Baptism and Confirmation certificates required for getting married

[Phemie]

That is not correct. When I became a Catholic in 1992 I received a Certificate of Reconciliation (first Confession) and when I was confirmed I received a Confirmation Certificate signed by the Bishop.

Different parishes do things differently. No certificates were issued when my brothers and I were baptized, confirmed, went to confession and Communion for the first time.

By the time our youngest was Baptized, getting the certificates had become almost as important as receiving the sacrament. In some cases over the last couple of years I’ve even has cause to ask myself if the piece of paper had not become more important than the sacrament. In many cases the decorative certificates handed out do not bear the parish seal so they are not useful to prove anything.

 

[Gorgias]

That is not correct. When I became a Catholic in 1992 I received a Certificate of Reconciliation (first Confession) and when I was confirmed I received a Confirmation Certificate signed by the Bishop.

You’re talking about something different, though, aren’t you?

On one hand, there’s a document that people tend to get when they receive sacraments, as a memento of that occasion.

On the other hand, you’re asking about the documentation needed for marriage: in this case, there’s simply an extract from the parish registers, which identifies the sacraments you have (and haven’t!) received to date. This is the one that’s needed for marriage – not copies, as it were, or even recreations of those documents you received throughout your life.

 

[babochka]

I’m guessing it’s assumed that First Reconciliation and First Communion have been received if someone is confirmed. Obviously that’s not a guarantee but it’s probably true for most Catholics, Western or Eastern.

I would say it isn’t a safe assumption in the East, if a child received First Communion at Baptism. Sadly, it would not be uncommon for a family to bring a child for baptism, but not come to church regularly thereafter, which would mean that the child never had a first confession.

 

[Gorgias]

I would say it isn’t a safe assumption in the East, if a child received First Communion at Baptism. Sadly, it would not be uncommon for a family to bring a child for baptism, but not come to church regularly thereafter, which would mean that the child never had a first confession.

It’s my understanding, though, that (at least in Latin Rite parishes, and at least here in my corner of the U.S.) those preparing children for 1st Holy Communion verify that the children have been baptized, and those preparing youths for Confirmation verify that they have received baptism and 1st Holy Communion. The extracts gathered for the sake of Confirmation prep aren’t retained, but the verification takes place.

 

[babochka]

Different parishes do things differently. No certificates were issued when my brothers and I were baptized, confirmed, went to confession and Communion for the first time.

By the time our youngest was Baptized, getting the certificates had become almost as important as receiving the sacrament. In some cases over the last couple of years I’ve even has cause to ask myself if the piece of paper had not become more important than the sacrament. In many cases the decorative certificates handed out do not bear the parish seal so they are not useful to prove anything.

None of my children have received a certificate for First Confession. I would think that certificates (with the parish seal) would be important for non-repeatable Sacraments, though, and marriage, in case there in an error in the parish registry. One of my children was baptized in a Latin Rite parish, but she was chrismated several months later in the Byzantine parish, but when record of her Chrismation was sent to the baptismal parish, they sent back a notice saying that they had no record of her baptism. Of course, we had provided her baptismal certificate to the priest prior to her Chrismation. It worked out; they had just made an error in the search, but it required quite a bit of annoying legwork to get it properly recorded, and involved producing her original certificate more than once. For one of my priest’s kids, the parish register shows her baptism as having occurred before she was born.

 

[babochka]

So to answer this question, no, it’s not just you. I’m not sure what is spelled out in Canon Law with this regard, but those requirements are the same ones I have encountered in the U.S. I don’t know if it’s universal or not, though.

Can. 535 §1. Each parish is to have parochial registers, that is, those of** baptisms, marriages, deaths, and others as prescribed by the conference of bishops or the diocesan bishop. The pastor is to see to it that these registers are accurately inscribed and carefully preserved.
§2. In the baptismal register are also to be noted confirmation and those things which pertain to the canonical status of the Christian faithful by reason of marriage, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 1133, of adoption, of the reception of sacred orders, of perpetual profession made in a religious institute, and of change of rite.** These notations are always to be noted on a baptismal certificate.

 

[babochka]

It’s my understanding, though, that (at least in Latin Rite parishes, and at least here in my corner of the U.S.) those preparing children for 1st Holy Communion verify that the children have been baptized, and those preparing youths for Confirmation verify that they have received baptism and 1st Holy Communion. The extracts gathered for the sake of Confirmation prep aren’t retained, but the verification takes place.

