Ben Stein: Science Leads to Killing People

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Evidence? You said the “E” word! They don’t need no stinking evidence. They want it to be true, and so it must be.

You’re one of those people who think there’s an objective reality, aren’t you?
As a university faculty member, yes, I do believe in the objective reality of diverse thinking among university faculty. We have some vigorous and even rancorous disputes on campus. I suspect the people who forward this claim of “academic group think” have only modest acquaintance with college or university life and learning.

StAnastasia
 
Is there evidence to back up this claim?
I posted a study concerning liberal bias in colleges and universities, especially the ivy league univerisites.

Here is an article stating the fact that Catholic Universities have been the cause of the loss of faith for many students because they are not carefull about guarding the faith on campus:

Note: it begins with a statement by pope Benedict.
lifesitenews.com/ldn/2005/nov/05112504.html

ROME, November 25, 2005 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Pope Benedict XVI paid a visit to Rome’s Sacred Heart Catholic University today to address students on the occasion of the inauguration of the academic year. The Pope, knowing the devastation to the faith of millions of Catholic students which has taken place in Catholic universities, asked pointedly of students at Catholic Universities “How do they leave? What culture did they find, assimilate, develop?”

The ideal envisioned by the Catholic Church for Catholic schooling has been expounded on in various papal documents. It revolves around the hope of higher learning fused with formation in faith in God and the pursuit of the logical connection between faith and reason. As Pope Benedict put it, “This is the great challenge: … to give life to a true Catholic university, one that excels for the quality of its research and teaching and, at the same time, for its faithfulness to the Gospel and to the Church’s Magisterium.”

However, that ideal has, for the most part, been gravely distorted especially in North America. Even if young people survive with their faith intact until university or college age, statistics show they will lose their faith in so-called Catholic higher education.

A large study which gained massive attention in 2003 found that by the time they graduate, students at many Catholic colleges are significantly more opposed to Church teachings, pray less, and are in many ways less religious than when they were freshmen. The study, based on annual surveys by UCLA’s Higher Education Research Institute (HERI), surveyed students at 38 Catholic colleges finding that:

· Whereas a majority of students entered Catholic colleges pro-life (55% opposed to legal abortion, 45% in support), many graduated pro-abortion (57% pro-abortion, 43% pro-life).

· Support for legalizing homosexual “marriages” increased from 55% to 71% by senior year.

· Approval of having sex with someone known “for only a very short time” increased from 30% to 49% by senior year.

· Although 15% of seniors reported much stronger religious beliefs and convictions than when they were freshmen, the same growth was reported by 12% of seniors at nonsectarian colleges and 24% of seniors at other religious colleges (mostly Protestant).

· Only 37% of seniors prayed more than one hour a week; 31% didn’t pray at all.

· Among Catholic students, 9% left the faith by graduation. Although 11% of non-Catholic students converted to the Church, their actual numbers were smaller and still left Catholic colleges with a net 4% loss of Catholics.

· Among Catholic seniors, 13% did not attend a religious service in the past year (a four-fold increase since their freshman year), and about half attended only occasionally.

more can be read at:

.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2005/nov/05112504.html

But I guess those statistics are not ‘real’ since they won’t back up your point of view? ehh?!

In Christ, maryJohnZ
 
…· Approval of having sex with someone known “for only a very short time” increased from 30% to 49% by senior year.

· Although 15% of seniors reported much stronger religious beliefs and convictions than …
and from a slightly different perspective.

I remember my undergrad and grad days. it was a time to challenge everything you learned or were taught or were lectured at when you lived under your parents’ wings and that includes, for the vast majority of us, faith. because that’s what you do when you’re 18 years old and growing up.

I’d question the emotional maturity of someone who didn’t.
 
