Astrology - why does my sign seem right?

[Tis_Bearself]

As for Catholics using it, it’s included in Vatican architecture, so I would worry too much about it.

It’s not just in the Vatican architecture. There are also older parish churches in USA at least that have the Zodiac signs incorporated into the decor. One is a church I attended regularly as a child and was fascinated as a kid by the Zodiac being on the ceiling of a Catholic church. It is small and way up in the top dome, so if you aren’t a bored kid with wandering eyes, you likely wouldn’t even see it.

I reckon if God wanted to put messages in the stars, he could, but I also think that most humans trying to interpret them are running the risk of all kinds of pitfalls, and hence the Church prohibition is a good idea.

 

[jcrichton]

Why should astrology be incompatible and “dangerous”?

Might it not be possible–and make sense–that our birthdate and the alignment of the planets are intertwined and have an effect on who we are?
*Especially *if God is in charge of our birth, the existence and alignment of the planets, and everything else unseen, swirling about the universe that encompasses both?

Most people look at horoscopes for entertainment purposes, not to take or give “power”.

.

Hi!

…you seem to keep missing the target… it is not about what the world wants; it’s about what Yahweh God wants… all of us were Created in God’s Image and Likeness–given the freedom to choose to Obey or go on our own… yet, man’s determination to go it his way does not translate to God’s Will and Command:

19 When someone tells you to consult mediums and spiritists, who whisper and mutter, should not a people inquire of their God? Why consult the dead on behalf of the living? 20 Consult God’s instruction and the testimony of warning. If anyone does not speak according to this word, they have no light of dawn.

(Isaiah 8:19-20)

6 Their visions are false and their divinations a lie. Even though the Lord has not sent them, they say, “The Lord declares,” and expect him to fulfill their words. 7 Have you not seen false visions and uttered lying divinations when you say, “The Lord declares,” though I have not spoken? (Ezekiel 13:6-7–compare with: 1 Sam. 15:23; 2 Kings 9:22; 2 Chr. 33:6; Micah 5:12; Nahum 3:4; Gal. 5:20).
…when soothsayers speak, they claim to hold a revelation… since they are not being sent by God… they are false prophets… those who follow false prophets are heading into the same predicament as the false prophets–a people who will not see the Dawn!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[Tis_Bearself]

There are worse fads people can get sucked into. Do you happen to know when the Catholic Church started frowning on astrology? It seemed to be fine with it in the Middle Ages and Renaissance.

I actually don’t know, I never happened to look it up. I’d be curious to know though, so if anyone else knows perhaps they can share, otherwise I’ll just put it on my list of topics to research.

 

[jcrichton]

You sure this really happened?

Getting one’s chart done by a proper “professional” is a complicated, costly, and timely endeavor. And then it takes a trained astrologer to read and interpret the chart properly.
To the lay person, their chart would look like a bunch of lines, numbers, and scribbles that are indecipherable. I can’t imagine these seminary students being able to read their charts.
Plus…the prof would have needed the time of birth for and from each student to ensure the charts were accurate.

And…95 percent of the students in seminary class–already aware that they should not “believe” in astrology–enthusiastically said YES their charts were correct?

Do you know which seminary this former pastor went to?

.

Hi!

…the difference between lab rats and gullible people is that the lab rats are conditioned by the experiments they are subjected to and the rewards that they are given… gullible people will financially and emotionally bankrupt themselves before realizing that they were being played by a “psychic” pied piper… and that they could have gotten off the marry-go-round at any given time… even right after that first spin: ‘I can almost see/hear…’

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

So…first it is saying the information given is untrue.
Second, that partaking is a desire for power.

But whoever wrote this is not explaining why they think this is so.

Why do they?

.

Hi!

…you don’t get: ‘controlling the future’ as a desire for power?

…so you dish out hundreds, if not thousands of dollars, to be entertained by a jester?

