Belleville Diocesan priests ask Bp. Braxton to resign

[Nordar]

I guess I don’t see spending money from the wrong account on a legitimate expense as “taking $18K”.

Accounting issue? Yes.

Inappropriate use of authority? Maybe.

Theft? No.

Ditto!

 

[qui_est_ce]

I guess I don’t see spending money from the wrong account on a legitimate expense as “taking $18K”.

If he had to ask for money from a private donor later to refund the fund, it’s obvious there wasn’t enough money for the expenditures, so he took the money from where ever he could get.

Accounting issue? Yes.

Inappropriate use of authority? Maybe.

Bingo!

(can you tell I’m an accountant and tax preparer as well?)

 

[Engineer1]

If he had to ask for money from a private donor later to refund the fund, it’s obvious there wasn’t enough money for the expenditures, so he took the money from where ever he could get.

Maybe…or perhaps the business rules of the diocese prevented him from transferring money from somewhere else…OR he thought getting a patron to cover the cost would be a better remedy than cutting some other program to cover the bill.

In any case, I see this as a mistake, not a crime…and not a mistake that rises to the level that ought to incite a rebellion among the presbyterate.

 

[RobbyS]

Maybe…or perhaps the business rules of the diocese prevented him from transferring money from somewhere else…OR he thought getting a patron to cover the cost would be a better remedy than cutting some other program to cover the bill.

In any case, I see this as a mistake, not a crime…and not a mistake that rises to the level that ought to incite a rebellion among the presbyterate.

Having read through this long thread, I notice the tendency of the biship’s opponents to avoid the theological issues. It took me many years to realize that what the Church suffered during the 60s and ’
70s was a second Reformation. It like the first was a rebellion among the lower clergy and nuns against the bishops. It began with a rejection of abuses and ended with a practical rejection of the authority of the hierarchy. During the counter-reformation bishops, especially new bishops, who sought to implement the reforms of Trent faced clergy who were steeped in quasi-protestant views or Erasmian views, neither of which conformed with the teachings of the Council. They had to fight the clergy tooth and nail, and every charge was thrown back and forth. It took more than a generation for the countereformation to take hold. Now we are involved in something similar, and I am inclied to think that matter of the money is basically a pretence.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

Having read through this long thread, I notice the tendency of the biship’s opponents to avoid the theological issues. It took me many years to realize that what the Church suffered during the 60s and ’
70s was a second Reformation. It like the first was a rebellion among the lower clergy and nuns against the bishops. It began with a rejection of abuses and ended with a practical rejection of the authority of the hierarchy. During the counter-reformation bishops, especially new bishops, who sought to implement the reforms of Trent faced clergy who were steeped in quasi-protestant views or Erasmian views, neither of which conformed with the teachings of the Council. They had to fight the clergy tooth and nail, and every charge was thrown back and forth. It took more than a generation for the countereformation to take hold. Now we are involved in something similar, and I am inclied to think that matter of the money is basically a pretence.

I agree.

CDL

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I guess I don’t see spending money from the wrong account on a legitimate expense as “taking $18K”.

Accounting issue? Yes.

Inappropriate use of authority? Maybe.

Theft? No.

AMEN!

What did he “Spend the loot on?”

Vestments for the Cathedral - 5 sets - and office furniture for the chancery.

Not exactly “taking the money and running” is it?

And it has been replaced.

I have written about this on our group blog

Bishop Braxton Fire Them!

Are You Kidding Me? SUPPORT BISHOP BRAXTON!

Bellevilles “60%”???

Braxton’s Belleville 46 Identified - Look familiar?

 

[qui_est_ce]

Maybe…or perhaps the business rules of the diocese prevented him from transferring money from somewhere else…OR he thought getting a patron to cover the cost would be a better remedy than cutting some other program to cover the bill.

Yes, the program to pay for his backyard swimming pool?

In any case, I see this as a mistake, not a crime…and not a mistake that rises to the level that ought to incite a rebellion among the presbyterate.

Abortion isn’t a crime, gay marriage isn’t a crime in some states. A bishop, a priest, a Catholic, is held to a different standard than the secular definition of “crime.”
You are all making excuses for scandal because you want Braxton’s Orthodoxy. I too want Orthodoxy, but fighting wrong with wrong is not the way of the Lord.

God bless, and good night.

 

[Engineer1]

Not making any excuses…and your insinuation that the bishop used diocesan funds to pay for his swimming pool is ridiculous.

The revolution is over. The rebels lost.

There’s nothing more to this story than a good priest and bishop facing mutiny by some of his priests because he won’t do what they want him to do.

See here for context and explaination: cdobs.com/archive/our-columns/resentment-in-search-of-a-grievance923/

 

[dmelosi]

Yes, the program to pay for his backyard swimming pool?

