Baptist

[12volt_man]

Lazerlike42:

I cannot find an example of the sinner’s prayer in Scripture

You’re right. It’s not. No one has ever claimed that it is.

I also cannot find an example of Christians gathering in church on Sunday in Scripture.

Several times in Acts, we’re told that the NT church met on Sunday.

I cannot find an example of a pastor being paid in Scripture,

or of a sermon being given in Scripture.

Really? Jesus preached atthe Sermon on the Mount. Paul preached at Mars Hill. Both Peter and Stephen preached in the book of Acts.

Dozens upon dozens preached throughout the OT.

Why do baptists do these things?

Why not?

You’re confusing how we determine essential doctrines and how we handle matters of conscience. All of the things you’ve mentioned here are non-essentials.

 

[Mickey]

mercygate:

How conscious does the decision to follow Christ have to be? How much rational awareness is required to respond to the Holy Spirit? John the Baptist leapt for joy in his mother’s womb when Mary, pregnant with the Savior, greeted Elizabeth. The faith does not subside exclusively in my personal relationship with Jesus but resides also in the common witness of the whole Church and in the Christian community and the family who transmit it to me.

“Me and Jesus and a book” is not Christian communion.

Triple bingo!!!

 

[Lazerlike42]

Eden:

Originally Posted by Lazerlike42
*
Here’s a better question. In John’s gospel, we read in John 20:20-23 a verse the you interpret one way. However, those who learned directly from John interpret it a different way. Who has the right interpretation, you, or the men who could have asked him what he meant?*

And remember 12volt_man, when you think about this question, that it is *Christ * that matters, not your church, and not my church. Only Christ. It is the truth of Christ. Go to Him

 

[imroc]

I better get to work, i’m going to have to stay late tonight

Side 1 (Baptist)
Contradictory claims of following “some” early Church fathers.
Items: Trinity, Baptism, Sacred Scripture, etc.
Cannot back up banning infants and children from baptism
Neglects God’s fulfillment of old covenant laws.
Has only a couple hundred years of half truth teaching and misunderstandings from the generations of the local preacher man.

Side 2 True Christian (Catholic)
Sacred Scripture AND Sacred Tradition
ITems: All
All have been baptised in households and not all professed faith
Embraces ALL of God’s fulfilled convenants and prophesies.
Has nearly 2000 years of teaching of true faith, directly from the Apostles themselves. (2 Chr 19:11, Mal 2:7, Eph 2:20, 4:11, 1 Cor 12:28, Acts 1:20, Acts 1:25, ! Tim 3:1, 8 and 5:17, 4:14, 5:22 (4 or more generations of sucession listed) Acts 14:23, 2 Tim 2:2, Tit 1:5) (Catholic Verse finder, 1999-2003) (C)

 

[12volt_man]

mercygate:

How conscious does the decision to follow Christ have to be?

Conscious enough that they can grasp the moral consequences of their sin, repent, comprehend Christ’s atonement, and make a public profession of faith.

“Me and Jesus and a book” is not Christian communion.

No, “me and a community of believers subjected to Jesus and following His word as laid out in the Bible” is Christian communion.

 

[Lazerlike42]

12volt_man:

You’re confusing how we determine essential doctrines and how we handle matters of conscience. All of the things you’ve mentioned here are non-essentials.

But they do matter. The Seventh Day Adventist’s claim that those who worship on Sunday are damned for not keeping holy the Sabbath day. This is a matter of doctrine, and one that is really not supported by the Bible. The examples you cite are those typically used by Protestant apologists, but they are filled with problems. You really can’t prove Sunday worship from Scripture.

 

[Lazerlike42]

12volt_man:

Conscious enough that they can grasp the moral consequences of their sin, repent, comprehend Christ’s atonement, and make a public profession of faith.

So you believe that Jesus’ death alone does not save us then, and that these rituals are required for salvation.

 

[Lillith]

12volt_man:

You’re confusing how we determine essential doctrines and how we handle matters of conscience. All of the things you’ve mentioned here are non-essentials.

Where is this list of essential and non-essential Doctrine located in the Bible?

This implies that God the Father, and God the Son, don’t agree on Doctrine…

 

[12volt_man]

imroc:

I better get to work, i’m going to have to stay late tonight

Side 1 (Baptist)
Contradictory claims of following “some” early Church fathers.

There is nothing contradictory about saying that we respect the early church fathers, insofar as their teachings are backed up by scripture.

Items: Trinity, Baptism, Sacred Scripture, etc.
Cannot back up banning infants and children from baptism

Actually, I’ve already backed it up.

