Bible corruption/islamic point of view

[inJESUS]

Peace to you brother here more verses please try to understand it slowly:

Peace

005.015
YUSUFALI: O people of the Book! There hath come to you our Messenger, revealing to you much that ye used to hide in the Book,

and passing over much (that is now unnecessary): There hath come to you from Allah a (new) light and a perspicuous Book, - hiding something means that it already exists but you are hiding it…hiding does not mean corruption…and we see from muslim commentaries that some jews used to hide the **meaning ** of their scriptures.

003.071
YUSUFALI: Ye People of the Book! Why do ye clothe Truth with falsehood, and conceal the Truth

, while ye have knowledge? see? concealing the truth does not mean corruption…you can have a correct book and hide its truth by giving or “clothing” it with a different interpretation.

004.046
YUSUFALI: Of the Jews

there are those who displace words from their (right) places, and say: “We hear and we disobey”; and “Hear what is not Heard”; and “Ra’ina”; with a twist of their tongues and a slander to Faith. If only they had said: “What hear and we obey”; and “Do hear”; and “Do look at us”; it would have been better for them, and more proper; but Allah hath cursed them for their Unbelief; and but few of them will believe. read the boldened part please : OF THE JEWS= some not all…and OF THEIR TONGUE=twist the meaning…so SOME jews twist THE MEANING WITH THEIR TONGUE.

PICKTHAL: **Some of those **

who are Jews change words from their **context ** and say: “We hear and disobey; hear thou as one who heareth not” and “Listen to us!” **distorting with their tongues ** and slandering religion. If they had said: “We hear and we obey: hear thou, and look at us” it had been better for them, and more upright. But Allah hath cursed them for their disbelief, so they believe not, save a few. same.

002.075
YUSUFALI: Can ye (o ye men of Faith) entertain the hope that they will believe in you?- Seeing that **a party of them **

heard the Word of Allah, and perverted it knowingly after they understood it. the boldened part again: a party, not all Jews and perverted=gave a pervert interpretation even thou they UNDERSTOOD it…no textual corruption whatsoever .

 

[inJESUS]

gurrato alaien:

Also brother I have one question for you why you believe in Trinity despite its not even mentioned in the bible in any version of any language. think brother please think may God guide you to the truth.

Peace.

the word in itself does not exist…but the concept did…the early fathers put the concept into words to make it easier to grasp…in islam, don’t you have Ijtihad? this is the same…interpretation of an existent doctrine.

 

[Justice2006]

Qoute:

**If the Holy Spirit inspired the whole Bible, why don’t the books all possess the same style of writing?

If God never changes, why would his writing styles change so radically? Doesn’t this prove the Holy Spirit wasn’t the “principle author” of each book in Scripture? **

---

God bless you all.

.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

inJESUS:

Peace

hiding something means that it already exists but you are hiding it…hiding does not mean corruption…and we see from muslim commentaries that some jews used to hide the **meaning **

of their scriptures.

see? concealing the truth does not mean corruption…you can have a correct book and hide its truth by giving or “clothing” it with a different interpretation.

read the boldened part please : OF THE JEWS= some not all…and OF THEIR TONGUE=twist the meaning…so SOME jews twist THE MEANING WITH THEIR TONGUE.
same.

the boldened part again: a party, not all Jews and perverted=gave a pervert interpretation even thou they UNDERSTOOD it…no textual corruption whatsoever .

Peace again brother,
Actually corruption that mean people change the words of God delete or hide or concealing, or write the Book with their own hands its all means people have touched and change God’s word that means its corrupted .
example i have book and i want to rewrite it again so whatever i want i will keep and whatever i don’t want i will delete and i will add some thing that all means this book has been changed in other word its corrupted.
you can’t interpret Quran better than Muslims scholars, can you?.

also if you refer that you want the same word curruption, i just asked you if the trinity word available in the bible you said no,
you told me the concept of trinity there. but the trinity word no
so what is your point.

 

[Justice2006]

inJESUS:

the boldened part again: a party, not all Jews and perverted=gave a pervert interpretation even thou they UNDERSTOOD it…no textual corruption whatsoever .

