Based on probability, if one had to make a choice, is it more reasonable to be an Atheist or a Theist

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Can you locate the source of awareness and self-control?
It’s that mush between your ears, Tony. Remove it and you don’t exist. There is nothing else. You are a brain in a mobile vat. A little slide show of memories. Access to which makes you ‘you’. If you had my memories you would be me. You are only aware of being Tony because you have Tony’s memories.

This isn’t rocket surgery.
 
You acknowledge that religion can be a viable option for providing answers?
Did someone say they couldn’t? You should study some. Although a few require an acceptance of some really wierd supernatural beliefs if you want to become a fully paid up member. You’d probably find almost all of them a little strange.

But you could learn something from all of them.
 
Did someone say they couldn’t? You should study some. Although a few require an acceptance of some really wierd supernatural beliefs if you want to become a fully paid up member. You’d probably find almost all of them a little strange.

But you could learn something from all of them.
I’m a bit offended–and I rarely get offended, BTW.

I have been studying religion(s) since I could think.

You get a great big thumbs down for this. :mad:
 
Meaning that Brad cannot claim to ID advocates that what they are doing is not science and then turn around with his next breath and claim science has NO LIMITS as to what it can investigate. Hello?
ID is to science as Ken Ham is to boat building.

But weren’t you going to nail something to the mast? Except that it will require a conditional clause. It will need an ‘If’ in there somewhere. But there are no ‘ifs’ allowed in your world, so maybe not.

Keep that shovel handy, just in case.
 
Based on probability, if one had to make a choice, is it more reasonable to be an Atheist or a Theist. Which is more likely to be true given human experience and the evidence.

Which way does the pendulum of probability swing and why.
That is difficult calculation but a rough estimate can be obtain from the ratio atheist to theist.
 
Can you locate the source of awareness and self-control?
It isn’t any type of surgery. It’s sheer dogmatism which has no foundation in fact. How on earth can you demonstrate your assertions are true beyond all shadow of doubt? Do you have privileged insight into the nature of reality? If so what endows you which such a unique gift?
Where precisely is the location of awareness? How is self-control possible if there is no self but only "mush between your ears"? Or is self-control an illusion? If so everything you have claimed is worthless because your thoughts and ideas are caused by forces beyond your control which don't even know what they're doing! Not a very plausible reason for believing your conclusions are true...
 
It isn’t any type of surgery. It’s sheer dogmatism which has no foundation in fact. How on earth can you demonstrate your assertions are true beyond all shadow of doubt?
Well, we could destroy your brain and see if you still had awareness of yourself. We could put it into a vat and see if you were still you, albeit without all those fleshy appendages. We could remove your brain bit by bit and watch you slowly dissapear.

It’s all under your hat. That’s where Tony lives.
 
Well, we could destroy your brain and see if you still had awareness of yourself. We could put it into a vat and see if you were still you, albeit without all those fleshy appendages. We could remove your brain bit by bit and watch you slowly dissapear.

It’s all under your hat. That’s where Tony lives.
Wasn’t there a science-fiction movie called “The Brain That Wouldn’t Die”?
 
Wasn’t there a science-fiction movie called “The Brain That Wouldn’t Die”?
And of course, the wonderful Man With Two Brains with Steve Martin as Dr. Hfuhruhurr and the de-lovely Kathleen Turner.

Tony should watch both and he’d be converted for sure.
 
It isn’t any type of surgery. It’s sheer dogmatism which has no foundation in fact. How on earth can you demonstrate your assertions are true beyond all shadow of doubt? Do you have privileged insight into the nature of reality? If so what endows you which such a unique gift?
You have failed to answer any of my questions:

Where precisely is the location of awareness?
How is self-control possible if there is no self but only “mush between your ears”?
Or is self-control an illusion?

If so everything you have claimed is worthless because your thoughts and ideas are caused by forces beyond your control which don’t even know what they’re doing! Not a very plausible reason for believing your conclusions are true…

This is a forum for rational discussion but you treat it as a opportunity to vent your spleen with crude remarks - and impress no one but yourself…
 
It is more reasonable to be a theist because most atheists equate the mind with the brain even though there is no evidence that the brain knows what it is doing or can control itself. According to them it is merely a biological computer which is programmed with minute electrical impulses which are responses to stimuli, don’t know what they are doing and aren’t responsible for anything they do. Garbage in garbage out…
 
Where precisely is the location of awareness?
Where on earth do you think it is?

Your brain, Tony. It’s inside your head. There are different parts that make up the whole you. Google it and there’s lots of info. Read up on it and you won’t need to keep asking the same question.