Abortion isn’t a crime, gay marriage isn’t a crime in some states. A bishop, a priest, a Catholic, is held to a different standard than the secular definition of “crime.”
You are all making excuses for scandal because you want Braxton’s Orthodoxy. I too want Orthodoxy, but fighting wrong with wrong is not the way of the Lord.

God bless, and good night.

One accusation after another. Now about a pool? Excuses for what scandal? I am guessing you dont believe the bishop no matter what.

 

[qui_est_ce]

One accusation after another. Now about a pool? Excuses for what scandal? I am guessing you dont believe the bishop no matter what.

Oh YES, I believe Bishop Braxton, when he is speaking on faith and morals. Unfortunately he has opened the doors of scandal in his Diocese by ignoring what Archbishop Raymond Burke has deemed the appearance of scandal.

 

[dmelosi]

Oh YES, I believe Bishop Braxton, when he is speaking on faith and morals. Unfortunately he has opened the doors of scandal in his Diocese by ignoring what Archbishop Raymond Burke has deemed the appearance of scandal.

Not sure what you mean by the last part about the appearance of scandal.

And does that mean you don’t believe him on other things?

 

[Nordar]

You are all making excuses for scandal because you want Braxton’s Orthodoxy. I too want Orthodoxy, but fighting wrong with wrong is not the way of the Lord.

God bless, and good night.

I haven’t seen anyone making excuses for him, you seem totally h—bent on making him out to be a criminal. Why is that?
You also continue to compare him to Bishop Burke and what he has done, Why is that?
They are two entirely different scenarios, why the need to keep bringing Burke into this?

 

[Walt_Oliver]

Reminder:

This is a **news **forum, a Catholic news forum. It is expected that all be treated with charity, this expectation being equally applicable to other posters and to public figures such as politicians and church hierarchy. It is also expected that when allegations are made, whether in the original or subsequent posts, they be backed up with links to legitimate news stories. Thank you for your cooperation.

 

[iamrefreshed]

Yes, the program to pay for his backyard swimming pool?

I think you have your pools and Bishops confused.

It was JPII who had a pool built with Church funds. He said it was less expensive than electing a new Pope!

 

[qui_est_ce]

I think you have your pools and Bishops confused.

It was JPII who had a pool built with Church funds. He said it was less expensive than electing a new Pope!

Chicago Tribune:

Two years into his Lake Charles ministry, Braxton purchased a home in the center of town with a backyard pool. He repainted and furnished the home with donations and gifts, including a hot tub shipped from St. Louis. A self-proclaimed teacher as well as a pastor, he expected precision and often corrected people when they changed the words or altered the liturgy.

 

[qui_est_ce]

Not sure what you mean by the last part about the appearance of scandal.

And does that mean you don’t believe him on other things?

Chicago Tribune:

Some priests say the ramifications of the appointment are already starting to show. Monsignor James Margason, vicar general for the diocese, said empty envelopes for the bishop’s annual fundraising campaign are arriving from parishioners who question how their money would be spent.

Why are they questioning how their money would be spent?

 

[Nordar]

Originally Posted by Chicago Tribune
Two years into his Lake Charles ministry, Braxton purchased a home in the center of town with a backyard pool. He repainted and furnished the home with donations and gifts, including a hot tub shipped from St. Louis. A self-proclaimed teacher as well as a pastor, he expected precision and often corrected people when they changed the words or altered the liturgy.

I am confused what was the purpose of posting this?
So he bought a home with a back yard pool? that is actually contradictory to what you posted earlier, You said he bought the pool with Church money, which quite evidently according to the Tribune he did not.
As a Bishop adhereing to the teachings of the Church, he is supposed to correct Liturgical abuses, and Bravo! to him for doing so. By the Tribune saying he expected precision they are catering to the Liberal bent of The Church as if that were a no no. they are biased and quite wrong.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

Why are they questioning how their money would be spent?

It could be that the recalcitrant priests are planting seeds of dissent. I’ve heard priests ridicule Cardinal Francis George during Mass. It certainly isn’t something new.

CDL

 

[GregoryPalamas]

“A self-proclaimed teacher as well as a pastor, he expected precision and often corrected people when they changed the words or altered the liturgy.”

Thank God he does. I’m glad that good bishops do this.

CDL

 

[Nordar]

“A self-proclaimed teacher as well as a pastor, he expected precision and often corrected people when they changed the words or altered the liturgy.”

Thank God he does. I’m glad that good bishops do this.

CDL

But sadly they are being persecuted for it! it is almost as if The media ( The Tribune, etc) are scrambling for negative things to say about him. So far the only negative thing is that he used some money from a fund that he was not supposed to. At the time of doing so he said that if it were wrong he would correct it. I have not heard of any other substancial allegations against him.~~~~~ Except he was toooo much a Bishop of The Catholic Church expecting Priests not to abuse The Liturgy~~~