Because there are athiests

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I was wondering that because there are athiests does that prove there is God?
 
valentino said:
I was wondering that because there are athiests does that prove there is God?
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No but the fact that the most ardent God deniers out there (atheists) can’t get God out of their head proves God.🙂
 
There are atheists because WE don’t believe in God enough, not because they don’t believe in God.

Were we to really live as other Christs, there’d be very few atheists.

It’s our lack of love, our lack of sacrifice, our lack of faith. It’s our lukewarmness.
 
I believe they would say this is a non sequitur. I might be wrong.

I do find it humorous even if it is considered a fallacious argument.
 
valentino said:
I was wondering that because there are athiests does that prove there is God?
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That’s a great thought! I’m reminded of the saying:
“Atheists don’t believe in G-d, but G-d believes in atheists.”
 
Edward_H said:
There are atheists because WE don’t believe in God enough, not because they don’t believe in God.

Were we to really live as other Christs, there’d be very few atheists.

It’s our lack of love, our lack of sacrifice, our lack of faith. It’s our lukewarmness.
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Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace. Where there is hatred, let me sow love; where there is injury, pardon; where there is doubt, faith; where there is despair, hope; where there is darkness, light; where there is sadness, joy.

O, Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console; to be understood as to understand; to be loved as to love; For it is in giving that we receive; it is in pardoning that we are pardoned; it is in dying [to self] that we are born again to eternal life.
 
I think your question is based on a misunderstanding of what atheism is. Everyone talks about God because for at least believers, God is of fundamental importance to them. And how else are we to refer to belief in God without saying God? If you said Flying Spaghetti Monster, even to question his doctrine or reality, are you not acknowledging the Tentacled One’s existence? :eek:

Atheism is not a negative stance - denying, rejecting, refusing to believe - it is an epistemological position where knowledge is based on evidence. A distinction is maintained between evidence and faith (which I think is still maintained in various ways by the devout), and I would like to see how it is possible to demonstrate the accuracy of knowledge that arises directly from faith. What is one belief against another? Can you prove I’m wrong to have faith in the FSM? It is the atheist and the committed Christian together who say “But wait! Evidence shows that Jesus did [this], or [that]! It’s not merely belief, we have reasons to believe what we do.” Atheists and Christians differ on whether that evidence is compelling, and what it means.
 
This reminds me of when my daughter asks me questions like “Daddy, why is there a sign there”, and I will answer “because if it weren’t there, it would be somewhere else”. Probably not a very satisfying answer. Which I think is the case also with the original poster’s premise.
 
James1215 said:
I think your question is based on a misunderstanding of what atheism is. Everyone talks about God because for at least believers, God is of fundamental importance to them. And how else are we to refer to belief in God without saying God? If you said Flying Spaghetti Monster, even to question his doctrine or reality, are you not acknowledging the Tentacled One’s existence? :eek:

Atheism is not a negative stance - denying, rejecting, refusing to believe - it is an epistemological position where knowledge is based on evidence. A distinction is maintained between evidence and faith (which I think is still maintained in various ways by the devout), and I would like to see how it is possible to demonstrate the accuracy of knowledge that arises directly from faith. What is one belief against another? Can you prove I’m wrong to have faith in the FSM? It is the atheist and the committed Christian together who say “But wait! Evidence shows that Jesus did [this], or [that]! It’s not merely belief, we have reasons to believe what we do.” Atheists and Christians differ on whether that evidence is compelling, and what it means.
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You have totally confused atheism with agnosticism.

Despite your rewriting of the definition of what atheism is, it is indeed the denial of the existence of God.
 
I’m pretty sure that is what atheism is. It is lacking belief, and I’ve given a simple explanation as to how this might come about and not from a rejection but from a positive epistemological position.

In popular culture the difference between atheism and agnosticism seems to be the relative friendliness of the two towards religion, but what I said above was not agnostic. I’ve even spoken to a devout Christian who said honestly that he was an agnostic in that he did not know for sure that God existed, but his faith reflected what he thought was the truth.
 
Correction: what I was thinking whilst I was writing was not agnostic. By my own reckoning to do with evidence, I have no reason to believe in God. I think my statement permits agnosticism too, but honestly I haven’t the faintest idea what an agnostic thought is and how it differs from my own atheistic thoughts.
 
James1215 said:
Correction: what I was thinking whilst I was writing was not agnostic. By my own reckoning to do with evidence, I have no reason to believe in God. I think my statement permits agnosticism too, but honestly I haven’t the faintest idea what an agnostic thought is and how it differs from my own atheistic thoughts.
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I’ve always thought of agnosticism as being a subset of atheism. For example, if someone asked me, “Does God exist?” my honest answer would be, “I don’t know.” So, I guess that would make me an agnostic. On the other hand, if someone asked me, “Do you believe God exists?” I would have to answer “No.” While I acknowledge the possibility of God’s existence, this acknowledgment does not rise to the level of belief. This denial of belief would also make me an atheist.

