Behold, It Was Leah!

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simplynoone said:
Well, the sacrifice could not have been blood shed by killing a man physically… this is against the Law of God. Thus, the sacrifice was Israel being sent into the world gene pool via ahem ya know, the thing that Mary the mother of Jesus (according to the church) did not do. Anyway, this is even beside the point… but notice, if that is the new covenant, then what takes place before it is how it is enacted, no? I do not see a man being sacrificed physically, but rather the spreading of the seed into the world. This is also how I understand the suffering servant… that is true suffering, don’t you think? To be sent out ALIVE and yet without the identity that made you who you are? And this is why God is the Saviour and NOT a man, because God is the only one who could know who to call back to Him… it is a brilliant plan so that Israel would never again doubt who is God and/or be lured into the idolatry worship of the world. 🙂
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What does any of this have to do with this verse?
“Behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, "when I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man and with the seed of beast.
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There is no suffering servent mentioned. No Savior. No redemption of Isreal.

It does imply that Israel will be prosperous in numbers.

You know, if you take the Christian thought that the Church IS the new covenant and thus is grafted onto Israel, there you go.

But it has nothing to do with anyone being married.
 
ralphinal said:
What does any of this have to do with this verse?

There is no suffering servent mentioned. No Savior. No redemption of Isreal.

It does imply that Israel will be prosperous in numbers.

You know, if you take the Christian thought that the Church IS the new covenant and thus is grafted onto Israel, there you go.

But it has nothing to do with anyone being married.
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sighs I see it differently and honestly, it is neither or here nor there as far as evidences for Jesus and Mary being married and the Church not being the bride of Jesus. nowhere is it said in the Tanakh that Church would be grafted into Israel as their bride, so no… it would be incorrect to take the Church, claim it to be the New Covenant, and graft it into Israel. It would be wrong because it is a line of thinking that is not consistent with the Tanakh. The New Covenant between Israel and God does not abolish anything that is in the Old Covenant… it is simply a matter of where the Law of God would be written… that is it.

The Church, from what I can tell is the bride of Paul and so their covenant is between them.

As for Jesus and Mary being married, whatever the reasoning for it… they WERE married. The evidence for it is written there in front of our faces. I was not raised with the same Jewish knowledge as the OP and yet, I can still see clearly that they were married by their responses and interactions with one another.:o
 
simplynoone said:
sighs I see it differently and honestly, it is neither or here nor there as far as evidences for Jesus and Mary being married and the Church not being the bride of Jesus. nowhere is it said in the Tanakh that Church would be grafted into Israel as their bride, so no… it would be incorrect to take the Church, claim it to be the New Covenant, and graft it into Israel. It would be wrong because it is a line of thinking that is not consistent with the Tanakh. The New Covenant between Israel and God does not abolish anything that is in the Old Covenant… it is simply a matter of where the Law of God would be written… that is it.

What is the new Covenant?
The Church, from what I can tell is the bride of Paul and so their covenant is between them.
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I asked you for proof that JEsus HAD To be married, and you have given me none.

Please show me where it says that Jesus, or any prophet HAS to be married
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ralphinal said:
What is the new Covenant?

I asked you for proof that JEsus HAD To be married, and you have given me none.

Please show me where it says that Jesus, or any prophet HAS to be married
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I have. I can only show you, but I can not open your eyes to the Truth for you. That is something that you have to be willing to do for yourself. There is the Divine Command for a man to leave his mother and father and cleave to their wife. Given that Rabbis are teachers of the Law, it would be unwise for him to not have been married… hypocritical in fact. There really is nothing more I could say… I really am not so concerned about convincing someone of the Truth who has their eyes shut tight. The Truth still remains the truth with or without the acknowledgment of Church.

Oh and the New Covenant is in Jeremiah 31. It is self explanatory and it is between the house of Israel, the house of Judah and God.🙂
 
simplynoone said:
I have. I can only show you, but I can not open your eyes to the Truth for you. That is something that you have to be willing to do for yourself. There is the Divine Command for a man to leave his mother and father and cleave to their wife. Given that Rabbis are teachers of the Law, it would be unwise for him to not have been married… hypocritical in fact. There really is nothing more I could say… I really am not so concerned about convincing someone of the Truth who has their eyes shut tight. The Truth still remains the truth with or without the acknowledgment of Church.

Oh and the New Covenant is in Jeremiah 31. It is self explanatory and it is between the house of Israel, the house of Judah and God.🙂
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Then who were the wives of Elijah and Elisha?
 
planten said:
**I have read with interest the discussion between Ben, Ralph, Josie and simplinoone. Jesus was a jew and brought up in proper Jewish family. He should have been married. There is no reaon that Jesus not be married. It is being told care of Jeremiah 31 that Jesus was from the seed of Judas… How come…??? Quite imteresting… WE do not know who is the real father of Jesus.

