Atheism, and ignoring Jesus

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gump
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
than explain why God didn’t answer my mothers prayers as explained in my post above.
Possibly this will help:

haydock1859.tripod.com/id21.html

Ver. 7. Ask, and you shall receive, &c. When we offer our petitions to the Almighty, we must imitate the example of Solomon, who immediately obtained what he asked of the Lord, because he asked what he ought. Two things, therefore, are necessary to every prayer, that it be offered up with perseverance and fervour, and that it contain a lawful prayer. (St. Chrysostom, hom. xxiv.) — The reasons why so many do not obtain the effects of their prayers, are,—1st. Because they ask for what is evil; and he that makes such a request, offers the Almighty an intolerable injury by wishing to make him, as it were, the author of evil: 2nd. Although what they ask be not evil, they seek it for an evil end. (St. James iv.): 3rd. Because they who pray, are themselves wicked; (St. John ix.) for God doth not hear sinners: 4th. Because they ask with no faith, or with faith weak and wavering: (St. James i.) 5th. Because although what we ask be good in itself, yet the Almighty refuses it, in order to grant us a greater good: 6th. Because God wishes us to persevere, as he declares in the parable of the friend asking bread, Luke, ch. ii.; and that we may esteem his gifts the more: 7th. We do not always receive what we beg, because, according to St. Augustine, (lib. ii, de Serm. Dom. et epis. 34, ad Paulinum) God often does not grant us what we petition for, that he may grant us something more useful and profitable. (Maldonatus)
 
Don’t be stupid…it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that with a loss of faith, there would be anger, depression, regression, self-centered thinking, selfishness. Come-on.
Pfft.

If God were to exist, wouldn’t you expect there to be a huge benefit to those who follow and obey him? Why, instead, do we see the opposite?
For example, there is growing evidence that the delusion of religion causes significant social dysfunction. Statistical research is revealing the problems that go with religion. For example, a recent article in the Journal of Religion and Society points out that religion is correlated to the significant social difficulties that we can see in America:
In general, higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy, and abortion in the prosperous democracies (Figures 1-9). The most theistic prosperous democracy, the U.S., is exceptional, but not in the manner Franklin predicted. The United States is almost always the most dysfunctional of the developed democracies, sometimes spectacularly so, and almost always scores poorly. The view of the U.S. as a “shining city on the hill” to the rest of the world is falsified when it comes to basic measures of societal health. ref]
The prevailing view is that religion is harmless even if it is delusional. That turns out not to be the case. America is the most religious country of those studied in the developed world. America also has the biggest problems in terms of things like homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy, and abortion. This article by Sam Harris puts it this way:
While most Americans believe that getting rid of religion is an impossible goal, much of the developed world has already accomplished it. Any account of a “god gene” that causes the majority of Americans to helplessly organize their lives around ancient works of religious fiction must explain why so many inhabitants of other First World societies apparently lack such a gene. The level of atheism throughout the rest of the developed world refutes any argument that religion is somehow a moral necessity. Countries like Norway, Iceland, Australia, Canada, Sweden, Switzerland, Belgium, Japan, the Netherlands, Denmark and the United Kingdom are among the least religious societies on Earth. According to the United Nations’ Human Development Report (2005) they are also the healthiest, as indicated by measures of life expectancy, adult literacy, per capita income, educational attainment, gender equality, homicide rate and infant mortality. Conversely, the 50 nations now ranked lowest in terms of human development are unwaveringly religious. Other analyses paint the same picture: The United States is unique among wealthy democracies in its level of religious literalism and opposition to evolutionary theory; it is also uniquely beleaguered by high rates of homicide, abortion, teen pregnancy, STD infection and infant mortality. The same comparison holds true within the United States itself: Southern and Midwestern states, characterized by the highest levels of religious superstition and hostility to evolutionary theory, are especially plagued by the above indicators of societal dysfunction, while the comparatively secular states of the Northeast conform to European norms. Of course, correlational data of this sort do not resolve questions of causality–belief in God may lead to societal dysfunction; societal dysfunction may foster a belief in God; each factor may enable the other; or both may spring from some deeper source of mischief. Leaving aside the issue of cause and effect, these facts prove that atheism is perfectly compatible with the basic aspirations of a civil society; they also prove, conclusively, that religious faith does nothing to ensure a society’s health. Countries with high levels of atheism also are the most charitable in terms of giving foreign aid to the developing world. The dubious link between Christian literalism and Christian values is also belied by other indices of charity. Consider the ratio in salaries between top-tier CEOs and their average employee: in Britain it is 24 to 1; France 15 to 1; Sweden 13 to 1; in the United States, where 83% of the population believes that Jesus literally rose from the dead, it is 475 to 1. Many a camel, it would seem, expects to squeeze easily through the eye of a needle.

