Babies At Mass

[netmilsmom]

Good for you that you are the perfect parent that has raised perfect children who never scream and never cry and never misbehave. Good for you that you never felt exhausted in Church and never delayed intervening with your children instantly every single time. Good for you that each and every time your children even displayed some restlessness you were able to whisk them out of the main body before anyone even noticed. Good for you that you are able to instantly discern a good parent from a bad parent. You, by far, win the best Catholic parent of all time award.

Yet, if I may humbly request, please understand the rest of us are still a work in progress and have not yet reached perfection as you have. We still get tired, we still get frustrated, we still get mortified when our kids act-up in Church, we still try, try, try to teach and train our kids to behave in all places including Church. Yet, apparently, the rest of us have not been given the parenting gifts you received…I am truly sorry that the presence of my children might bother you, perhaps I should leave them at home. Or perhaps they do not belong in Church at all.

Good sarcasm!
Guess you missed the posts from me about the parents who are still in silent prayer.
netmil(name removed by moderator):

Let me just state here. If your child goes off in Holy Mass, it’s a normal occurance. If it lasts for longer than five minutes and you have done nothing to stop it or smile at it, your behavior is offensive.

It’s not a “bad” parent situation, it’s an inconsiderate human situation.

 

[Tom317]

Good sarcasm!
Guess you missed the posts from me about the parents who are still in silent prayer.

Thanx, I try.

Seriously, you are coming off as a very arrogant self-righteous Catholic, and I am certain you would not want to be seen as such. You do not have the first clue what is going on in someone else’s life, yet you seem more then willing to slam them into their proper place and behaivor. I pray that when/if you ever encounter problems, that people around you will show more love then you are on this thread.

If I were a weak Catholic reading your posts, I would take my kids and run as quickly as I could to any Church other then a Catholic Church…yours is the most unwelcoming, unloving, cold-hearted attitude I have yet seen on this entire board. You do not appear to give a whit what other parents might be suffering or what the problems with their children might be, you only see life through the lens of your perfect parenting skills and you will not tolerate anyone who does not attain your level of perfection.

May God Bless you fully with a more loving heart towards fellow Christians who are trying to make their way through this tough valley of tears.

 

[netmilsmom]

This is COMPLETLY unfair to the poster and to the rest of us on this board. NO ONE has said anything like that!

You are there to worship God, pure and simple. If someone can not hear, big deal, continue worshipping God.

If other children feed off it then that is the other parents problems.

Try ignoring it. Most of us with children do

 

[Marauder]

And what makes you think I’m not in church with them?

If you punch my husband in the nose, I’m I not suppose to judge you?
I don’t hate you, but I sure do dislike your actions.

Wow from judging parents on how they discipline their kids to me punching your husband. Major leap.

Sorry I wouldn’t be punching your husband because I would be busy at Mass worshiping God, not paying attention to your husband.

Sounds to me like you are trying to justify judging that actions of others, when you should be concentrating on worshiping God.

 

[Karin]

If you do not like the behaivor of a certain family or child, then pray for them, then after Mass say hello to them and thank them for coming to Mass, perhaps even offer to help them with their children in the future. Yet, please stop thinking ill thoughts of them and cease bashing them and talking poorly of them, because they too are children of God and God welcomes them into HIS House.

First comes love!

I think this needs repeating once again…in case somebody missed it

 

[netmilsmom]

Thanx, I try.

Seriously, you are coming off as a very arrogant self-righteous Catholic, and I am certain you would not want to be seen as such. You do not have the first clue what is going on in someone else’s life, yet you seem more then willing to slam them into their proper place and behaivor. I pray that when/if you ever encounter problems, that people around you will show more love then you are on this thread.

Have you read my tagline? I know what I’m writing and I know how you are reading them. Frankly, it doesn’t matter to me at all.

If I were a weak Catholic reading your posts, I would take my kids and run as quickly as I could to any Church other then a Catholic Church…yours is the most unwelcoming, unloving, cold-hearted attitude I have yet seen on this entire board.

Sorry you feel this way. Honestly can sometimes hurt. People who don’t like what I’m saying are going to totally disregard me anyway. If some “weak Catholic” is reading an internet post and deciding to go to mass or not, there’s really not much you or I could do to stop it. They are looking for an excuse. If it wasn’t me, it would be anything else.

You do not appear to give a whit what other parents might be suffering or what the problems with their children might be, you only see life through the lens of your perfect parenting skills and you will not tolerate anyone who does not attain your level of perfection.

May God Bless you fully with a more loving heart towards fellow Christians who are trying to make their way through this tough valley of tears.

