Beside the Bible is there anything else to show us god?

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Abbadon

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Attempted conversions of my self has failed for the sole reason that i do not believe in the bible and do not put faith in it being true. Beside the bible is there anything that would indicate to us the existence of God, as in the single god that christianity worships and loves…
 
The Holy Eucharist - to be found at your local Catholic Church. God present in a unique and physical way.

Go at a time when they are having Eucharistic Adoration (where the sacred Host is exposed for public veneration) and spend an hour or two simply in His presence. Talk to Him, ask Him to show you that He really exits, say whatever you want, but be sure you spend an equal amount of time just listening :getholy:
 
Do you or do you not exist? (Yes)

Well, is it a contradiction in terms, something that is meaningless, for you not to exist? (No, since you didn’t exist for most of the universe’s history)

If you exist, but it’s not logically necessary for you to exist (i.e. your nonexistence is not inconceivable), your existence is dependent. And it can only be dependent on something whose existence is logically necessary. What might that be?

Well, apparently things exist. If existence can be predicated of anything, existence itself must be real. And…its existence is logically necessary.

Now for anything to exist it depends on existence; in order to support the dependence of radically great degrees of being, existence must be infinite. Since it must be infinite it must not lack a single trait–other than evils, which are not traits in themselves but lacks of other traits.

One of these perfections we call intellect. So existence itself, is an intelligent being, since it cannot lack anything. Another is will. So it has will. And since it lacks nothing it has no evil, it is all good–and with a will, so it always wills good.

This existence we call, by an accident of linguistics, God. Its name, if one wants to listen to people who claim to have spoken to it, is I AM–in other words, existence itself, as expressed by a person.
 
LilyM said:
The Holy Eucharist - to be found at your local Catholic Church. God present in a unique and physical way.

Go at a time when they are having Eucharistic Adoration (where the sacred Host is exposed for public veneration) and spend an hour or two simply in His presence. Talk to Him, ask Him to show you that He really exits, say whatever you want, but be sure you spend an equal amount of time just listening :getholy:
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I was at youth conference last week and the bishop said something really nice like that. God’s language is silence.

That’s fine and all and i may have a personal experience but all that shows and proves is my own consciousness… And yes at youth camp i did have a personal experience a personal experience that was replicated at a Buddhist temple during mediation a short time later…
 
Hastrman said:
Do you or do you not exist? (Yes)

Well, is it a contradiction in terms, something that is meaningless, for you not to exist? (No, since you didn’t exist for most of the universe’s history)

If you exist, but it’s not logically necessary for you to exist (i.e. your nonexistence is not inconceivable), your existence is dependent. And it can only be dependent on something whose existence is logically necessary. What might that be?

Well, apparently things exist. If existence can be predicated of anything, existence itself must be real. And…its existence is logically necessary.

Now for anything to exist it depends on existence; in order to support the dependence of radically great degrees of being, existence must be infinite. Since it must be infinite it must not lack a single trait–other than evils, which are not traits in themselves but lacks of other traits.

One of these perfections we call intellect. So existence itself, is an intelligent being, since it cannot lack anything. Another is will. So it has will. And since it lacks nothing it has no evil, it is all good–and with a will, so it always wills good.

This existence we call, by an accident of linguistics, God. Its name, if one wants to listen to people who claim to have spoken to it, is I AM–in other words, existence itself, as expressed by a person.
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I honestly have no idea what your going on about here could you possibly simplify it into dot points?
 
Oh i forgot to answer your question. Yes i do exist, in the way of “I think therefore I am” and that is all i can be sure of to exist. Everything else maynot exist, not that it really matters, i’ll go along with the assumptions that my senses are telling me about the reality I am in are true, untill indicated otherwise… Like if I took the red pill…
 
Guess so.
  • Do you or do you not exist? (Yes)
  • Well, is it a contradiction in terms, something that is meaningless, for you not to exist? (No, since you didn’t exist for most of the universe’s history)
  • If you exist, but it’s not logically necessary for you to exist (i.e. your nonexistence is not inconceivable), your existence is dependent. And it can only be dependent on something whose existence is logically necessary. What might that be?
  • Well, apparently things exist. If existence can be predicated of anything, existence itself must be real. And…its existence is logically necessary.
  • Now for anything to exist it depends on existence; in order to support the dependence of radically great degrees of being, existence must be infinite. Since it must be infinite it must not lack a single trait–other than evils, which are not traits in themselves but lacks of other traits.
  • One of these perfections we call intellect. So existence itself, is an intelligent being, since it cannot lack anything. Another is will. So it has will. And since it lacks nothing it has no evil, it is all good–and with a will, so it always wills good.
  • This existence we call, by an accident of linguistics, God. Its name, if one wants to listen to people who claim to have spoken to it, is I AM–in other words, existence itself, as expressed by a person.
 
