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Shadowcry
Guest
Lol how do we know your not making allthis up inJesus.
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ashok
Guest
now u start thinking. now u realise what is actually happening. now u understood what is ‘insulting degrading attitude’
see, mike, i didn’t even critcise jesus. i merely criticise the idea of Trinity, a later invention that came into being long after jesus mainly due to an enemy of Jesus, paul. paul is decidedly the main traitor & not the judas. judas just paved the way to jesus’ arrest and later he repent & he probably committed suicide as an atonement to his crime & betrayal.
jesus appeared not dead on the tree to become accursed of God and God verily must have saved his own approved man by not going against Torah’s law. otherwise either Torah’s law is totally wrong or paul is a deceiver to misuse Torah’s verse to justify his own enemosity towards jesus.
paul actually hated jesus. no miracle of jesus nor his birth without human father, stopped paul to harrass followers of jesus. his vision was a hoax, a pretext to start a new compaign of harrassing jesus’ followers & destroying completely all the true requirements of Eternal life.
but remember paul was not an ordinary man. he was a jew. a very sharp man & a pharisee as per his own testimony & was not from Nazerath. he had a mission to either destroy jesus’ mission by harrasing his followers & punishing them or turn jesus’ message into a pagan religion by over-praising jesus. in both case jews would be winners & Romans would be winners for who paul was actaully working. in other words paul was on the payroll of Romans with a job to stop the threat of jesus’ message. b’cause Romans, just like any other tyrant, were afraid from jesus’ popularity & his message. following jesus means rejecting the tyranny of Romans & their rule.
Romans used paul b’cause he had all deceptive elements in his personlaity that they were needed to eradicate jesus in an unfelt manner. over-praising jesus, after jesus is gone, is a strong tool to destroy the message of jesus, as they wished. this is what paul did. he decieved ppl with his over-praising jesus, thus justifying jesus’ “death” & then to make ppl forget the essentiality of law observance. once law looses it’s ground & essentiality, there is nothing left in jesus’ message. now what is left is his personality instead of his message. now the message & the messenger is carefully seperated in an unfelt fashion. messenger became more important than what messenger stood for. so ppl forgot what jesus demanded from his nation, jews, scribes and the pharisees. hence they started worshipping jesus to fill the gap of their faith, created by paul with his devilish act.
so, if i critisise paul & ur idea of trinity, i am not actually insulting ur faith at all. rather i am asking u to put urself back on the right track, the track that jesus wanted to u follow. & that is following the law of God of Jesus & God Moses & God of Rama, Krishna & Buddha. this law iwas the key to the Eternal life for Jesus’ jew-nation b’cause he was sent to his jew-nation only.
thus i am not criticising jesus nor ur actual faith that supposed to be b’cause the incestuous idea of Trinity which is as per Dr. zakir Naik, thrown out recently from your very skriptures. it is One John Chap. 5 verse 7. check this verse up in old versions of ur Bibles & compare it in the new versions of your or protestant Bibles. b’cause when Dr. zakir Naik gives any reference he confirms & makes sure everything. his explanation is very clear and straight & he leaves no confusion.
if u think i am insulting incestuous idea of Trinity then those who added One John Chap. 5 verse 7 into ur skriptures too have already not just insulted a multitude of Christiansdom but mocked the very religion of jesus. because jesus did not uttered One John Chap. 5 verse 7. it was a sidenote of an unknown author of your Biblical book who interpolated it into ur skriptures. & ur churchmen, blindly accepted & fooled millions of ur christian world.
did any Hindu or a Muslim added One John Chap. 5 verse 7 in ur holy Bible? did any Buddhist or Jew found out later that it was an interpolation? no, it was ur churchmen, bibles experts who after 2000 years realised recently that One John Chap. 5 verse 7 is not a holy verse.
did any Buddhist added a verse into ur skriptures which says that ur God will act like a hair cutter and shave hair between ur legs (around ur private parts of men and women) with a rented razor? how dare u mock holiness of God with this type of nonsense attribution?
