Baptizing Baby of Lesbian Mothers

[Styner]

Is it possible to have a baby of lesbian mothers baptized in the Catholic Church? The birth mother herself is not Catholic, but the other mother is Catholic. There is no father listed on the birth certificate.

What are the possibilities?

 

[Dr.Colossus]

For a child to be baptized in the Catholic Church there should be reasonable expectation that he or she will be raised Catholic. 2 lesbian mothers (presumably living in sin) probably don’t meet that requirement, but it would be up to the priest to discern.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Styner:

Is it possible to have a baby of lesbian mothers baptized in the Catholic Church? The birth mother herself is not Catholic, but the other mother is Catholic. There is no father listed on the birth certificate.

What are the possibilities?

Children onnly have one mother and one father. No such thing as two mothers. Physically impossible. Violates natural law. So, the “lesbian” mother is a CINO, since the Church specifically forbids being involved in a homosexual relationship. What confuses me is why would a mother want to baptise a child into a Church that is going to teach her that her two mommies are living a perpetually gravely sinful life? Why do members of the Mafia baptise their kids? One is supposed to raise their children as Catholics? What kids of example are mom and mom going to set as Catholics?

 

[Styner]

Thank you both for your insight. Could you please explain “CINO” ? I’m not familiar with the terminology.

Thank you.

 

[Dr.Colossus]

CINO - “Catholic In Name Only”

 

[jamesclaude]

Scott_Lafrance:

Children onnly have one mother and one father. No such thing as two mothers. Physically impossible. Violates natural law. So, the “lesbian” mother is a CINO, since the Church specifically forbids being involved in a homosexual relationship. What confuses me is why would a mother want to baptise a child into a Church that is going to teach her that her two mommies are living a perpetually gravely sinful life? Why do members of the Mafia baptise their kids? One is supposed to raise their children as Catholics? What kids of example are mom and mom going to set as Catholics?

Obviously these poor lesbians are gluttons for punishment ! They should FLEE to the nearest Episcopal Church if they still wish to remain 7-Sacrament gurlz - and raise their babies as Episcopalians. Why stick around where you’re not wanted or valued ? * Plus, the music’s lot’s better* !

A Strictly Secular / Practical Commentary:

It amazes me that when gay folks want to “play by the rules” and be soccer moms, everyone throws their hands up in the air and panics ! * What kind of threat* are the lesbians across the street to you ? Even once they’re married ?

Time was when gays had to sneak around, go to nasty bars or lurk in the bushes. Well, those days are over and are no longer necessary.

No one wants gays to be creepy and lurky, but no one wants 'em to be part of society, either - following the “rules” .

So - if you don’t want 'em to lurk and be promiscuous - AND you don’t want 'em to be good solid citizens and faithful partners - WHAT ON EARTH DO YOU WANT THEM TO DO ?

The unfortunate and sad answer is: “go away.”

The reality ? Too late - the toothpaste is already out of the tube.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

I agree, and since God is the one who squished the tube, I’ll listen to Him. Point is, the seal of baptism for an infant required that the parents will raise them as Catholics. A lesbian couple cannot raise a child as a Catholic, because they themselves are not living as Catholics. Additionally, two women cannot get married. Not in any way that the Church recognizes. What do I want them to do, admit that they have a sexual attraction problem and try to live within the boundaries that God has given us. The Church didn’t make up these rules, God did. You don’t like them, take it up with Him. So, how can “gay soccer moms” play by the rules, when they are trying to reinvent the rules that were established by God? I’ll be interested in hearing you talk your way out of that one.

As people, I welcome them into God’s Church, and into my neighborhood. However, they shouldn’t be considered the “same” as a heterosexual couple, for one good reason. THEY AREN’T. Make exceptions for one case, you have to make them for all. God doesn’t allow for that. Hey, what if I want to have a polygynous relationship. Two soccer moms for my kids would be great! I could have a hoot playing musical bedrooms at night. One woman to cook, one to clean, maybe another to change diapers! See what I mean, the RULES say one man and one woman. Anything else is breaking the rules.

jamesclaude:

Obviously these poor lesbians are gluttons for punishment ! They should FLEE to the nearest Episcopal Church if they still wish to remain 7-Sacrament gurlz - and raise their babies as Episcopalians. Why stick around where you’re not wanted or valued ? Plus, the music’s lot’s better !

A Strictly Secular / Practical Commentary:

It amazes me that when gay folks want to “play by the rules” and be soccer moms, everyone throws their hands up in the air and panics ! What kind of threat are the lesbians across the street to you ? Even once they’re married ?

