Nothing of man is pure: science, secular philosophy, psychology as you said. The pursuit of these endeavors is corrupt by the same failings of people that you might attribute to the failings of religion. I never said you said that religion is cult but why stop short? Why do you hold these secular ideals
I have never seen an oxygen or a hydrogen atom but I still believe in them. I agree that 1+1 = 2 also but I am sure I could argue against that somehow also. I think I had a class on that once.
Your wrong about your statue idea.
Just because you know there is no god, doesn’t mean that there is no God, thank God. Prove it.
I had to look up fallacious. It made me laugh. I don’t think my logic was “fallacious” because I really wasn’t claiming I was right, I was just asking the question.
But I do think the weight of circumstantial evidence shows there is no god … but it can’t be conclusively proven to the level that would satisfy a zealous religious person. Even beyond a reasonable doubt won’t allay religion, and religion can be debunked beyond a reasonable doubt. The fact is religion is not reasonable (just ask Martin Luther who called reason
the whore of the devil).
First, we can observe space & even matter we cannot directly observe we know exists because we can see its reflection. So where are all these angels, demons, and various other figures who seem elude our most powerful telescopes?
Second, god only manifested himself to ancient man and stopped manifesting himself when man began explaining natural phenomena with science. To try and analogize let’s say I claim I witnessed pink elephants flying over the night sky in New York on November 12th last year. Even if I’m the most credible person on earth no one will believe me unless they have proof. Years and years go by and no ever sees pink elephants flying over NYC (or anywhere else on earth for that matter) and in fact there is no incident of a verified sighting of pink elephants in recorded history. Will you believe me? Of course not right?
We have reports from ancient men of unverified and unprovable manifestations of a god. We have nothing else. In fact we don’t even have direct reports, we only have copies of alleged manuscripts that aver a god man walked the earth raising people from death, who was himself executed and rose from the dead. In the even more distant past (during a period of human history where virtually every society on earth believed in various versions of bizarre mythology and were incredibly superstitious) we have reports of a god splitting an ocean, turning sticks into snakes, rivers into blood, destroying cities, flooding the entire earth, etc. etc. Yet today this god who ancient reports claim is all powerful, invisibly present everywhere and at all times, and governs the universe is seemingly gone.
Not only is he gone, but like my friends who demand proof that pink elephants were flying around the NYC night sky, this god has disappeared just as mankind began demanding real proof that he exists? Hmmm pretty convenient don’t you think. Men have been convicted with far less evidence in our court rooms.
This is proof beyond a “reasonable” doubt … but the key word is reasonable. The authors of the bible anticipated these objections (indeed even back then very few people, certainly no one with a high degree of intelligence, believed them).
You can’t say what I’m saying is unreasonable or untrue … all you can do is rebut me by asking questions like what could have been their motivation? What about the martyrs?
First, it goes without saying that it’s not hard for people to find things they’re willing to die for. Look at Islamic radicals today (I think enough said). So martyrdom proves nothing.
As far motive, what’s anyone’s motive for anything? Usually it’s their (as Nietzsche would call it) “
will to power.”