would any child with basic common sense will…
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ashok
Guest
mike,
would any child with basic common sense will ever believe that his mercifull God will shave hair of his/her private areas-genitals/vaginas? what kind of a God is this who is waiting in His hair salon with a rented razor to shave all hairs of his own ppl? He doesn’t even own a razor? He is very poor god. if i tell what i read in ur Bible to my 2 yrs old when becomes mature, what do u think he will think of me? he will be thinking i am out of my mind or the Bible contains foolish ideas thus cannot be from loving God.
if i force my kid to accept ur God’s acts of shaving hairs of private parts as a holy verse, he either will think i must be joking or going to cry or he will ask me to see a psychiatrist to check my head for believing in such nonsensical verse of ur Bible.
how dare u call my rightfull justifiable healthy criticism, an insult, when ur own churches and bible experts have already mocked and fooled millions of you, for centuries & kept you in dark.
how dare u call my rightfull research, an insult, when ur church realised her bloody compaign of killing millions of kids of God (jews) but only after 1500 years, & first time in church history but only after millions of innocent jews already have lost their precious lives. they had only options of either embrace christianity of paul or ready to die or go in exile & take refuge in Muslem/Arab lands.
how dare u call my rightfull critical study of ur skriptures, an insult when i do found the light in the words of jesus which is still there even after lot of corruption, adulteration of paul & ur churchmen.
am i insulting jesus, if i ask u to follow jesus’ uttered words or the ones who destroyed the very call of jesus by unwanted un-required over-praisement of jesus personality?
if u over-praise ur dad or mom & then don’t listen to their advices & teachings, should i still call u an obedient & loving son of ur parents? of course not. b’cause ur over-praising ur parents means nothing. u would be called an obedient to your parents, a true son, only when u follow their advices and teachings. thus ur over-praising is foolish. thus if i call you a fool, i am not insulting ur parents, though u r their son. on the contrary i am the one who resepct ur parents because i am asking u to listen to ur parents’ advices & teachings if u really want to be called a beloved son of ur parents in true sense.
now how dare u call my raised points, an insult, when I simply showed u the mirror. & this is what jesus is going to do with u all on his 2nd coming, he will reject MANY of u, b’cause u are basically r not his sheep, but blind followers of jesus’ enemy-paul. u r lost in the misery created by paul. wake up and don’t be in the MANY of those who will be rejected by jesus. don’t over praise jesus. listen to what jesus demanded.
would any child with basic common sense will ever believe that his mercifull God will shave hair of his/her private areas-genitals/vaginas? what kind of a God is this who is waiting in His hair salon with a rented razor to shave all hairs of his own ppl? He doesn’t even own a razor? He is very poor god. if i tell what i read in ur Bible to my 2 yrs old when becomes mature, what do u think he will think of me? he will be thinking i am out of my mind or the Bible contains foolish ideas thus cannot be from loving God.
if i force my kid to accept ur God’s acts of shaving hairs of private parts as a holy verse, he either will think i must be joking or going to cry or he will ask me to see a psychiatrist to check my head for believing in such nonsensical verse of ur Bible.
how dare u call my rightfull justifiable healthy criticism, an insult, when ur own churches and bible experts have already mocked and fooled millions of you, for centuries & kept you in dark.
how dare u call my rightfull research, an insult, when ur church realised her bloody compaign of killing millions of kids of God (jews) but only after 1500 years, & first time in church history but only after millions of innocent jews already have lost their precious lives. they had only options of either embrace christianity of paul or ready to die or go in exile & take refuge in Muslem/Arab lands.
how dare u call my rightfull critical study of ur skriptures, an insult when i do found the light in the words of jesus which is still there even after lot of corruption, adulteration of paul & ur churchmen.
am i insulting jesus, if i ask u to follow jesus’ uttered words or the ones who destroyed the very call of jesus by unwanted un-required over-praisement of jesus personality?
if u over-praise ur dad or mom & then don’t listen to their advices & teachings, should i still call u an obedient & loving son of ur parents? of course not. b’cause ur over-praising ur parents means nothing. u would be called an obedient to your parents, a true son, only when u follow their advices and teachings. thus ur over-praising is foolish. thus if i call you a fool, i am not insulting ur parents, though u r their son. on the contrary i am the one who resepct ur parents because i am asking u to listen to ur parents’ advices & teachings if u really want to be called a beloved son of ur parents in true sense.
now how dare u call my raised points, an insult, when I simply showed u the mirror. & this is what jesus is going to do with u all on his 2nd coming, he will reject MANY of u, b’cause u are basically r not his sheep, but blind followers of jesus’ enemy-paul. u r lost in the misery created by paul. wake up and don’t be in the MANY of those who will be rejected by jesus. don’t over praise jesus. listen to what jesus demanded.