I was referring specifically to confession, though. The post I was responding to mentioned that it is assumed that First Reconciliation and First Communion have been received if someone is confirmed, and that that would be true in the East and West. In the East, it would be more likely, and perhaps even common, that someone had received the Sacraments of Initiation without having received Reconciliation. This would be less of a problem in the West.

 

[Phemie]

You’re talking about something different, though, aren’t you?

On one hand, there’s a document that people tend to get when they receive sacraments, as a memento of that occasion.

On the other hand, you’re asking about the documentation needed for marriage: in this case, there’s simply an extract from the parish registers, which identifies the sacraments you have (and haven’t!) received to date. This is the one that’s needed for marriage – not copies, as it were, or even recreations of those documents you received throughout your life.

We can argue semantics for hours but even the USCCB’s complementary norm to canon 1067 reads
3. Baptized Catholics should present a recently issued annotated baptismal certificate;

 

[Vico]

Can. 535 §1. Each parish is to have parochial registers, that is, those of** baptisms, marriages, deaths,** and others as prescribed by the conference of bishops or the diocesan bishop. The pastor is to see to it that these registers are accurately inscribed and carefully preserved.
§2. In the baptismal register are also to be noted** confirmation and those things which pertain to the canonical status of the Christian faithful by reason of marriage, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 1133, of adoption, of the reception of sacred orders, of perpetual profession made in a religious institute, and of change of rite.** These notations are always to be noted on a baptismal certificate.

And from CCEO (for eastern Catholics):Canon 296

1. In the parish there are to be parish books, namely, baptismal, matrimonial, death and others, according to the norms of the particular law of its own Church sui iuris or, if there are no norms, of the eparchial bishop himself; the pastor is to see to it that these parish books are properly filled out and preserved observing said norms.
2. In the baptismal register are also to be noted the enrollment of the baptized into a determined Church sui iuris according to the norm of can. 37, the administration of chrismation with holy myron as well as those things which pertain to the canonical status of the Christian faithful by reason of marriage, with due regard for can. 840, 3, adoption, and sacred orders or perpetual profession in a religious institute; these notations are always to be noted on the certificate of baptism.
   …

Canon 37

Every enrollment in a certain Church sui iuris or transfer to another Church sui iuris should be recorded in the baptismal register of the parish where the baptism was celebrated, even, as the case may be, in a Latin parish; if this cannot be done, it is to be kept by the proper pastor in another document in the archive of the parish of the Church sui iuris of enrollment.

 

[Gorgias]

Gorgias:

thistle:

That is not correct. When I became a Catholic in 1992 I received a Certificate of Reconciliation (first Confession) and when I was confirmed I received a Confirmation Certificate signed by the Bishop.

You’re talking about something different, though, aren’t you?We can argue semantics for hours but even the USCCB’s complementary norm to canon 1067 reads
3. Baptized Catholics should present a recently issued annotated baptismal certificate;

It’s not semantics. The certificate that thistle received in 1992, or the one he received at his confirmation, is not a “recently issued annotated baptismal certificate.”

 

[thistle]

It’s not semantics. The certificate that thistle received in 1992, or the one he received at his confirmation, is not a “recently issued annotated baptismal certificate.”

However, I was not responding to the need for a recently issued annotated baptismal certificate. I was responding to the poster who said a certificate of confirmation does not exist. It clearly does as I have one.

 

[phil19034]

However, I was not responding to the need for a recently issued annotated baptismal certificate. I was responding to the poster who said a certificate of confirmation does not exist. It clearly does as I have one.

Hi - to be clear, I was not referring to the type of certificate you received. I was referring to the type of certificate used to prove you received the sacraments. That’s the Baptismal Certificate.

There are certificates or official paperwork which is filed when we are confirmed, and there would absolutely be some kid of certificate or pAper work sent between parishes if the person was baptized in one parish and confirmed in another.

For example: when I received my Radical Sanation to recognize my marriage, I was given a copy of the document which was being sent to the parish I was baptized at. They gave it to me incase there was an issue. Also another copy was filed with my current Archdiocese since it was signed by the Bishop. My current parish might also have a copy, or at least an unofficial notation.

But the official certificate and the only certificate used is the Baptismal Certificate for what we are talking about.

God Bless

 

[Phemie]

But the official certificate and the only certificate used is the Baptismal Certificate for what we are talking about.

God Bless

Remember that someone also said that there is no such thing as an annotated Baptismal Certificate, that it’s a “sacramental register extract”,

 

[thistle]

Hi - to be clear, I was not referring to the type of certificate you received. I was referring to the type of certificate used to prove you received the sacraments. That’s the Baptismal Certificate.

There are certificates or official paperwork which is filed when we are confirmed, and there would absolutely be some kid of certificate or pAper work sent between parishes if the person was baptized in one parish and confirmed in another.

