atheism

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theistgal said:
Can you not even acknowledge the possibility that someone else may look at the same evidence that convinced you and not be convinced, without assuming that they’re “evil” or “hellbound” because of it?

I keep seeing people on these forums (not naming any names 😉 ) who moan, in threads like this one, that they’re horribly insulted by the way atheists (Muslims, Mormons, [fill in your favorite wrong belief system]) defame Christianity - then start new threads defaming those belief systems in exactly the same way.

Pot, kettle? :rolleyes:
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I myself can acknowledge it but have a hard time understanding it lets say. Here is why. You answer this for me, if you would. Now Jesus said you are either with me or you are against me. Thats pretty easy words to understand isn’t it. Now would you say that a person who is with Jesus is hellbound? Or would you say a person who is against Jesus is? I am asking you now. Now according to scripture JESUS says you are either hot or cold no lukewarm. What does that mean to you. Thanks and looking forward to your response. See why I have a problem with your so called evidence. You either accept Jesus Christ or you don’t. Now those are not my words they are his. Jesus said if you do not accept me you are not one of me did he not? Your turn.
 
theistgal said:
Can you not even acknowledge the possibility that someone else may look at the same evidence that convinced you and not be convinced, without assuming that they’re “evil” or “hellbound” because of it?

I keep seeing people on these forums (not naming any names 😉 ) who moan, in threads like this one, that they’re horribly insulted by the way atheists (Muslims, Mormons, [fill in your favorite wrong belief system]) defame Christianity - then start new threads defaming those belief systems in exactly the same way.

Pot, kettle? :rolleyes:
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Also if I may do you really believe that if someone does not accept Jesus Christ and deny him have good in him? You see I don’t. I believe if someone is good and not evil they do have Christ in them, they just don’t understand it yet. I think that it is that good in them that will lead them to Christ some day. If not there is no good in them,

Sorry just my opinion. To me there is 2 choice’s in life Good and Evil. The same for God and the Devil. How can you see Good and not see Christ. How can you see evil and not see satan?
 
rinnie said:
I myself can acknowledge it but have a hard time understanding it lets say. Here is why. You answer this for me, if you would. Now Jesus said you are either with me or you are against me. Thats pretty easy words to understand isn’t it. Now would you say that a person who is with Jesus is hellbound? Or would you say a person who is against Jesus is? I am asking you now. Now according to scripture JESUS says you are either hot or cold no lukewarm. What does that mean to you. Thanks and looking forward to your response. See why I have a problem with your so called evidence. You either accept Jesus Christ or you don’t. Now those are not my words they are his. Jesus said if you do not accept me you are not one of me did he not? Your turn.
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I’m not sure why you’re addressing this question to me. I have not presented any “evidence” in this thread, “so-called” or otherwise. All I’ve said is that we shouldn’t expect others to treat us any differently than the way we treat them.

(And I believe Jesus said something similar. ;))
 
rinnie said:
Also if I may do you really believe that if someone does not accept Jesus Christ and deny him have good in him? You see I don’t.
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Jews don’t accept Jesus as the Christ. Are you willing to say they’re evil?
 
rinnie said:
Also if I may do you really believe that if someone does not accept Jesus Christ and deny him have good in him? You see I don’t. I believe if someone is good and not evil they do have Christ in them, they just don’t understand it yet. I think that it is that good in them that will lead them to Christ some day. If not there is no good in them
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So you are saying that all Atheists, Agnostics, Buddhists, Muslims, Krishnas, and everyone else that had exposure to Christianity and chose not to accept Jesus, are evil? Are you serious? Am I reading this correctly?
 
Bear_Claw said:
So you are saying that all Atheists, Agnostics, Buddhists, Muslims, Krishnas, and everyone else that had exposure to Christianity and chose not to accept Jesus, are evil? Are you serious? Am I reading this correctly?
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Lets stick it to God. God the Father in this one. Do you think that anyone who rejects God has good in them? But to me it does not matter because God and Jesus are one in the same. But let say God. Yes I believe that if you can say that you reject God and refuse to accept him that is works of the devil. Yes I do and that is evil! Because do not Atheists reject God. Also do not Agnostic’s reject God?
 
theistgal said:
Jews don’t accept Jesus as the Christ. Are you willing to say they’re evil?
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No because they accept the Father. They are half way there. They will come in time to see that Jesus CHrist is the SOn of God. Many have actually got there already. And every day more and more are getting theirs eyes open.
 
rinnie said:
Nope. but again let me ask you this. Does all good come from God yes or no.
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Sure … in fact, according to the Bible, God is the creator of both good AND evil. (But of course you know that, right? 😉 )
 
theistgal said:
Um, are you sure this is what you intended to say? :eek:
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If you are tying to get me to deny the Trinity its not gonna happen. I believe that God is made up of the 3 persons. I understand that Jews do not accept this. Thats why I am not Jewish. But Jews do accept God. The GOd of the Jews is the Trinity to me. SO lets not play games.
 
rinnie said:
Lets stick it to God. God the Father in this one.
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I’m not sure I understand what this means.
Do you think that anyone who rejects God has good in them? But to me it does not matter because God and Jesus are one in the same. But let say God.
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Okay
Yes I believe that if you can say that you reject God and refuse to accept him that is works of the devil. Yes I do and that is evil! Because do not Atheists reject God. Also do not Agnostic’s reject God?
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So, essentially you are labeling my as evil and not capable of good. I find that intensely offensive and very judgmental.