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inJESUS
Guest
lying is a sin.
B
Booklover
Guest
What about all those christians who pray quietly without making a show of themselves, as Jesus told us to do?
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meedo
Guest
hello all,
Ashok, i am a muslim, but i dont see any constructive idea of insulting the trinity dogma. You can critisize constructively and i am sure most will have no problem with that . But your antagonizing words does more harm than good.
Allah has forbiden us in the Quran to insult other peoples Gods . I guess we can project that on the core of their beliefs as well. Again , this doesnt mean we cant have a constructive debate about it and have a constructive critisizm.
For the members of this forum, please accept my appology .
One remark i wanetd to add , and its a huge misunderstanding, people say that in Islam a person is in charge of his own salvation .
Actually thats completly wrong. But lets say that salvation in Islam consists of 2 sections and not just one section ,
1- Belief in Allah as the one and only God worthy of worhip and the belief in his messengers and books and angels etc…’
2- The belief that none will deserve salvation with deeds. But Only through the mercy of Allah .
MOREOVER…
3-you must do good deeds and refrain from the bad .
ALL are required as a criteria of salvation .
So in that sense it is MORE demanding than christianity. and includes its criteria of salvation too. not replace it.
regards
Meedo
Ashok, i am a muslim, but i dont see any constructive idea of insulting the trinity dogma. You can critisize constructively and i am sure most will have no problem with that . But your antagonizing words does more harm than good.
Allah has forbiden us in the Quran to insult other peoples Gods . I guess we can project that on the core of their beliefs as well. Again , this doesnt mean we cant have a constructive debate about it and have a constructive critisizm.
For the members of this forum, please accept my appology .
One remark i wanetd to add , and its a huge misunderstanding, people say that in Islam a person is in charge of his own salvation .
Actually thats completly wrong. But lets say that salvation in Islam consists of 2 sections and not just one section ,
1- Belief in Allah as the one and only God worthy of worhip and the belief in his messengers and books and angels etc…’
2- The belief that none will deserve salvation with deeds. But Only through the mercy of Allah .
MOREOVER…
3-you must do good deeds and refrain from the bad .
ALL are required as a criteria of salvation .
So in that sense it is MORE demanding than christianity. and includes its criteria of salvation too. not replace it.
regards
Meedo
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Liberalsaved
Guest
I can’t go to Church with my family. It’s just an excuse for them to show off their best clothes. Apparently if your jeans are ratty God doesn’t listen to you.
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cestusdei
Guest
Muslim,
While I am delighted that you are entertained by my opinions you should consider that in an Islamic country I would be killed for expressing them.
While I am delighted that you are entertained by my opinions you should consider that in an Islamic country I would be killed for expressing them.
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cestusdei
Guest
ashok is a perfect example of the ignorance muslims have about Christ and Christianity. It is mindboggling.
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Reuben_J
Guest
Surprise of all suprises. Converting because of marraige is never stupid. My wife converted to Catholicism when she married me because I wanted her to and so that we could get married in the church without the hustle of her being a non-Catholic. And I wanted our children to be brought up Catholics too.
The man in question is smart enough to become a Muslim through marraige to a Muslim girl. If he truly want to avoid the problem of being a non-Muslim husband! And I’m sure he will become a good Muslim as my wife have become a good Catholic!
The question is actually - shall one leave the religion of one’s faith? **If you are entrenched enough in your belief, convicted in it and understand it, you will not going to abandon it. **
This is the problem of Catholics today. Sure Catholic parents bring up their children as Catholics but by and large leave the formation and the teaching to the church to such activities like the CCDs or the Sunday schools. How many parents are actually living up the Christian life and show the examples to their children? Thus children as such will never truly experience the goodness of their faith and they see church and religous activities as just mere chores which they don’t like.
