although there are some old bible passages that make it sound like old Jews may not have necessarily believed that.) On the other hand most paganism is Polytheistic, where dietys are almost alwase considered not all powerful.
Now Christians are often baffled by this, they say “why worship something if it isnt all powerfull?” and “well my god rules the whole universe”. These are some of the most ridiculous arguments ive come across. One minuet the would be missionary is saying “You should believe in jesus because Thor and Rodin cant realy be real” and the next its “Well my god is all powerful, so why dont you worship him over week gods who had their religion defeated?” These two reasons are totally contradictory. One second its “believe in the god thats most likely to exist” and the next its “believe in the god that claims the most power”. Its all these cliche and incomparable arguments that make some Christians come off as “Souls for the trophy case” kind of people.
Ill tell you a story, my personal favorite actually, and its going to baffle you. You will be sitting here saying “why would you ever worship such a god” and the answer i will give you is simple. Because I think he is real, and I cannot ay the same of a divine Christ. And keep in mind, we view our stories as allegory.
"there once was a troll king named utgard-loki, who sought to humiliate Thor in front of his court. He called apon Thor and challenged him to complete three simple tasks. Thor, being a man of honor, could not refuse.
The First challenge was to simply empty a drinking horn. Thor quickly threw his head back and drank but when he was finished, to his amazement, the horn was just as full as before. Try as he might, the horn could not be emptied.
Second, the king challenged him to lift the paw of a cat. Thor was the strongest among the gods, but try as he might he could not lift this cats paw. Embarrassed before all in utgard-loki’s court, he now prepared for the final challenge.
Finlay, the king asked Thor to wrestle his elderly mother. Thor laughed, but when he pounced apon the woman she easily lifted him and threw him through the air. try as he might, the old woman easily defeated Thor.
Finaly, embarrassed at his defeat, Thor came before utgard-loki in shame. Then, laughing, the king explained how he had tricked Thor into facing unbeatable tasks in order to humiliate him.
Using magic he had connected the drinking horn to the sea,and no one can drink the whole sea.
Likewise by magic he had disguised as a cat, the midgard serpent, which circles round the whole world on the sea floor, and no one can lift something that circles the world.
Lastly, his mother was in fact old age, for time is the enemy which none of us may ever dream of defeating."
The point of this story isnt Thors failure, although im sure thats what you got out of it because from the christian point of view that disproves divinity. But the actualy point of the story, the lessen to be learned, is this. “No one is all powerful, No one can truly defeat nature, and no one can escape time.”
Our gods are not all powerful, immortal entity’s. They are a race of beings, they have children, live, and die. They are the mightiest beings in existence, our spiritual kin, but even they are not all powerful. Only a being that is everything can be all powerful, which is where as a soft polytheist the Is All comes in for me. But the Is All is impersonal, like the force. The gods are personal, real, and watch us every day to see whom is worthy.