You’re really missing the common consideration part. I don’t feel like repeating it (I just got finished watching the 2 & 4 year olds of a fellow parishioner). Of course I put my Anti-child attitude in the closet during that time.

 

[Jennifer_J]

netmil(name removed by moderator):
None of those quotes said that distracted/distractable people are UNWELCOME, only that they need to take it upon themselves (or their caregivers) to find a solution. AGAIN, those of us with the potential to distract (ie those with children, those with disorders that cause them to make noise, etc) are not mindreaders. I can’t possible know that I’m sitting next to someone who can’t hear well, or who has attention problems. HOW COULD I POSSIBLY KNOW THAT???

All are welcome at Mass, esp those who need the Grace of Jesus–and that’s pretty much all of us.

Jennifer

 

[Karin]

If you do not like the behaivor of a certain family or child, then pray for them, then after Mass say hello to them and thank them for coming to Mass, perhaps even offer to help them with their children in the future. Yet, please stop thinking ill thoughts of them and cease bashing them and talking poorly of them, because they too are children of God and God welcomes them into HIS House.

First comes love!

I think this needs repeating once again…in case somebody missed it

 

[jmcrae]

I can’t possible know that I’m sitting next to someone who can’t hear well, or who has attention problems. HOW COULD I POSSIBLY KNOW THAT???

No, but surely you are aware of when your child is dancing the tap-dance in hard shoes on the pew, or when he is yelling “ippydibbydobbydiddydongydaddydonnydubby” at the top of his lungs, or if he is hanging on the edge of the pew in such a way that will cause him to bang his head on the edge of it and let out a wailing yell - and you know your child well enough to know how to make this behaviour stop before it becomes a long-drawn-out distraction to others.

Instead of just sitting there, pretending that he is someone else’s child, or that his behaviour is none of your business.

Not that you would ever do that - but I have seen parents who do this, in the philosophy that just being at Mass is good for the child, whether he (or anyone else) hears any of what goes on, or not.

Nobody expects children to behave perfectly - the occasional yelp and the occasional babbling is to be expected - but people do expect parents to correct their children in a timely manner, and help them to participate effectively at Mass.

All are welcome at Mass, esp those who need the Grace of Jesus–and that’s pretty much all of us.

Absolutely. Respecting the sacred silence of the Church is part of how we create a welcoming environment for all - including the children.

 

[Tom317]

I think this needs repeating once again…in case somebody missed it

Thank you for highlighting that statement. It is very sad that about half of the people here do not get that simple idea.

 

[Tom317]

jmcrae,

So, you are also a perfect parent? Wow, this thread sure is blessed to have at least two perfect parents present to dispense advice, discipline and correction to us more lowly parents who just cannot attain your level of expertise.

 

[Tom317]

netmil(name removed by moderator),

Sadly, you are correct, you tagline says it all. I should have paid closer attention to that because it would have told me a lot about you before jumping into a long wasted conversation.

God Bless.

 

[jmcrae]

jmcrae,

So, you are also a perfect parent? Wow, this thread sure is blessed to have at least two perfect parents present to dispense advice, discipline and correction to us more lowly parents who just cannot attain your level of expertise.

Why is it so hard to just correct your kid at the moment of the misbehaviour? What’s so “perfect” about that?

 

[Tom317]

Why is it so hard to just correct your kid at the moment of the misbehaviour? What’s so “perfect” about that?

Nothing, my wife and I do it all the time when our kids act up. And yes, parents should control their children. I guess I have a great deal, and I mean a great deal, of compassion for parents because their’s is the hardest job on earth and there is nothing perfect about raising good Catholic children, it is filled with human mistakes, errors, sins and problems and every single parent goes through it, even if they refuse to acknowledge it. I would venture a guess that some of the people here who are attacking parents and kids are guilty of having kids create quite a problem during Mass, yet they probably do not think so because they are perfect parents in their own view.

Where we disagree is this pervasive attitude of “knowing others” on this thread. The bottom line is we just cannot know what is going on with our nieghbor during Mass. The parent might have gotten horrible news just before going to Mass, but felt that being with the Lord is exactly what they needed at that moment, it could be cancer, a dying loved one, a lost job, a sick child, any number of difficult things can lead grown adults to not be fully on the task of watching their kids as closely as they should. There is no way to know if those parents have circumstances that lead them to partially disengage, or are they just lousy parents. Since we cannot know their lives, we must give love rather then hate! We must sow compassion, rather then bitterness; sow understanding rather then misplaced correction.

When I say “perfect” it is clearly sarcasm, yet it goes to the point that only someone perfect (God) can know the circumstances of every person in a Church during Mass…we are well advised to leave those children and their parents in God’s hands and just rejoice in the knowledge that Catholics are still having kids in this country and that kids are worth smiling about even when they are not perfect.