Here is an article stating the fact that Catholic Universities have been the cause of the loss of faith for many students because they are not carefull about guarding the faith on campus:
It’s a shame the Catholic students’ families did not strengthen them sufficiently to withstand the inevitable evil sexual temptations consequent upon a bunch of young people living in their own dorm rooms, far from home and without parental supervision. I suppose it’s easier for you people without much personal experience of higher education to resort to the same old game: let’s blame the professors!😃

StAnastasia
 
It’s a shame the Catholic students’ families did not strengthen them sufficiently to withstand the inevitable evil sexual temptations consequent upon a bunch of young people living in their own dorm rooms, far from home and without parental supervision. I suppose it’s easier for you people without much personal experience of higher education to resort to the same old game: let’s blame the professors!😃

StAnastasia
I blame myself. I had a great time living in a college dorm, surrounded by people my age, away from home, no supervision but my own. I’d do the same again in a heart beat. no lasting harm.
 
I blame myself. I had a great time living in a college dorm, surrounded by people my age, away from home, no supervision but my own. I’d do the same again in a heart beat. no lasting harm.
Decades ago, when I was a student in Europe, the young women in one of the university’s female residence halls wanted to extend the curfew for male visitors beyond 10:00 p.m., to midnight. The elderly spinster principal rejected that request out of fear of “what the young men might do to you.”😦 The frustrated young women objected, “What could the young men possibly do to us after 10:00 p.m. that they couldn’t equally well do before 10:00?” The flustered principal stammered, “But, but, but, then they might try to do it again!”:eek:

StAnastasia
 
and from a slightly different perspective.

I remember my undergrad and grad days. it was a time to challenge everything you learned or were taught or were lectured at when you lived under your parents’ wings and that includes, for the vast majority of us, faith. because that’s what you do when you’re 18 years old and growing up.

I’d question the emotional maturity of someone who didn’t.
Well, I guess if you can easily throw out the fourth commandment and rebell, and call it normal if you like…

The problem is that the fourth commandment was a respected commandment until it was attacked during the 60s and 70s, partly by the media and modern psychologists who declared it ‘normal’ for young people to rebell against their parents and pushed the notion of the ‘generation gap’ being normal as well.
I look back and can remember the TIME magazine article with ‘generation gap’ announced as some new and prominent modern phenomena. Since then it has been pushed as ‘normal’ for this rebellion to take place. Recenntly i discovered that the Unitariarian Universalists, who push an individual’s ability to intellectualize and form their own ideas as the paramont aspect of human development…so it is part of their religious belief system that teens should be encouraged to act and think separate from the family values they are brought up with. I feel that religious belief system has taken over the psychological interpretation of the ‘teen’ years. I do not think there is anything normal about wanted to do things you know your parents woud disapprove of.
Flaunting that as a normal psychological stage has damaged the coonection between young people and their parents, damaged the family unit and damaged young people in general who are encouraged to act in a rebellious way, often leading to personal harm.

I wish I had had more courage to tall my parents what was going on in some of my college classes…like the professor who wanted us all to do some kind of form of ‘erotic’ art…or go to strip clubs for drawing excursions…I should have told my parents because it made me very uncomfortable and confused and it did hurt me. Liberation? I think not… Some call for higher consciousness? Hardly… teachers who actively work to make
students who have more conservative or traditional values feel backward or wrong are themselves corrupters and wrong.

I can say I saw my friends get hurt too, in different ways…
Now as a parent I can say I see my own children’s friends go through this kind of corrupting influence and they, too, are hurt by it. My own kids, just completing college saw plenty of other kids with disfunctional family relationships and disfunctional personal relationships with their own boyfriends.

Maybe because I always talked with my kids and helped them see both sides of issues and showed them the logic or illogic behind a lot of liberal ideas have always been church goers, and always faithful to Catholic teaching. Many of their friends were envious of them because they could see thay had strong family ties they could depend on.

Rebellion and youth necessarily going together to be ‘normal’?!
I don’t buy into it…

here is what I mean by this viewpoint coming out of the Unitarian Universalist religion: (from a universalist website)

"Unitarians don’t give children absolutes – ours is a religion that embraces paradox, complexity, and diversity. If we have primary guiding principles, they might be love, the context of life, and hope, the creativity of life, and, of course, respect. Often people don’t even think about attending a church until their children ask, “What is God?” Most of us are, in fact, struck dumb by these questions and filled with awe about the unanswerables in life. We know however we respond to this young human being will have a lasting impact on how she perceives her world and her place in it. It is in moments like this that concerned parents wonder if there is a circle of wise spiritual teachers out there somewhere that would provide support.