Time was when gays had to sneak around, go to nasty bars or lurk in the bushes. Well, those days are over and are no longer necessary.

No one wants gays to be creepy and lurky, but no one wants 'em to be part of society, either - following the “rules” .

So - if you don’t want 'em to lurk and be promiscuous - AND you don’t want 'em to be good solid citizens and faithful partners - WHAT ON EARTH DO YOU WANT THEM TO DO ?

The unfortunate and sad answer is: “go away.”

The reality ? Too late - the toothpaste is already out of the tube.

 

[Penny_Plain]

Scott_Lafrance:

A lesbian couple cannot raise a child as a Catholic, because they themselves are not living as Catholics.

…

As people, I welcome them into God’s Church, and into my neighborhood.

Which is it?

 

[Dr.Colossus]

Penny Plain:

Which is it?

The Church welcomes homosexual persons, but expects them to live chaste lives in keeping with Natural Law. The “two mommies” in question could have their child baptised, but only if they were willing to live according to the Church’s moral teaching.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

T
Penny Plain:

Which is it?

 

[bapcathluth]

I was baptized Catholic but not raised Catholic. What will happen to my father because of this? I was raised Lutheran but my Catholic grandmother insisted I be baptized Catholic. My Lutheran mother refused to raise me Catholic.

Religion can be wonderful, but it can also be destructive to families, imho. I saw first-hand how divisive it could be, and Lutheranism and Catholicism are not that different.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

bapcathluth:

I was baptized Catholic but not raised Catholic. What will happen to my father because of this? I was raised Lutheran but my Catholic grandmother insisted I be baptized Catholic. My Lutheran mother refused to raise me Catholic.

Religion can be wonderful, but it can also be destructive to families, imho. I saw first-hand how divisive it could be, and Lutheranism and Catholicism are not that different.

Religion doesn’t destroy anything, it is people who misapply religion that destroys things. Just like a gun collects dust on the shelf until a person picks it up. It can either be used for good or bad, depending on the person’s intentions.

 

[jamesclaude]

Scott_Lafrance:

I agree, and since God is the one who squished the tube, I’ll listen to Him.

Say WHUT ? The “tube” was the 1970’s Stonewall Uprising in New York City when gay people began to “come out”.

Was God the one who started that riot ? ( I thought it was a flock of drag queens angry over a police raid and police brutality).

Scott_LaFrance:

Hey, what if I want to have a polygynous relationship. Two soccer moms for my kids would be great! I could have a hoot playing musical bedrooms at night. One woman to cook, one to clean, maybe another to change diapers! See what I mean, the RULES say one man and one woman. Anything else is breaking the rules.

"Yeah, next thing - they’ll be wanting to allow bestiality "

Sounds like the Repbulicans - I’ve heard it all before…

Where are good Jesuit logic teachers when ya need one ?

 

[Lisa_N]

jamesclaude:

Obviously these poor lesbians are gluttons for punishment ! They should FLEE to the nearest Episcopal Church if they still wish to remain 7-Sacrament gurlz - and raise their babies as Episcopalians. Why stick around where you’re not wanted or valued ? Plus, the music’s lot’s better !

A Strictly Secular / Practical Commentary:

It amazes me that when gay folks want to “play by the rules” and be soccer moms, everyone throws their hands up in the air and panics ! What kind of threat are the lesbians across the street to you ? Even once they’re married ?

Time was when gays had to sneak around, go to nasty bars or lurk in the bushes. Well, those days are over and are no longer necessary.

No one wants gays to be creepy and lurky, but no one wants 'em to be part of society, either - following the “rules” .

So - if you don’t want 'em to lurk and be promiscuous - AND you don’t want 'em to be good solid citizens and faithful partners - WHAT ON EARTH DO YOU WANT THEM TO DO ?

The unfortunate and sad answer is: “go away.”

The reality ? Too
late - the toothpaste is already out of the tube.

JamesClaude, I do not see uncharitable attitude toward people who are homosexual, but I do see a valid questioning of their activities as well as their desire to make their sexuality a public issue.

Scenario…a woman brings a child to soccer practice. She chats about weather, school, teachers, the usual stuff. Does anyone need to KNOW she’s a lesbian? Does anyone want to know? No they don’t. Same song different verse. Woman brings child to soccer practices, announces she is a lesbian, announces that her spouse Suzy is on her way. Gee does she wonder why there might be a less than open arms approach? Would there be a similar response if she said she enjoys auto-erotic asphyxia? Or sado masochism? Bondage? Probably. The point is that homosexuals draw a lot of fire by making such an issue of “we’re here we’re queer and you better accept anything we want to do even if you find it disgusting, repulsive unnatural or offensive.”