Neglects God’s fulfillment of old covenant laws.

No, Jesus Christ has already fulfilled the Old Covenant law. We are no longer under it.

Has only a couple hundred years of half truth teaching and misunderstandings from the generations of the local preacher man.

This is not only insulting, but stupid. That’s not where we get out doctrine.

Not only do we have 2,000 years of orthodoxy and the historic creeds and confessions of Christianity to look back on, the local preacher does not interpret scripture, but proclaims it.

Side 2 True Christian (Catholic)

Back to my earlier complaint that Roman Catholics do not see non-Roman Catholics as Christians.

 

[Lazerlike42]

I have to go to work now.

12volt_man, I fear for you. I don’t know what is in your heart, but from what you have said on this page I have a very strong inclination that you are not really concerend with the truth, but only with defending your position. This is the same thing that the Pharisees did. I say this because this thread is full of arguements posed to you that you have simply ignored because you have been unable to answer, and questions that you have dodged and even seemed to imply that you refused to answer. My brother, you must turn your heart to God. Turn to Christ. Wherever He leads you, let Him lead you. Remember, He is the truth. Don’t fear the truth, for this is to fear Him. Open yourself up to the truth, whatever you find that to be. Maybe you won’t think it is the Catholic Church when all is said and done, but at least give it to God to really care about the truth, and not simply to try to defend your position at all costs.

 

[Eden]

Back to my earlier complaint that Roman Catholics do not see non-Roman Catholics as Christians.

Catholics were the first Christians. The word “Catholic” means universal. That’s what the True Church is and it’s followers are Catholic.

 

[12volt_man]

Lillith:

Where is this list of essential and non-essential Doctrine located in the Bible?

This implies that God the Father, and God the Son, don’t agree on Doctrine…

God the Father and God the Son agree perfectly on doctrine.

Perhaps you mean God the Father and God the Mother?

 

[Eden]

12volt_man:

God the Father and God the Son agree perfectly on doctrine.

Perhaps you mean God the Father and God the Mother?

When did you learn that Catholics believe Mary is God? Yeah, I didn’t think so.

 

[Lillith]

12volt_man:

No, Jesus Christ has already fulfilled the Old Covenant law. We are no longer under it.

So we no longer have to follow the ten commandments?

12volt_man:

Back to my earlier complaint that Roman Catholics do not see non-Roman Catholics as Christians.

AWWW…that’s untrue!

 

[12volt_man]

Lazerlike42:

I have to go to work now.

12volt_man, I fear for you. I don’t know what is in your heart, but from what you have said on this page I have a very strong inclination that you are not really concerend with the truth, but only with defending your position.

I’m interested in defending the truth, just as the Bible has called me to.

My brother, you must turn your heart to God. Turn to Christ.

Yes, yes, I know that you all believe that I’m just some filthy little Hell bound apostate.

Frankly, I don’t care. I know that my Redeemer is faithful and true and I know that His promises to me are trustworthy.

I’d rather have Christ than all of the popes there have ever been.

 

[12volt_man]

Eden:

When did you learn that Catholics believe Mary is God?

When they started taking her more seriously than they do God.

 

[mercygate]

12volt_man:

Back to my earlier complaint that Roman Catholics do not see non-Roman Catholics as Christians.

Who told you that Catholics do not see non-Catholics as Christian? Here is what *The Catechism of the Catholic Church *has to say about that.

818 "However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers . . . . All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ;** they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church**."272

 

[Eden]

12volt_man:

When they started taking her more seriously than they do God.

Never. If you would like to make serious statements about theology that is fine. If your bag is now empty and you have no legitimate arguments left to support your faith, perhaps it’s time to read the Catechism and return better prepared for dialogue.

 

[Lillith]

12volt_man:

God the Father and God the Son agree perfectly on doctrine.

Perhaps you mean God the Father and God the Mother?

Then why do protestants have non-essential doctrine? God the Father wants infant baptism (Lutherans) God the Son disagrees (Baptists) and they send the Holy Spirit out to contradict each other???

P.S…who is God the mother…Do Baptists call the holy Spirit Female…or are you being sarcastic…there really is no room in such important matters for sarcasm…

 

[Mickey]

12volt_man:

Yes, yes, I know that you all believe that I’m just some filthy little Hell bound apostate.

There you go again. Don’t be so hard on yourself.

12volt_man:

I’d rather have Christ than all of the popes there have ever been.

We have Christ first and foremost and we also have all the successors of St peter there has ever been–going all the way back to St Peter himself.