For example: when I received my Radical Sanation to recognize my marriage, I was given a copy of the document which was being sent to the parish I was baptized at. They gave it to me incase there was an issue. Also another copy was filed with my current Archdiocese since it was signed by the Bishop. My current parish might also have a copy, or at least an unofficial notation.

But the official certificate and the only certificate used is the Baptismal Certificate for what we are talking about.

God Bless

How does it work in a case, for example, when a baptised Methodist (baptism accepted as valid by the Catholic Church) goes through the RCIA program and is officially accepted into the Church (no Catholic baptism takes place and no certificate) and is then confirmed. What would happen in such a case when that person had to produce documents before getting married. The proof that they are Catholic is the Confirmation Certificate and not a baptism certificate.

 

[Gorgias]

How does it work in a case, for example, when a baptised Methodist (baptism accepted as valid by the Catholic Church) goes through the RCIA program and is officially accepted into the Church (no Catholic baptism takes place and no certificate) and is then confirmed. What would happen in such a case when that person had to produce documents before getting married. The proof that they are Catholic is the Confirmation Certificate and not a baptism certificate.

Actually, the document we use in our parish is a “Profession of Faith” document. It attests to the person’s entry into the Catholic Church. It, too, has a section for ‘notations’, on which parish personnel will write any other sacraments the person has received. Remember – the purpose of documentation at the time of marriage isn’t only to verify that the person is a baptized Christian, but also that they’re free to marry in the Church. Your ‘Confirmation Certificate’ doesn’t say anything about that, now, does it?

 

[phil19034]

How does it work in a case, for example, when a baptised Methodist (baptism accepted as valid by the Catholic Church) goes through the RCIA program and is officially accepted into the Church (no Catholic baptism takes place and no certificate) and is then confirmed. What would happen in such a case when that person had to produce documents before getting married. The proof that they are Catholic is the Confirmation Certificate and not a baptism certificate.

The “Baptism Certificate” is really a “sacramental register” or a “Profession of Faith” document.

We you request a copy of your Baptism Certificate, a new one is created. Its not a copy of the original one. It’s written out based on the sacramental register and all information is entered.

It’s kind of like asking your state for a copy of your birth certificate. They print out a new one and it’s signed by whomever is the current person authorized to sign.

 

[MissRose73]

I have my certificates for my Baptism, 1st Communion, 1st Confession and Confirmation. I had to bring them when I signed up with a parish some time ago. Not sure why they needed them but maybe they wanted to make sure I was not in need of sacramental prep perhapss.

 

[phil19034]

I have my certificates for my Baptism, 1st Communion, 1st Confession and Confirmation. I had to bring them when I signed up with a parish some time ago. Not sure why they needed them but maybe they wanted to make sure I was not in need of sacramental prep perhapss.

most likely so they would know if you are eligible to be a God parent.

 

[thistle]

**Actually, the document we use in our parish is a “Profession of Faith” document. It attests to the person’s entry into the Catholic Church. It, too, has a section for ‘notations’, on which parish personnel will write any other sacraments the person has received. ** Remember – the purpose of documentation at the time of marriage isn’t only to verify that the person is a baptized Christian, but also that they’re free to marry in the Church. Your ‘Confirmation Certificate’ doesn’t say anything about that, now, does it?

Okay. That answers my question.

As for the other part of your comments I bolded I have never suggested that (read my posts).
I started the thread to ask why the original baptism certificate and confirmation certificate are not sufficient. It has been discussed and now I know the reason.
I did not expect anyone to disparage the Sacrament of Confirmation and those being confirmed by putting confirmation certificate in quotes sarcastically, or stating they do not exist, or suggesting they are simply a souvenir.
That is a great injustice.

 

[Gorgias]

It’s kind of like asking your state for a copy of your birth certificate. They print out a new one and it’s signed by whomever is the current person authorized to sign.

Not exactly, and that’s what’s been causing the confusion in this thread. A re-issue of a civil birth certificate provides no new information – it simply shows the same information that the original has. On the other hand, a ‘sacramental register extract’ or a ‘profession of faith’ document has more information than the document(s) received at the time of the original reception of the sacrament(s): they also have notations on all other sacraments received. Therefore, these documents attest to the current status of a person, with respect to sacraments. That’s what makes these documents ‘different’ than a simple re-issue of original information. (In a way, each of these documents is like receiving a whole new set of documents – as if, when you went in to get a new civil birth certificate, they also provided you with driver’s license info, your marriage license(s), your divorce decree(s), etc, etc.)