Baptism Question

[PRmerger]

Our Lord Jesus Christ’s declaration that no man can be saved without being born again of water and the Holy Ghost is it not a literal dogma of the Catholic Church?

It is, indeed, a literal dogma of the CC.

Curious–what is your pastor’s teaching on whether newborn, unbaptized babies can go to heaven?

 

[Cathoholic]

KingdomSon. You said . . .

Even in CCC 1257 it states the following…

“God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.”

That’s why I quoted the CCC paragraph.

To remind us that God Himself “is not bound by his sacraments.”

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That’s what I have been showing by quoting former Popes who proclaimed boldly that Outside the Catholic Church There is No Salvation, some even speaking this “ex cathedra”(from the Chair of Peter).

But you cannot conclude from these teachings (which I wholeheartedly affirm) that someone who has been outside the Church cannot come INTO the Church on his/her deathbed.

You have to affirm ALL the Catholic teachings.

 

[KingdomSon]

It is, indeed, a literal dogma of the CC.

Yes, I know. I was just asking Cathoholic for his verification.

Pope Eugene IV, The Council of Florence, “Exultate Deo,” Nov. 22, 1439, ex cathedra: “Holy baptism, which is the gateway to the spiritual life, holds the first place among all the sacraments; through it we are made members of Christ and of the body of the Church. And since death entered the universe through the first man, ‘unless we are born again of water and the Spirit, we cannot,’ as the Truth says, ‘enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:5]. The matter of this sacrament is real and natural water.

PRmerger:

Curious–what is your pastor’s teaching on whether newborn,unbaptized babies can go to heaven?

Have no Shephard at this time. Doing my own personal studies at this moment before converting to the Catholic Church. So far, with the help of the Blessed Mother, I’m making headway there.

As to whether newborn, unbaptized babies can go to heaven. From my studies on this question I will only confirm what the Church already teaches, that no one can be saved without the Sacrament of Baptism. Obviously, therefore, this means that children and infants also cannot get to Heaven without Baptism because they are conceived in a state of original sin, which cannot be removed without the Sacrament of Baptism.

KingdomSon

 

[PRmerger]

Have no Shephard at this time.

Praying you find a shepherd!

One piece of advice: find the Church which Christ established, and conform your views to it…

Don’t shop for a church which preaches everything you believe, and then join it.

As to whether newborn, unbaptized babies can go to heaven. From my studies on this question I will only confirm what the Church already teaches, that no one can be saved without the Sacrament of Baptism. Obviously, therefore, this means that children and infants also cannot get to Heaven without Baptism because they are conceived in a state of original sin, which cannot be removed without the Sacrament of Baptism.

KingdomSon

Would you be surprised to know that the Church proclaims a whole bunch of little babie who died without the Sacrament of Baptism are in heaven? We (coincidentally) just celebrated their Feast day: Feast of the Holy Innocents.

 

[KingdomSon]

That’s why I quoted the CCC paragraph.

To remind us that God Himself “is not bound by his sacraments.”

Ok. We’re in agreement there

Cathoholic:

But you cannot conclude from these teachings (which I wholeheartedly affirm) that someone who has been outside the Church cannot come INTO the Church on his/her deathbed.

Right, since again, God is not bound by His sacraments. But let me stress again, that the general rule of Jesus Christ is Baptism is necessary for salvation (John 3:5). No pagan, Jew, Muslim, or other schismatic non-Catholic sects can obtain salvation outside of Christ’s Church, the Catholic Church, if they refuse to enter her according to Christ’s instructions for entrance.

Cathoholic:

You have to affirm ALL the Catholic teachings.

Yes, I know. Thanks

KingdomSon

 

[PRmerger]

No pagan, Jew, Muslim, or other schismatic non-Catholic sects can obtain salvation outside of Christ’s Church, the Catholic Church, if they refuse to enter her according to Christ’s instructions for entrance

Yes. This is correct.

Even a Christian who accepts Christ as his Lord and Savior, if he refuses to accept Christ’s instructions and will, cannot enter.