Your Catholic Bible tells us that:

However, even this analysis of the Pentateuch is an over-simplification , for it is not always possible to distinguish with certainty among the various sources.

The fact is that each of these individual traditions incorporates much older material. The Yahwist was himself a collector and adapter. His narrative is made up of many disparate stories that have been reoriented, and given a meaning within the context in which they now stand; e.g., the story of Abraham and Isaac in Gen 22. Within the J and P traditions one has to reckon with many individual units; these had their own history and life-setting before they were brought together into the present more or less connected narrative.

This is not to deny the role of Moses in the development of the Pentateuch. It is true we do not conceive of him as the author of the books in the modern sense. But there is no reason to doubt that, in the events described in these traditions, he had a uniquely important role, especially as lawgiver. Even the later laws which have been added in P and D are presented as a Mosaic heritage. Moses is the lawgiver par excellence, and all later legislation is conceived in his spirit, and therefore attributed to him. Hence, the reader is not held to undeviating literalness in interpreting the words, “the LORD said to Moses.” One must keep in mind that the Pentateuch is the crystallization of Israel’s age-old relationship with God.

[usccb.org/nab/bible/pentateuch.htm]](http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/pentateuch.htm])

God bless you.

 

[inJESUS]

Justice2006:

Qoute:

**If the Holy Spirit inspired the whole Bible, why don’t the books all possess the same style of writing?

If God never changes, why would his writing styles change so radically? Doesn’t this prove the Holy Spirit wasn’t the “principle author” of each book in Scripture? **

---

God bless you all.

.

heheh what do you think the Holy Spirit is? a machine that dictates to you what to write?

 

[inJESUS]

Peace again brother,

peace

Actually corruption that mean people change the words of God delete or hide or concealing, or write the Book with their own hands its all means people have touched and change God’s word that means its corrupted .

yes, people can do whatever they want…but who did conceal some truth or pervert meaning? it is SOME jews…who cares about SOME jews?

example i have book and i want to rewrite it again so whatever i want i will keep and whatever i don’t want i will delete and i will add some thing that all means this book has been changed in other word its corrupted.

great…show me where the quran says that the Bible is textually corrupt by all jews…so far i didn’t find it…if some jews did something, it does not mean they changed the Bible of the entire jews…that would be silly and mohammad never said such a thing…whatever some jews did is irrelevant to the Bible integrity coz mohammad accused some jews and never all jews who had their truthful Bible…

you can’t interpret Quran better than Muslims scholars, can you?.

am looking for verses that show clearly the bible corruption…when you show me this, we’ll move on to what mohammad indeed says about the Bible at his time…

also if you refer that you want the same word curruption, i just asked you if the trinity word available in the bible you said no,
you told me the concept of trinity there. but the trinity word no
so what is your point

by idea is clear…it is an ijtihad, that is, interpretation of a concept…if the word television doesnt exist in quran it doesn not mean that it doesnt exist in reality…this ijtihad applies as well to islam…

 

[inJESUS]

Justice, please do not post irrelevant posts…we are looking for textual corruption of the bible from the quran…we are showing whether the Bible in the 7th century was considered truthful by mohamad.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

inJESUS:

yes, people can do whatever they want…but who did conceal some truth or pervert meaning? it is SOME jews…who cares about SOME jews?

great…show me where the quran says that the Bible is textually corrupt by all jews…so far i didn’t find it…if some jews did something, it does not mean they changed the Bible of the entire jews…that would be silly and mohammad never said such a thing…whatever some jews did is irrelevant to the Bible integrity coz mohammad accused some jews and never all jews who had their truthful Bible…
am looking for verses that show clearly the bible corruption…when you show me this, we’ll move on to what mohammad indeed says about the Bible at his time…

Peace again brother.