 

[BlyssfulDreamer]

I would assume that’s where the dirty diapers came from, yes. But I mentioned this little anecdote to show that the cry room isn’t the one-size-fits-all solution. I don’t have kids, but I’ve heard cry rooms can be downright hellish places.

A hellish place at a church? That is interesting…and indeed if it were…is it not to the advantage of the parisioners to take it upon themselves to make it more inviting? I have taken several books and items that my grandson has “outgrown” for the use of the children. I am sure no one would run a person off if they were to try to make the room and more appealing place to bring children when the need be.

:heart:Blyss

 

[Karin]

A hellish place at a church? That is interesting…and indeed if it were…is it not to the advantage of the parisioners to take it upon themselves to make it more inviting? I have taken several books and items that my grandson has “outgrown” for the use of the children. I am sure no one would run a person off if they were to try to make the room and more appealing place to bring children when the need be.

:heart:Blyss

I have a bunch of “junk” that I need to get rid of too…can I dump it off at your isolation room …for the benefit of the kiddies of course

 

[BlyssfulDreamer]

That is your view and you are very much entitled to it. I feel this thread reflects a very troubling anti-kid attitude.

I think, Tom that you are trying to deflect from the issue of misbehaving children and parents who do not at least make the attempt to make it easier both on the child and on those around them. You do not do your argument any good by making those of us who do not feel the way you do by labeling our thoughts as anti-kid.

:heart:Blyss

 

[BlyssfulDreamer]

Like it or not, we live in a differrent world then even just ten years ago. Many kids come from broken homes, a huge percentage actually. Many kids have parents that both work, causing less time for the required training each kid should get. Many kids are victims of a home in which parents are rarely present and have no time for their kids when they are present. The days of moms being able to stay home are long gone, and for many parents (moms and dads) it is a moral vitory just to be able to get their kids to Church, much less have time to train and discipline them properly.

We live in a different world than 30-40 year ago too…so what? Aren’t the basics the same? You, (not you personally Tom) as a parent have the obligation to raise your children to behave properly when in public. I am not talking about the occasional 2 year old who is bored or frustrated. I am talking about the kids who run along the pews, throw rice krispies at other members and who continually chatter, yell, whine and moan and Mom and Dad are sitting there oblivious. It tells me that they are probably that way at home. Are you giving a pass to parents because they have to work to support their families or their families lifestyles? If your child isn’t getting enough of your time for training…or whatever then maybe the parent should readjust their schedule to MAKE time for their children.As if a parent should have to TRY to make time for their own children… The first obligation when a person becomes a parent is to take care of their children…emotionally, physically and every other way. IF you cannot make time for what is involved in raising a child then don’t make them society’s problem. Little Susie is a cutie…but I don’t go to Mass to have rice krispies hurled at me. That isn’t cute and it isn’t acceptable.

:heart:Blyss

 

[Tom317]

I think, Tom that you are trying to deflect from the issue of misbehaving children and parents who do not at least make the attempt to make it easier both on the child and on those around them. You do not do your argument any good by making those of us who do not feel the way you do by labeling our thoughts as anti-kid.

:heart:Blyss

I only wrote what I truly believe.

 

[Tom317]

We live in a different world than 30-40 year ago too…so what? Aren’t the basics the same? You, (not you personally Tom) as a parent have the obligation to raise your children to behave properly when in public. I am not talking about the occasional 2 year old who is bored or frustrated. I am talking about the kids who run along the pews, throw rice krispies at other members and who continually chatter, yell, whine and moan and Mom and Dad are sitting there oblivious. It tells me that they are probably that way at home. Are you giving a pass to parents because they have to work to support their families or their families lifestyles? If your child isn’t getting enough of your time for training…or whatever then maybe the parent should readjust their schedule to MAKE time for their children.As if a parent should have to TRY to make time for their own children… The first obligation when a person becomes a parent is to take care of their children…emotionally, physically and every other way. IF you cannot make time for what is involved in raising a child then don’t make them society’s problem. Little Susie is a cutie…but I don’t go to Mass to have rice krispies hurled at me. That isn’t cute and it isn’t acceptable.

:heart:Blyss

I am not defending bad behaivor because bad behaivor is still “bad.” However, what I am defending is parents and kids who very well might be in situations that you seem incapable or unwilling to accept. The examples of kids running the aisles or throwing food is so extreme as to be nearly laughable and I will not bother to address such a ridiculous example because everyone knows that is over the top.

I am sick of people deciding they know how everyone else is supposed to live and act without ever living in their shoes or even having the politeness to try to understand why they are acting certain ways. We are a family, not a group of enemies.