…on some of Manhattan’s, NYC, sidewalks or subway platforms you can find a mime, singer, dancer, “magician,” ventriloquist, sly-of-hand artist… who would do it for a few coins or a few dollars–you can feel good for a few minutes and save a bundle!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[7_Sorrows]

It’s not just in the Vatican architecture. There are also older parish churches in USA at least that have the Zodiac signs incorporated into the decor. One is a church I attended regularly as a child and was fascinated as a kid by the Zodiac being on the ceiling of a Catholic church. It is small and way up in the top dome, so if you aren’t a bored kid with wandering eyes, you likely wouldn’t even see it.

I reckon if God wanted to put messages in the stars, he could, but I also think that most humans trying to interpret them are running the risk of all kinds of pitfalls, and hence the Church prohibition is a good idea.

we currently have a tile work, quite large, of Our Lady surrounded by 12 tiles and the zodiac signs. It stands in the Rosary garden in front of our church. it belonged to an elderly priest who recently died so they placed it there in his memory. I asked someone about it before I knew how it came to be placed there and where it was from. They said the priest had a fondness for astrology. It struck me as strange since I converted and I learned Catholicism and astrology are supposedly
not compatible. This elderly priest was highly educated and very wise and always had a twinkle in his eye. I think of him often.
I still see a connection though between creation and astronomy and the alignment of stars and planets and I am sure for many centuries the stars guided many, whether by sea or on land, on their journeys and played an important part in the culture of many civilizations.

 

[jcrichton]

Astrology isn’t proper divination, since it’s too regular. There is no randomness to it. Tarot is much better. However, it can be useful to take astrology into account when planing magical rituals, if you’re into that sort of thing.

As for why it seems to match your personality, it’s due to confirmation bias. There are multiple mutually exclusive systems of astrology, and each one “works” when you use it.

As for Catholics using it, it’s included in Vatican architecture, so I would worry too much about it.

Hi!

…never heard of that before… so the Vatican architecture uses the zodiac symbols? …could you demonstrate where these are depicted?

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Hi!

…never heard of that before… so the Vatican architecture uses the zodiac symbols? …could you demonstrate where these are depicted?

Maran atha!

Angel

Here’s one example. I am pretty sure astro references are in more than one place in the Vatican. There was a significant overlap between astronomy and astrology for some time in the 1500s - 1600s, so some people explain these as “astronomical” symbols. I believe Kepler for example was also an astrologer as well as astrologer.

pinterest.com/pin/320529698462616614/

 

[Tis_Bearself]

They’re in lots of other old churches and cathedrals too, here’s an example

pinterest.com/pin/320529698462597882/

 

[jcrichton]

Here’s one example. I am pretty sure astro references are in more than one place in the Vatican. There was a significant overlap between astronomy and astrology for some time in the 1500s - 1600s, so some people explain these as “astronomical” symbols. I believe Kepler for example was also an astrologer as well as astrologer.

pinterest.com/pin/320529698462616614/

Hi!

…I’m quite ignorant of many things… this is the first time that I’ve heard of this… when I followed the link I noticed that every depiction had a caption about “saved” or some reference to a past place of origin… since you seem to be more cognizant than I, are there any who were created/commissioned by the Vatican?

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[po18guy]

If you know someone whose sign is completely off - there you have it: a coin toss.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Hi!

…I’m quite ignorant of many things… this is the first time that I’ve heard of this… when I followed the link I noticed that every depiction had a caption about “saved” or some reference to a past place of origin… since you seem to be more cognizant than I, are there any who were created/commissioned by the Vatican?

Pope Leo X commissioned the Sala dei Pontefici (shown in the first photo I posted). He was somewhat into astrology. As Tsuzuki said, the Church didn’t tend to frown on it as much then. See supporting reference linked below. Martin Luther was actually way more against astrology from what I read.

books.google.com/books?id=HM-1Q59H2kwC&pg=PA143

 

[DaveBj]

There are worse fads people can get sucked into. Do you happen to know when the Catholic Church started frowning on astrology? It seemed to be fine with it in the Middle Ages and Renaissance.