Also, the problem of Jesus using the word “Beloved” for a grown up male as mentioned by simplinoone is important when beloved ladies were present at calvary. The matter needs further explanation.
**
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That’s an excellent observation Planten. I was answering about this point on another Forum and a gay man tried to prove his point that Jesus was gay based on this alleged treatment of a male disciple out of the group. Do you know what? I don’t blame gays for bringing up their claim in a forum discussion. Christians are to blame for their illogical and unnatural insistence.
 
Ben_Masada said:
That’s an excellent observation Planten. I was answering about this point on another Forum and a gay man tried to prove his point that Jesus was gay based on this alleged treatment of a male disciple out of the group. Do you know what? I don’t blame gays for bringing up their claim in a forum discussion. Christians are to blame for their illogical and unnatural insistence.
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Can this post get anymore idiotic?
 
ralphinal said:
Then who were the wives of Elijah and Elisha?
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I do not know; but I DO know the wife of Jesus was Mary Magdalene. I will admit to giggling over how uncomfortable it makes you all to hear that Jesus had a VERY intimate relationship with a woman, his wife… so much so that you all try to think of any way to not admit it and even replace his love for her with the love of man. Very strange indeed, dont’ you think? Jesus ❤️ John OR Jesus ❤️ Mary… definitely the latter according to the NT. 😉
 
**While Catholics are taking special interest in marrying our prophet with a nine year old girl, we are very happy to know and would like to celebrate the marriage of Jesus with Mary Magdalene. However the church may deny it, we will never believe that Jesus as 30 year old Jew was preaching and unmarried. The first lesson that Jesus should have preached was to be married.

Marriage is not a sin. We cannot understand that Jesus as a man and as a Jew was unmarried. If we had known anything about the first 30 years of the life of Jesus, where he lived and what he did, it would be more useful. may be he was married more than once. Who knows? It is quite possible. Perhaps Jesus as a man had a good wonderful happy (married ?) life.**
 
planten said:
**While Catholics are taking special interest in marrying our prophet with a nine year old girl, we are very happy to know and would like to celebrate the marriage of Jesus with Mary Magdalene. However the church may deny it, we will never believe that Jesus as 30 year old Jew was preaching and unmarried. The first lesson that Jesus should have preached was to be married.

Marriage is not a sin. We cannot understand that Jesus as a man and as a Jew was unmarried. If we had known anything about the first 30 years of the life of Jesus, where he lived and what he did, it would be more useful. may be he was married more than once. Who knows? It is quite possible. Perhaps Jesus as a man had a good wonderful happy (married ?) life.**
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We talk about Mohammad marrying a six year old child because it is in your scripture. The fact is well established and accepted among Muslim scholars. We don’t make it up.** It attracts our attention because we find it abominable, disgusting, immoral and shameful that a 53 years old man should marry a six years old child.** This man has no shame and his act in having sex with a nine years old child is most despicable. And so that is why it becomes a talking point.

You are blaspheming against Jesus if you insinuate that he married Mary Magdalene, for which you should be banned from this forum. This is because you are assuming things that are not found in our scripture.

Fair is fair. If it is in the scripture, go ahead and discuss it. We do NOT evade any issue or any question but it is another matter if you put in speculation as if it is scriptural truth. You have to answer for the bad faith as a forum participant.
 
Reuben_J said:
We talk about Mohammad marrying a six year old child because it is in your scripture.
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**Again Muhammad and the six year old girl. Reuben, we do not accuse Jesus of marrying a six year old girl. But we certainly believe that he was married to Mary Magdalene who was a grown up lady.

That may be the second wife of Jesus. The first 30 years of the life of Jesus are hidden as a secret. Nobody is telling where he was and what he was doing. Who knows what was going on in those years? There was no ban on marriage of the son of a carpentar.

There is only one good thing we know about Jesus is that he learnt the bibleOT from elders, teachers lesson by lesson and page by page. He attended the class on religeous studies. More over he was an Essene.

You discuss the private life of Muhammad. We will discuss the private life of Jesus as a parallel for you.**
 
Please let me know if I am misunderstanding you.

Jesus HAD to be married because of the Divine Command. Anyone who dies and never was married is now in Hell because they did not obey the Divine Command. This would include Elijah and Elisha, unless they were never real to begin with
 
ralphinal said:
Please let me know if I am misunderstanding you.

Jesus HAD to be married because of the Divine Command. Anyone who dies and never was married is now in Hell because they did not obey the Divine Command. This would include Elijah and Elisha, unless they were never real to begin with
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Yes, you are misunderstanding me and this is due to your assumption that I am viewing this from the Christian view. I have no problem to view Elijah the way that you do and knowing that if he were not married that he is not burning in hell. Hell, your view of it, is for the Christians… it is not for the rest of us who know God is not sadistic.

And Jesus was married according to the NT since it claims that he was a Jewish Rabbi, which means he was a teacher of the Law of God. There is also the claim that he fulfilled the Law (matt 5:17-19), which being a teacher and so accepted by those who held high positions in the Jewish community means he obviously did fulfill the Law. It is not the language of Rocket Scientists that I am speaking here… it is (supposed to be) common sense.
 
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