(At the same time, if someone asked me, “Do you believe that God does NOT exist?” I would also have to say “No.” While I am extremely skeptical, my skepticism does not rise to the level of a belief.)

Bottom line…I just don’t know.
 
babylonsfalling said:
No but the fact that the most ardent God deniers out there (atheists) can’t get God out of their head proves God.🙂
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Hmmm idk about your statement: just because there are deniers doesn’t prove the existence of God.
Say we have an imaginary creature, the Imaginarium Mordicus, let’s call it. It iis known to not exist. However, there are a group of ppl who always think about it. Merely thinking about something doesn’t prove the object’s existence. We know the greek/roman/ancient gods don’t exist, but we still think about them.
Using your argument, one could conclude, however, that zeus, aphrodite, thor, isis, diana, hecate, etc. do exist, since ppl think abou them…
 
For two more cents: from dictionary.com:

—Synonyms
Atheist, agnostic, infidel, skeptic refer to persons not inclined toward religious belief or a particular form of religious belief. An atheist is one who denies the existence of a deity or of divine beings. An agnostic is one who believes it impossible to know anything about God or about the creation of the universe and refrains from commitment to any religious doctrine. Infidel means an unbeliever, especially a nonbeliever in Islam or Christianity. A skeptic doubts and is critical of all accepted doctrines and creeds.

In classic usage, an atheist denys that there is a G-d. The agnostic says, “I don’t know.”
 
underacloud said:
I don’t believe in fairies. Does that prove they exist?
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I’ll try to make my pt.Athiests don’t say that I don’t know if there is a god,they say there is no god.If I say to you there was a car parked at the corner and you say I don’t believe there was a car parked at the corner.Are you admitting there is such thing as a car?If you said “what is a car”?I would believe that you don’t know what a car is.But since you said "i don’t believe there was a car there,you know that there is such a thing as a car.
 
JamestheOlder said:
For two more cents: from dictionary.com:

—Synonyms
Atheist, agnostic, infidel, skeptic refer to persons not inclined toward religious belief or a particular form of religious belief. An atheist is one who denies the existence of a deity or of divine beings. An agnostic is one who believes it impossible to know anything about God or about the creation of the universe and refrains from commitment to any religious doctrine. Infidel means an unbeliever, especially a nonbeliever in Islam or Christianity. A skeptic doubts and is critical of all accepted doctrines and creeds.

In classic usage, an atheist denys that there is a G-d. The agnostic says, “I don’t know.”
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I think what follows from “I don’t know/It can’t be known” is “Let’s not presume to know” which gives rise to my lack of belief ie atheism. I do have a slightly different view though, one which is softer as atheism than agnosticism would be. I don’t think it is categorically impossible to know whether God exists, just that as yet we don’t have good enough reason to believe.
 
James1215 said:
I think what follows from “I don’t know/It can’t be known” is “Let’s not presume to know” which gives rise to my lack of belief ie atheism. I do have a slightly different view though, one which is softer as atheism than agnosticism would be. I don’t think it is categorically impossible to know whether God exists, just that as yet we don’t have good enough reason to believe.
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What would be a “good enough reason to believe”?

What if G-d came to earth and stood before you? Would that be “good enough…”?
 
James1215 said:
I think your question is based on a misunderstanding of what atheism is. Everyone talks about God because for at least believers, God is of fundamental importance to them. And how else are we to refer to belief in God without saying God? If you said Flying Spaghetti Monster, even to question his doctrine or reality, are you not acknowledging the Tentacled One’s existence? :eek:

Atheism is not a negative stance - denying, rejecting, refusing to believe - it is an epistemological position where knowledge is based on evidence. A distinction is maintained between evidence and faith (which I think is still maintained in various ways by the devout), and I would like to see how it is possible to demonstrate the accuracy of knowledge that arises directly from faith. What is one belief against another? Can you prove I’m wrong to have faith in the FSM? It is the atheist and the committed Christian together who say “But wait! Evidence shows that Jesus did [this], or [that]! It’s not merely belief, we have reasons to believe what we do.” Atheists and Christians differ on whether that evidence is compelling, and what it means.
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You don’t know what atheism is, or you’re just denying what you DO know.
An atheist is someone with a belief that there are no gods.
It’s not some passive, lack of belief, it’s someone who has pondered and rejected he notion of god.
Atheists are very famous for falling all over themselves trying to tweak the definition into something more passive but all that really tells us is that so called atheists, don’t want anything to do with real atheism.
 
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