Abbadon said:
Oh i forgot to answer your question. Yes i do exist, in the way of “I think therefore I am” and that is all i can be sure of to exist. Everything else maynot exist, not that it really matters, i’ll go along with the assumptions that my senses are telling me about the reality I am in are true, untill indicated otherwise… Like if I took the red pill…
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But that was only my first question, there’s a second:

Is your existence logically necessary? That is, would it be meaningless for there to be a universe in which you didn’t?
 
Abbadon said:
Attempted conversions of my self has failed for the sole reason that i do not believe in the bible and do not put faith in it being true. Beside the bible is there anything that would indicate to us the existence of God, as in the single god that christianity worships and loves…
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Read about Natural [Moral] Law, if that does not work talk to athiest about their moral code. They will explain Natural [Moral] Law back to you then try to find a way to explain how it was developed either answer that question for them or accept the current principle

Hope that helps
 
Texas_Roofer said:
Read about Natural [Moral] Law, if that does not work talk to athiest about their moral code. They will explain Natural [Moral] Law back to you then try to find a way to explain how it was developed either answer that question for them or accept the current principle

Hope that helps
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Social evolution explains that pretty well… It makes sense
 
Abbadon said:
No
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Right. But if your existence is real but not logically necessary, it must be dependent on something whose existence is logically necessary.

Now, because we say that things exist, and are not talking nonsense, something called “existence” must also exist. Its existence, therefore, is logically necessary–it is inconceivable for existence not to exist, if anything else does, just as it is inconceivable for light not to exist, if we can see anything.

Now, anything one can even imagine as existing, must depend on that existence–which means that existence is greater than anything else, since it contains them all.
 
Hastrman said:
Right. But if your existence is real but not logically necessary, it must be dependent on something whose existence is logically necessary.

Now, because we say that things exist, and are not talking nonsense, something called “existence” must also exist. Its existence, therefore, is logically necessary–it is inconceivable for existence not to exist, if anything else does, just as it is inconceivable for light not to exist, if we can see anything.

Now, anything one can even imagine as existing, must depend on that existence–which means that existence is greater than anything else, since it contains them all.
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Why must it be dependent? why can’t it just be because it is? There must be a universe for me to exist the way i know it, but if it wasn’t so then i wouldn’t exist the way i know it. So i wouldn’t be able to ask these questions. Oh okay i see what you mean without the universe i exist in me as me wouldn’t exist.

Well actually your second paragraph is false as shown by example in the matrix. We can see things and “light” does not really exist
 
Abbadon said:
Why must it be dependent? why can’t it just be because it is? There must be a universe for me to exist the way i know it, but if it wasn’t so then i wouldn’t exist the way i know it. So i wouldn’t be able to ask these questions. Oh okay i see what you mean without the universe i exist in me as me wouldn’t exist.

Well actually your second paragraph is false as shown by example in the matrix. We can see things and “light” does not really exist
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It cannot “just be because it is” because then its is-ness, its being, would have to be identical with its it-ness, its identity: by being itself it would have to inescapably follow that it also exist. That is only predicable of existence, since being or existence is the identity of existence. Of all other things existence does not necessarily follow.

And in the Matrix one sees nothing. “Seeing” means perceiving light, not false sensory data being (name removed by moderator)ut directly to one’s visual cortex. It is debatable whether anyone in the matrix would not have serious vision problems once they were out, since some structures in the eye are light-sensitive and break down if they’re in the dark too long.

But nobody sees anything, really sees anything, without there being light.
 
Abbadon said:
Social evolution explains that pretty well… It makes sense
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you are kidding yourself, social evolution concludes the strong prey upon the poor and you should join the strong even attempt to make them poor
 
Abbadon said:
Attempted conversions of my self has failed for the sole reason that i do not believe in the bible and do not put faith in it being true. Beside the bible is there anything that would indicate to us the existence of God, as in the single god that christianity worships and loves…
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I find God in the world around me - nature itself has God’s signature upon it. I’m not pantheist … but the entire world, its seasons, cycles, physical laws, beauty - to me they show God. An artist portrays much of themselves in their work … I believe there’s much of God in the earth
 
Abbadon said:
Attempted conversions of my self has failed for the sole reason that i do not believe in the bible and do not put faith in it being true. Beside the bible is there anything that would indicate to us the existence of God, as in the single god that christianity worships and loves…
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Try peterkreeft.com/featured-writing.htm or listen to his featured audio section. He does a great job showing that God’s existence is a reasonable belief.
 
If your looking for “proof” you still lack faith.Keep searching and Father will find you.
 
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