In other words, religion is harmful, not helpful. The reason is because God is imaginary and religious delusion is hurting all of us.
 
If you were so worried about the starving, why do you try to stop the faithful? What is the outcome you would like to see from this?

Should we loose our faith, that could have deleterious effects on the charity that pours from us. So, you are actually fighting to stop feeding the poor in essence - true?

From Catholic Charities:

Feeding the Hungry

In 2006, over 6.3 million people received food services—accounting for nearly half (47 percent) of the services provided by Catholic Charities nationwide.
Food Services At A Glance

From Charity Navigator on Christian Foundation for Children and Aging (A different Catholic charity)
Organizational Efficiency
Program Expenses 93.7%
Administrative Expenses 3.4%
Fundraising Expenses 2.7%
Fundraising Efficiency $0.02
Revenue
Primary Revenue $90,572,647
Other Revenue $1,338,951
Total Revenue $91,911,598

As you can see, the program expenses of the Catholic charity I listed are at 93.7% - to give you a gage, Orange County United way is at 85%. You can run any charity on Charity Navigator and see how much actually goes to the program and how much goes to administration.

On another note: You suffer from starvation of grace yet you don’t worry a bit about that - which will last for eternity.

P.S. I’m glad to see you showing some semblance of a conversation; however - you’re repeating what’s been said already by Gump.
Hello veronica

You are losing it. I didn’t say a word about the chuch not feeding the poor.

I asked. If jesus told the truth about prayers, should’nt the starving stop if the 2 billion christians prayed for it to end?

Please answer the question.

les
 
Don’t be stupid…it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that with a loss of faith, there would be anger, depression, regression, self-centered thinking, selfishness. Come-on.
They are 4 billion people on this planet without this faith and most seem to be getting along just fine.

les
 
They are 4 billion people on this planet without this faith and most seem to be getting along just fine.

les
2 Billion claim to be Christians, Half of those are Catholics, that leaves nearly 4 billion of other faith systems (faith is not lack of such as athiest claim they have, or is that have not:confused: ) you google the break down, but the real important thing to know, aleast for this dicussion, there are only a little over 204 million that claim to be athiest:rolleyes:

According to the 2001 World Almanac, Atheists number: 121 million in Asia -56 million in the former USSR -23 million (3.5%) in Europe-2.7 million in Latin America-1.6 million (0.5%) in North America- 0.4 million in Oceania - 0.4 million in Africa
religioustolerance.org/atheist1.htm

Seems to me many more get along having some sort of faith(though not all Christians, but we are working on that with God’s help) then those that don’t :cool:

How does it feel to part of such a minute minority among so many insane and delusional people?
 
2 Billion claim to be Christians, Half of those are Catholics, that leaves nearly 4 billion of other faith systems (faith is not lack of such as athiest claim they have, or is that have not:confused: ) you google the break down, but the real important thing to know, aleast for this dicussion, there are only a little over 204 million that claim to be athiest:rolleyes:

According to the 2001 World Almanac, Atheists number: 121 million in Asia -56 million in the former USSR -23 million (3.5%) in Europe-2.7 million in Latin America-1.6 million (0.5%) in North America- 0.4 million in Oceania - 0.4 million in Africa
religioustolerance.org/atheist1.htm

Seems to me many more get along having some sort of faith(though not all Christians, but we are working on that with God’s help) then those that don’t :cool:

How does it feel to part of such a minute minority among so many insane and delusional people?
Not everyone who doesn’t claim to be athiest belongs to a religion. Most people just don’t care, and don’t claim to be anything.
 
Not everyone who doesn’t claim to be athiest belongs to a religion. Most people just don’t care, and don’t claim to be anything.
Most people do care (some more then others) but you seem to have a some sort of hidden bar of judgement on how faithful one must have toward thier faith in order to be considered a person of faith. That seems to be pretty puritan type of an attitude to me. 🤷 Are you sure you are an athiest? or a fundamentalist of some sort?:hmmm:
 
Most people do care (some more then others) but you seem to have a some sort of hidden bar of judgement on how faithful one must have toward thier faith in order to be considered a person of faith. That seems to be pretty puritan type of an attitude to me. 🤷 Are you sure you are an athiest? or a fundamentalist of some sort?:hmmm:
I don’t claim to be an athiest, or anything, I’m still learning for myself.