The Catholic Church’s opposition to astrology predates the Middle Ages by close to a millenium. The early Church Fathers, notably St. Augustin, wrote rather vehemently against it.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

The Catholic Church’s opposition to astrology predates the Middle Ages by close to a millenium. The early Church Fathers, notably St. Augustin, wrote rather vehemently against it.

And then Thomas Aquinas wrote in Summa Theologica accepting some aspects of it, primarily that the stars might have some influence upon the instincts of a person but that this influence could be overcome by humans who chose to follow Christ. (He did not approve of its use in the “telling the future” sense. )

 

[7_Sorrows]

They’re in lots of other old churches and cathedrals too, here’s an example

pinterest.com/pin/320529698462597882/

I can’t get the link to work correctly. The pictures display for a few seconds and then another page appears saying the link is not working or were changed to another
web address. Anyone else have that problem?

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I can’t get the link to work correctly. The pictures display for a few seconds and then another page appears saying the link is not working or were changed to another
web address. Anyone else have that problem?

Pinterest might require you to be logged into a Pinterest account to view the pictures. I don’t use Pinterest but I think a couple years ago I created some account linked to other social media so I could view a friend’s Pins and then it just left me logged in forever though I’ve never posted a thing on there. I’ll try to put other links if I can find them that aren’t Pinterest.

Edited to add, here’s a non-Pinterest link to the first photo I posted which is the ceiling of the Sala Dei Pontifici, the public entrance hall of the Borgia Apartment at the Vatican Palace.
drturi.com/images/church/2Vatican%20Zodiac%20Sala%20di%20Pontific.jpeg

Edited to add, here’s a non-Pinterest link to the second photo I posted
chartofthemoment.com/wp-content/uploads/Zodiac-foyer-ceiling-St.Stephens-Basilica-Budapest-Hungary-e1470232420989.jpg

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Why should astrology be incompatible and “dangerous”?

Might it not be possible–and make sense–that our birthdate and the alignment of the planets are intertwined and have an effect on who we are?
*Especially *if God is in charge of our birth, the existence and alignment of the planets, and everything else unseen, swirling about the universe that encompasses both?

Most people look at horoscopes for entertainment purposes, not to take or give “power”.

.

Why does the birthday even matter. In the modern world it’s quite common to take babies early. My newest is 2 weeks early and would be in a different sign…

 

[7_Sorrows]

Pinterest might require you to be logged into a Pinterest account to view the pictures. I don’t use Pinterest but I think a couple years ago I created some account linked to other social media so I could view a friend’s Pins and then it just left me logged in forever though I’ve never posted a thing on there. I’ll try to put other links if I can find them that aren’t Pinterest.

Edited to add, here’s a non-Pinterest link to the first photo I posted which is the ceiling of the Sala Dei Pontifici, the public entrance hall of the Borgia Apartment at the Vatican Palace.
drturi.com/images/church/2Vatican%20Zodiac%20Sala%20di%20Pontific.jpeg

Edited to add, here’s a non-Pinterest link to the second photo I posted
chartofthemoment.com/wp-content/uploads/Zodiac-foyer-ceiling-St.Stephens-Basilica-Budapest-Hungary-e1470232420989.jpg

Sure looks like they are at the Vatican.

12 apostles, 12 months in a year and 12 astrological signs. There are 4 seasons in groups of 3 in a year and the astrology signs are divided into 4 groups of 3 (earth, water, fire and air).
Can the apostles be divided into 4 groups of 3?
Just looking for a correlation.

Astronomy and astrology were both important to many cultures through history.
And it looks like the astrological signs have decorated many Catholic churches or
cathedrals.

 

[7_Sorrows]

Why does the birthday even matter. In the modern world it’s quite common to take babies early. My newest is 2 weeks early and would be in a different sign…

There would be a difference between due date and birthdate I would think.

Congratulations on your new baby!

 

[DaveBj]

There would be a difference between due date and birthdate I would think.

Congratulations on your new baby!

If the position of the stars did have any effect on us (and I seriously doubt that they do), I would think that it would be the position at the moment of conception, not birth. But that’s just me.