“Self-awareness is more a product of a diffuse patchwork of pathways in the brain – including other regions – rather than confined to specific areas”. dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2012/08/self-awareness-new-insights-into-how-human-brain-constructs-of-sense-of-self.html

There you go. Answered.

But, oh yeah. The brain is just made up of innaninate material. Just a bag of chemical elements. If you want to suggst that awareness is ‘somewhere else’, then why does it dissapear as your brain dies?

There’s no trick to it. There’s nothing behind the curtain. All those neurons that are firing RIGHT NOW…that’s you. Electrical impulses. Change the configuration through trauma, drugs, disease and guess what? You are not the same person you were before.
 
?..even though there is no evidence that the brain knows what it is doing or can control itself.
What the…?

Your brain isn’t a separate entity from you. Your brain IS you, Tony. That’s where you exist. All you have just said is that there is no evidence that you know what you are doing or no evidence that you can control yourself.

If you decide to write another post, where do you think that decision is made? Do you think that Tony makes it and the brain is just along for the ride? It seems like you think that you control your brain, that you use it to make decisions.

But it makes the decisions. And not FOR you. For itself. Bcause it is you. If not, please tell me where you actually are.
 
What the…?

Your brain isn’t a separate entity from you. Your brain IS you, Tony. That’s where you exist. All you have just said is that there is no evidence that you know what you are doing or no evidence that you can control yourself.

If you decide to write another post, where do you think that decision is made? Do you think that Tony makes it and the brain is just along for the ride? It seems like you think that you control your brain, that you use it to make decisions.

But it makes the decisions. And not FOR you. For itself. Bcause it is you. If not, please tell me where you actually are.
Unless you are a completely biological determinist, the argument you present is not exactly so simple. There is the brain-mind-body-culture multiple dimension, which psychologists talk about. The brain can be modified by culture and experience; it has what is called bioplasticity. For example, there is a tribe that cannot differentiate between the colors green and blue. When they look at an object of either color, they visually perceive the SAME color. Why is this? It is not because there is any neurological structural impairment or abnormal functioning of their brain. Rather, it is because the language of their culture has only one word for both colors. Culture, including our native language, can in fact change our perception of the world even though the brain itself is not altered. There are many other examples. One such is that poorer children have been found to perceive coins as of a larger size than they are in reality. This has to do with their socioeconomic background and sociocultural context. Many psychological studies have been conducted which reveal that the mind rather than the brain per se, which is shaped by culture, exerts a powerful influence on perception and cognition.
 
I’m afraid that all you are doing is giving some examples of how the brain works. How it interprets information. That is, how YOU interpret information.

There isn’t a ‘you’ entirely separate from your brain that works in tandem. If your brain sees a larger coin or a different colour, do you think it passes the information on to you? It’s YOU doing the work.

Otherwise, where do you exist?
 
“Science may not know now, but Science will in the future, man!” = another faith based assertion embraced, ironically, by the Atheist.
Where in DaddyGirl’s post do you see the assertion that science will find the answers? You keep arguing against straw man arguments.
 
One has to wonder why you are assuming a faith-based belief here? “Something can come from nothing even though it’s never EVER been demonstrated!”
This is incredibly tiresome. You keep arguing against assertions that I haven’t made. Worse, you continue to argue even when I have explicitly stated that I don’t hold those views. It strikes me that this is the tactic of desperation because you can’t justify your own position or sensibly argue against mine.
 
Nixbits;14072402:
An individual is a person who has attributes which a set of electrochemical interactions and the physical matter (biological cells) in which these interactions occur does not possess, i.e. consciousness, insight, self-control, moral awareness and the capacity for love.
This is where we disagree. I see no evidence to suggest that attributes such as these are anything more than emergent properties of the human brain. I therefore do not agree with your definition of an individual.
A person is an intangible entity with rights not attributed to non-human organisms. How do you explain the difference?I
I don’t agree that a person is an intangible entity. In every case of an existent person there is, at the very least, a tangible brain that must be alive and functioning for any of the attributes of a person to be detectable.
 
You seem to be reducing a person to a biological organism which has no intangible attributes.
No, I don’t think so. Attributes themselves can be intangible. But those attributes are generated and caused by the activity of a tangible brain.
Can you locate the source of awareness and self-control?
Bradski has already answered this. Awareness and self-control are emergent properties of human, and perhaps also (depending on your definitions) some non-human, brains.
 
No, I don’t think so. Attributes themselves can be intangible. But those attributes are generated and caused by the activity of a tangible brain.
There is no part of the brain to which consciousness itself is attributed. This is defined as the “hard problem” of consciousness.
 
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