Okay, lets’ get something straight. I reject god and jesus. I do not believe in him, but if he was to show up, floating on a cloud, I would reject him. I have reasons that we can definitely go into, but nutshell, I reject god and jesus.
Now you said: if they reject jesus (or god,) there is no good in them.
If not there is no good in them
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So you are saying that I am not capable of good that everything I do is out of evil. So what is it then when I give money to a beggar? When I feel compassion for a blind person? When I donate to Charity, or visit someone in hospital? Are these things evil? I submit to you that it’s better for an atheist to do a good deed, out of the kindness of his heart than it is for a Christian to do the same deed, since it would be done less out of charity and more out of obeying god’s command.

This is an extremely narrow minded view of life and I honestly can’t see how you can even make yourself believe this.
According to you every action that everyone does, except devout Christians are evil. That is the biggest crock of horse poo I’ve ever heard. Are you even listening to yourself? And more important how do you justify that statement?

Please explain this to me so that I understand…
 
theistgal said:
Sure … in fact, according to the Bible, God is the creator of both good AND evil. (But of course you know that, right? 😉 )
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Actually no I do not. Could you show me where God creates evil. I have heard everything Good comes from God. I have never heard that any evil comes from God. I have heard how God can make good from a evil but he never creates it. Could you show me that scripture?
 
rinnie said:
If you are tying to get me to deny the Trinity its not gonna happen. I believe that God is made up of the 3 persons. I understand that Jews do not accept this. Thats why I am not Jewish. But Jews do accept God. The GOd of the Jews is the Trinity to me. SO lets not play games.
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I was actually just trying to point out to you that saying “Let’s stick it to God” might be considered, oh, I dunno, obscene or blasphemous to some people. Perhaps you didn’t realize that. 😉
 
Bear_Claw said:
I’m not sure I understand what this means.

Okay

So, essentially you are labeling my as evil and not capable of good. I find that intensely offensive and very judgmental.

Okay, lets’ get something straight. I reject god and jesus. I do not believe in him, but if he was to show up, floating on a cloud, I would reject him. I have reasons that we can definitely go into, but nutshell, I reject god and jesus.
Now you said: if they reject jesus (or god,) there is no good in them.

So you are saying that I am not capable of good that everything I do is out of evil. So what is it then when I give money to a beggar? When I feel compassion for a blind person? When I donate to Charity, or visit someone in hospital? Are these things evil? I submit to you that it’s better for an atheist to do a good deed, out of the kindness of his heart than it is for a Christian to do the same deed, since it would be done less out of charity and more out of obeying god’s command.

This is an extremely narrow minded view of life and I honestly can’t see how you can even make yourself believe this.
According to you every action that everyone does, except devout Christians are evil. That is the biggest crock of horse poo I’ve ever heard. Are you even listening to yourself? And more important how do you justify that statement?

Please explain this to me so that I understand…
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I did explain it to you. I said that if you feel compassion for a blind person, etc that comes from God. There is God in you, you just do not realize it yet. IF you do not feel good and compelled to do good only evil there is no God in you. I know what I said, and you cannot turn it around on me. Go read my post again. I also said if you do not feel the need or urge to do good only evil there is no God in you. THats what I said and again I mean it.
 
rinnie said:
Actually no I do not. Could you show me where God creates evil. I have heard everything Good comes from God. I have never heard that any evil comes from God. I have heard how God can make good from a evil but he never creates it. Could you show me that scripture?
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Isaiah 45:7 -
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Also, just use your common sense. If God created EVERYTHING, then God created evil (if not intentionally, then by accident).

If you want to say God didn’t create evil, then you’re saying something exists that God didn’t create. That would mean there’s another power in the universe equal to God and with the same power to create. Do you really want to go there? :eek:
 
theistgal said:
I was actually just trying to point out to you that saying “Let’s stick it to God” might be considered, oh, I dunno, obscene or blasphemous to some people. Perhaps you didn’t realize that. 😉
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No I do realize it quite well, But wanted to make a point. THe point being that Jews do believe in the God of Abraham and do not deny God. The God of Abraham is Part of the Trinity. I saw this as an opportunity for you to jump in and have me condemn Jews and I will have no part of it.

I admire the Jews for accepting God, ANd pray that they will see that he is indeed part of the Trinity. Its as simple of that. So I want to stop you in your Tracks. I love and respect the Jews for the faith that they have, And pray that they can Come into the Grace that I was gifted with and come to accept Jesus Christ. ANd Like I told you its happening more and more every day.
 
theistgal said:
Isaiah 45:7 -
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Also, just use your common sense. If God created EVERYTHING, then God created evil (if not intentionally, then by accident).

If you want to say God didn’t create evil, then you’re saying something exists that God didn’t create. That would mean there’s another power in the universe equal to God and with the same power to create. Do you really want to go there? :eek:
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Yes I really do. Because my bible says woe not evil. Could you explain to me how great sorrow means (woe) means evil (wickedness sin). Could you show me how God could possibly sin?
 
rinnie said:
No I do realize it quite well. But wanted to make a point. THe point being that Jews do believe in the God of Abraham and do not deny God. The God of Abraham is Part of the Trinity. I saw this as an opportunity for you to jump in and have me condemn Jews and I will have no part of it.

I admire the Jews for accepting God, ANd pray that they will see that he is indeed part of the Trinity. Its as simple of that. So I want to stop you in your Tracks. I love and respect the Jews for the faith that they have, And pray that they can Come into the Grace that I was gifted with and come to accept Jesus Christ. ANd Like I told you its happening more and more every day.
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What about those who don’t, because they just can’t accept the evidence given to them by Catholic apologists? Will they go to Hell?
 
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