I have showed other verses prove that the bible have been corrupted not only the Jews. but even this if one person only have currupted one book and othres have followed that book that means this book has been corrupted and the followers of the book have been deceived.

inJESUS:

by idea is clear…it is an ijtihad, that is, interpretation of a concept…if the word television doesnt exist in quran it doesn not mean that it doesnt exist in reality…this ijtihad applies as well to islam…

So its the same idea regarding the bible corruption despite its mentioned in the Quran whether or not you accept that we can say that the corruption of the bible can find it even as Ijtihad if you like to call it.

By the way Christianity is based on trinity why you have to do Ijtihad to get it why it’s not mentioned in the bible.
In Islam the pure monotheism is clear and has been mentioned hundreds time because Islam is based on monotheism there is only one true God have no son no wife no partner.

Peace.

 

[George_Waters]

gurrato alaien:

In Islam the pure monotheism is clear and has been mentioned hundreds time because Islam is based on monotheism there is only one true God have no son no wife no partner.

God has a wife? Really? You are correct! There is only one true God… and He does not have a wife or a partner and you obviously don’t understand the Trinity in any way shape or form to continue spouting this line. Where do you come up with the whole wife nonsense? The Muslim anthromorphic view of God? It’s getting really old addressing this sort of obvious ignorance.

 

[inJESUS]

Peace again brother.

I have showed other verses prove that the bible have been corrupted not only the Jews. but even this if one person only

have currupted one book and othres have followed that book that means this book has been corrupted and the followers of the book have been deceived. no…the quran said some jews and talked about perverting and hiding the truth…i showed you the problem in each verse you presented…maybe you can show me a verse saying : the scriptures of the jews /Christians are corrupted…reject them and do not read them…verses talking about some jews trying to play tricks on mohammad by not presenting himself their true interpretation has nothing to do with corruption…what is hiding= the original is with you but you hide some of its teachings with your twisted tongues…if mohammad indeed meant the Bible in the hands of the people of the book were corrupt , he would have said it clearly…i’ll quote tonight verses to support my claim .

So its the same idea regarding the bible corruption despite its mentioned in the Quran whether or not you accept that we can say that the corruption of the bible can find it even as Ijtihad if you like to call it.

i didnt get you sorry…is ijtihad wrong? i told you the early fathers interpreted or put in words a concept…just like you put in words any philosophical concept…the concept is there…you need to put it in words in order to teach it better…

By the way Christianity is based on trinity why you have to do Ijtihad to get it why it’s not mentioned in the bible.

it is mentioned in the Bible clearly…but not the words…the disciples did not have the intention to write a doctrinal book…what we have is their letters to other Christians and not the intention to give a final academic book that will be read by bilions of Christians and non-christians…all the doctrines of the Bible, or the ijtihad, is taken from the Bible.

In Islam the pure monotheism is clear and has been mentioned hundreds time because Islam is based on monotheism there is only one true God have no son no wife no partner.

yea mohammad got it wrong…,we don’t believe God took a wife or has a partner and we believe in monotheism…the difference is that God revealed the nature of this Oness…if you don’t get the trinity, it doesnt mean we have 3 gods does it? we believe in one God, whose nature in Trinity not his number.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

George Waters:

God has a wife? Really? You are correct! There is only one true God… and He does not have a wife or a partner and you obviously don’t understand the Trinity in any way shape or form to continue spouting this line. Where do you come up with the whole wife nonsense? The Muslim anthromorphic view of God? It’s getting really old addressing this sort of obvious ignorance.

Brother I did not refer to the trinity when I said no wife, I know that you don’t believe that God has wife, I just wanted to clarify that the pure monotheism in Islam is clear, God only one has no partners whether son or others.

Peace.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

inJESUS:

no…the quran said some jews and talked about perverting and hiding the truth…i showed you the problem in each verse you presented…maybe you can show me a verse saying : the scriptures of the jews /Christians are corrupted…reject them and do not read them…verses talking about some jews trying to play tricks on mohammad by not presenting himself their true interpretation has nothing to do with corruption…what is hiding= the original is with you but you hide some of its teachings with your twisted tongues…if mohammad indeed meant the Bible in the hands of the people of the book were corrupt , he would have said it clearly…i’ll quote tonight verses to support my claim …

Dear brother I suggest to you to read the interpretation of verses that said the bible has been corrupted.

inJESUS:

i didnt get you sorry…is ijtihad wrong? i told you the early fathers interpreted or put in words a concept…just like you put in words any philosophical concept…the concept is there…you need to put it in words in order to teach it better…
it is mentioned in the Bible clearly…but not the words…the disciples did not have the intention to write a doctrinal book…what we have is their letters to other Christians and not the intention to give a final academic book that will be read by bilions of Christians and non-christians…all the doctrines of the Bible, or the ijtihad, is taken from the Bible.
.