And we can’t keep our children in the church if they want to leave as there is no law outside of it to stop them from converting. The stigma among Catholics society is not strong enough to act as a deterrent to stop them from leaving. But the Islamic situation is just different. The pressure from the family is enough, if the Islamic government has not already ensured it, to stop them from coverting to other religion.
A good example is the conversion of Abdul Rahmen to Christianity in Afghanistan. Thus in a matter of marriage, most of the time it will be Christians coverting to Muslims just to follow the would be spouses’ religion. Of course there are many instances of the opposite that are happening too.
Peace.
Reuben
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Muslim
Guest
Reuben J:
i would never force or tell my wife (if she is a Christian/Jew) to convert to Islam. it has to come from within… I will tell her about Islam like I am supposed to but I can’t tell her to convert, thats unIslamic…
i dont mind marrying a Christian woman… if she is a good and devout Christian woman…then again i am only 20… not really concerned about marriage…
it is hard to find good Christian family nowadays who still has traditional values…and even if you hate me, you know you agree with me… like i mentioned before, if all the “Christians” in America acted like one, we would be in a much better situation.
well, its good that your wife converted…but did she do it out of her own will?
i would never force or tell my wife (if she is a Christian/Jew) to convert to Islam. it has to come from within… I will tell her about Islam like I am supposed to but I can’t tell her to convert, thats unIslamic…
i dont mind marrying a Christian woman… if she is a good and devout Christian woman…then again i am only 20… not really concerned about marriage…
it is hard to find good Christian family nowadays who still has traditional values…and even if you hate me, you know you agree with me… like i mentioned before, if all the “Christians” in America acted like one, we would be in a much better situation.
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Mike_D30
Guest
No one hates you and you’re being respectful which is refreshing. But I disagree with the statement you made, I think there are still a good amount of devout Christians in America. I think America’s in your face media and advertisers, that constantly makes people feel that if they aren’t into shallow activities, superficial possesions, and sexual perverts they’re worthless, warps peoples view of American Christians.
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Shadowcry
Guest
so is prejudice.
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Shadowcry
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Except he is hindu. You are totally ignorant.
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Mike_D30
Guest
No he isn’t, he said he was Hindu, but is Muslim now.
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Muslim
Guest
by that do you mean i was not respectful before? i am always respectful of christians, jews, etc. i just dont disrespect ignorant people who are old enough to know right from wrong…
but, yes… i live in nyc…so i live in an urban place where there arent really too many Christians left… and everything revolves around sex, drugs, alcohol, etc… thats why I guess I have not met too many devout Christian people…
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Reuben_J
Guest
Thank you for being so charitable here. I want you to know that we really appreciate this kind gesture. I have found that there are dearths of Muslims here who want to dialogue genuinely on inter-religious issues. Maybe it is because of lack of knowledge of Christianity, wanting to ridicule or just to proselytize. The sad thing is we too begin to respond with our own sarcasm which contributes to the declining quality of the discussion.
May God bless you.
Reuben.
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Reuben_J
Guest
I know you may mean it in a different way, but I don’t hate you, brother, as I don’t hate any of the Muslims here.
Only some of you guys do not discuss properly and that’s disappointing.
and BTW there are still many good Catholic families around. If you don’t see one, maybe you haven’t met one yet and you need to expand on your networking.
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Mike_D30
Guest
No I just said you were being respectful, I haven’t seen any of your other posts.
I live in NYC too, you should come to my daily Mass I go to, you can see plenty of NYC devout Christians. NYC is very decadent, but it is a city of 8 million, and as a Muslim you don’t attend Churches. Saying you can’t find devout Christians in NYC is erroneous, it’s just that NYC’s decadence can distort ones view of the city as a whole, most of the city is full of hard working families, and good people. What people see at times are the rich, famous, drugs, nightlife, and decadence, but that doesn’t mean it is a fair representation of NY’ers, or American Christians as a whole. That would be akin to thinking that the Muslims about to kill the Christian convert, represent all Muslims.
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inJESUS
Guest
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