But I know from the people I know, only two of them are religious, and only one is an athiest, the rest don’t really care. a lot people have other things that they concern themselves with, jobs, school, etc, and don’t really place much importance on religion.

Maybe the pressure to find a religion is stronger in USA, but here in Canada it’s really not much of an issue.
 
Hobble and Bennie,
What seems to stand out is that Hobble has the sensitivity of a saint in that he can see the smallest most seemingly insignificant sin and how that harms others. I would not label him puritan at all. I think, Hobble, you are on the right track in understanding the nature of having faith. JP II stated that the smallest seemingly most hidden sin, no matter how private, harms the entire church and all people.
We as catholics must understand the sensitivity of Jesus in order to understand the sensitivity of you Hobble and see this as a strength that is to be used to help us who are insensitive as to how we may affect others in the way we live and express our faith.
 
2 Billion claim to be Christians, Half of those are Catholics, that leaves nearly 4 billion of other faith systems (faith is not lack of such as athiest claim they have, or is that have not:confused: ) you google the break down, but the real important thing to know, aleast for this dicussion, there are only a little over 204 million that claim to be athiest:rolleyes:

According to the 2001 World Almanac, Atheists number: 121 million in Asia -56 million in the former USSR -23 million (3.5%) in Europe-2.7 million in Latin America-1.6 million (0.5%) in North America- 0.4 million in Oceania - 0.4 million in Africa
religioustolerance.org/atheist1.htm
Hello ben

This is true. All other faiths are in that 4 billion.
Seems to me many more get along having some sort of faith(though not all Christians, but we are working on that with God’s help) then those that don’t :cool:
I am an atheist, I don’t believe the same thing you do.

Take Hindus for example. They don’t believe the same thing you do.

What is the difference in an atheist and a Hindu? We both don’t believe the same thing you do.

You seem to be saying if someone has faith in something supernatural, that is better than being an atheist. :confused:
How does it feel to part of such a minute minority among so many insane and delusional people?
I am proud to be an atheist. My world view does not contain any magic.

How many people would have to start believing in Thor before you believed also?

les
 
Hello ben

This is true. All other faiths are in that 4 billion.

I am an atheist, I don’t believe the same thing you do.

Take Hindus for example. They don’t believe the same thing you do.

What is the difference in an atheist and a Hindu? We both don’t believe the same thing you do.

You seem to be saying if someone has faith in something supernatural, that is better than being an atheist. :confused:

I am proud to be an atheist. My world view does not contain any magic.

How many people would have to start believing in Thor before you believed also?

les
Les,

I’m starting to think you’re a closet Catholic too! 😃
 
Les,

I’m starting to think you’re a closet Catholic too! 😃
Veronica, I’m starting to think you’re a closet Atheist. You seem to be so insecure with your arguments, what with ignoring all of my points. I think you want to be an Atheist, but are too scared by Religion to admit it.

Do you see what I did there?
 
Veronica, I’m starting to think you’re a closet Atheist. You seem to be so insecure with your arguments, what with ignoring all of my points. I think you want to be an Atheist, but are too scared by Religion to admit it.

Do you see what I did there?
haha! I like when you capitalize Religion. 😛

p.s. Your points are poo.
 
Veronica, I’m starting to think you’re a closet Atheist. You seem to be so insecure with your arguments, what with ignoring all of my points. I think you want to be an Atheist, but are too scared by Religion to admit it.

Do you see what I did there?
You are correct. Veronica is ignoring the posts.

I think Veronica is one of those people who just can’t get it through their head that someone doesn’t believe the same thing they do.

I am sure that Veronica would be a good neighbor though! 🙂

les
 
You are correct. Veronica is ignoring the posts.

I think Veronica is one of those people who just can’t get it through their head that someone doesn’t believe the same thing they do.

I am sure that Veronica would be a good neighbor though! 🙂

les
Yep, you got me.
 
Why is the STD, mortality and divorce rate for Christians (Whom supposedly live a life of enlightenment and holiness) higher than that of Atheists?
 
Why is the STD, mortality and divorce rate for Christians (Whom supposedly live a life of enlightenment and holiness) higher than that of Atheists?
I don’t know? How much is the price of tea in China? I thought you were concerned about prayer.

I mean, I can venture a guess if you like…Uh, because more atheists are single and live in “mom’s” basement.

P.S. You mean to say “infant mortality rate”.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top