As to what threat are the lesbians or gays across the street? Again I get back to the problems of homosexuals procuring children and raising them without benefit of a father or mother. I don’t think that’s good for kids but hey, we can’t question this because it would be discrimination.

As to a woman wanting a child baptized Catholic even though she has no intention of raising the child as a Catholic, what on earth is the point? A photo op? If she doesn’t believe in the teachings of the Catholic church, why bother?

Lisa N

 

[Lisa_N]

jamesclaude:

Say WHUT ? The “tube” was the 1970’s Stonewall Uprising in New York City when gay people began to “come out”.

Was God the one who started that riot ? ( I thought it was a flock of drag queens angry over a police raid and police brutality).

Have you heard that the man who owned some famous bar on Christopher street was a hood who often tipped off the police to get them to raid his bar? Interesting stuff as he was of course making a fortune of closeted homosexuals and they thought he was lookin’ out for them.

Lisa N

 

[Styner]

Just to clarify -

The birth mother is not Catholic, though her partner is. The idea is that the child will indeed, be raised in the Catholic church, with Catholic godparents and extended family.

These aren’t in-your-face ladies. Both polite, responsible individuals from good families. They aren’t interested in attention - in fact, the less attention the better. The Catholic partner in the couple really wants the child to be raised in the religion - she’s just wondering if it is possible or if the church will turn them away.

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut. I am learning a great deal.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Styner:

Just to clarify -

The birth mother is not Catholic, though her partner is. The idea is that the child will indeed, be raised in the Catholic church, with Catholic godparents and extended family.

These aren’t in-your-face ladies. Both polite, responsible individuals from good families. They aren’t interested in attention - in fact, the less attention the better. The Catholic partner in the couple really wants the child to be raised in the religion - she’s just wondering if it is possible or if the church will turn them away.

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut. I am learning a great deal.

You say that the Catholic “partner” wants the child raised in the Catholic Church… but how is that possible when the child’s parent is not a Catholic and there is a live in partner? That the only example at home is one that is gravely sinful and disordered.

This person is not a Catholic if she is living this sort of life style.

 

[jamesclaude]

Lisa N:

Have you heard that the man who owned some famous bar on Christopher street was a hood who often tipped off the police to get them to raid his bar? Interesting stuff as he was of course making a fortune of closeted homosexuals and they thought he was lookin’ out for them.

Lisa N

Um, NO, I haven’t. Heard it from WHOM ? Somebody here in Texas who was there ? My barber ? The mailman ?

What difference would it have made ? Gay people were tired of being hassled by the police, and stood up for the first time collectively.

Whew - it’s hard to follow the “logic” on here at times. But, I shall attempt to - somehow :

No matter WHAT / WHO caused the raid, a raid on the Stonewall bar DID occur. Agreed ? No ? Yes ?

My entire point was that gay people are OUT and that "the toothpaste can’t be put back in the tube ". A writer had said that the reason that the toothpaste was out of the tube was because “God had squished the tube”. ( ^ please see my original posting ^ )

The Stonewall Riot - whatEVER caused it - was the catalyst for what’s happened in the past three decades for Gay folks.

I feel like I’m Bob Schieffer interviewing Senator Bill Frist two weeks ago on FACE THE NATION. All I can do is look down and shake my head sometimes - there’s no way to get this straight ( please pardon the pun ).

Does it really MATTER what CAUSED the riot ? I rest my case - the angry drag queens did it - NOT GOD - THAT was the point .

in a forest obviously full of trees…

Dr. Pepper time…

 

[TarAshly]

Scott_Lafrance:

Why do members of the Mafia baptise their kids?

“theres no such thing as the mafia” sorry had to throw in a little sopranos quote there. that show is my guilty pleasure. as far as the thread goes, its wrong for them to even have a child. HOWEVER a baby cant help who its born to and should not be denied the right to a baptism. again i dont know the rules on this but thats just my opinion.

 

[jamesclaude]

“theres no such thing as the mafia” sorry had to throw in a little sopranos quote there. that show is my guilty pleasure. as far as the thread goes, its wrong for them to even have a child. HOWEVER a baby cant help who its born to and should not be denied the right to a baptism. again i dont know the rules on this but thats just my opinion.

Wow - someone shows some compassion and charity for a change

Jesus would be proud of you, TarAshly…

December 6th + St. Nicholas +