The Unitarian Universalist faith doesn’t pretend to give children all the answers to the big questions. Unitarian Universalism puts its faith in people’s ability to explore the unknown together. It doesn’t pretend to take away the mystery. Unitarian Universalist churches uphold liberal values of freedom of belief and conscience, unrestricted use of reason in religious inquiry, and tolerance for theological diversity."
archive.uua.org/re/reach/spring00/leadership/do_children_need_religion.html

Sound like what we have in our public schools doesn’t it?
yeah, i question values…these BOGUS values…

In Christ
MaryJohnZ
 
I blame myself. I had a great time living in a college dorm, surrounded by people my age, away from home, no supervision but my own. I’d do the same again in a heart beat. no lasting harm.

Its a shame that we aren’t all working together to support our young people in practicing the virtues of chastity, obedience,prudence,and charity toward others… it’s a shame it has become old fashion to want to be virtuous and old fashion for young men to feel the need to protect the virtue of young women, rather than being told it is their right and nature to try to rob virtue from women. It is a shame that people can talk glibbly about sin as if it was inevitable and not feel regret for it.

I certainly see it as lacking charity for your neighbor not to want to support them in living according to God;s Law. Perhaps you did not see anyone get hurt, have an unwanted pregnancy or an abortion or be demeaned by a bad relationship in which they were sexually used…or lose the ability to trust males…
perhaps you never saw that, but it is a real consequence of the patterns of behavior we are allowing our young people to become involved in.

here are some statistics from a Janet Smith presentation on the changing ages in which young people lose their virginity:
  1. In the 1960s, 25 percent of young men and 45 percent of young women were virgins at age 19;
    by the 1980s, fewer than 20 percent of males and females were. [show slide]
  2. In the 1950s, roughly 9 in 10 young women got married without living with their partner,
    compared with 1 in 3 in the early 1990s. [show slide]
  3. The percentage of white women married from 1960-65 who were virgins was 43; from 1980-85
    it was 14.
    aodonline.org/aodonline-sqlimages/shms/faculty/SmithJanet/Publications/HumanaeVitae/PremaritalSex.pdf
    so,
    In 1950s 9 out of 10 young women got married without living with their partners! Man, that sure has changed! In 1960s, 45% of young women were virgins at age 19, by the 1980s (thanks to Planned parenthood and the pill) 20% of males and females were virgins at age 19…
That isn’t something to celebrate! That is tragedy and it is evil…

In Christ, maryJohnZ
 
you can call me whatever floats your boat.
This is a Catholic forum for Catholic values and ideas…so if your are not Catholic you should not be posting here… And you certain;y shouldn’t falsely represent yourself as Catholic in a discussion.

In Christ, maryJohnZ
 

That isn’t something to celebrate! That is tragedy and it is evil…

In Christ, maryJohnZ
I had a fairly normal, evil, average college life and moved on. I’m not trying to wind you up, but maybe you should stand down, take a breath.
 
This is a Catholic forum for Catholic values and ideas…so if your are not Catholic you should not be posting here… And you certain;y shouldn’t falsely represent yourself as Catholic in a discussion.

In Christ, maryJohnZ
you are kidding, right?
 
I had a fairly normal, evil, average college life and moved on. I’m not trying to wind you up, but maybe you should stand down, take a breath.
Sorry you are incapable of recognizing the evil around you…

In Christ
maryJohnZ
 
I had a fairly normal, evil, average college life and moved on. I’m not trying to wind you up, but maybe you should stand down, take a breath.
Good advice. My college years were certainly a life-learning experience! I don’t know that we lost our faith at any greater rate that the ones who didn’t go to college.
 
as a … what am I? a utrinitarian conversationalist …I do recognize evil.
I’m a prelactarian – are you? I did pick that habit up in university. My spouse, however, is a confirmed postlactarian.

StA
 
I’m a prelactarian – are you? I did pick that habit up in university. My spouse, however, is a confirmed postlactarian.

StA
I see that the poasts crossed.

Confess the heinous sin of heresy, reject the works of the ungodly - two last chances. And you shall be free - three last chances. You have three last chances, the nature of which I have divulged in my previous utterance. – Cardinal Ximinez
 
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