No actually Ijtihad is not wrong but we used Ijthihad in Islam in some cases as example watching TV is it halal or haram permitted or prohibited in Islam because TV was not available in that time 1400 ago so Muslims scholars can tell us whether halal or haram this means Ijtihad.
but this will not be incase the core of faith like concept of God. Should be clear in our Holy Quran, hope this clear to you…

inJESUS:

yea mohammad got it wrong…,we don’t believe God took a wife or has a partner and we believe in monotheism…the difference is that God revealed the nature of this Oness…if you don’t get the trinity, it doesnt mean we have 3 gods does it? we believe in one God, whose nature in Trinity not his number.

Brother I did not refer to the trinity when I said no wife, I know that you don’t believe that God has wife, I just wanted to clarify that the pure monotheism in Islam is clear, God only one has no partners whether son or others.

And regarding 3 Gods: its vague its like the concept of the egg.It is 3 in one the white, the yolk and the shell.3 into 1 right?
Is it this your concept of God what God you worship?!
Who come to the earth and walking and getting circumcised and urined and rode the donkey. Please forgive me I am not trying to insult you nor Christians nor the beloved Prophet Jesus pbuh, but I m talking to your brain brother wake up brother please see how beautiful the concept of God in Islam is. see this small chapter describe Almighty Allah:

In the name of Allah, the Compassionate, the Merciful.

112.001
YUSUFALI: Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
PICKTHAL: Say: He is Allah, the One!
SHAKIR: Say: He, Allah, is One.

112.002
YUSUFALI: Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
PICKTHAL: Allah, the eternally Besought of all!
SHAKIR: Allah is He on Whom all depend.

112.003
YUSUFALI: He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
PICKTHAL: He begetteth not nor was begotten.
SHAKIR: He begets not, nor is He begotten.

112.004
YUSUFALI: And there is none like unto Him.
PICKTHAL: And there is none comparable unto Him.
SHAKIR: And none is like Him.

Peace.

 

[George_Waters]

gurrato alaien:

Brother I did not refer to the trinity when I said no wife, I know that you don’t believe that God has wife, I just wanted to clarify that the pure monotheism in Islam is clear, God only one has no partners whether son or others.

Peace.

My apologies. I am glad you understand we do not believe God has a wife. Catholicism also believes in pure monotheism and it is equally clear; there is only one God.

 

[inJESUS]

gurrato alaien:

Brother I did not refer to the trinity when I said no wife, I know that you don’t believe that God has wife, I just wanted to clarify that the pure monotheism in Islam is clear, God only one has no partners whether son or others.

Peace.

the same in Christianity…i think you already know by know what Son of God means? so we believe in one God but we differ about the nature…God revealed His nature to us…to you, “nothing like Allah” is enough? fine…but i don’t think you should disagree with us about His nature coz u don’t know it yourselves…

 

[inJESUS]

Dear brother I suggest to you to read the interpretation of verses that said the bible has been corrupted.

the problem is that i did read the hadith about these verses which proves my point…the early muslim scholars believed in the authenticity of the Bible…the corruption claim is “relatively” new…

No actually Ijtihad is not wrong but we used Ijthihad in Islam in some cases as example watching TV is it halal or haram permitted or prohibited in Islam because TV was not available in that time 1400 ago so Muslims scholars can tell us whether halal or haram this means Ijtihad.
but this will not be incase the core of faith like concept of God. Should be clear in our Holy Quran, hope this clear to you…

perfect, that is because the quran is a doctrine book…the Bible is not…the authors did not have the intention to teach us doctrines but to witness to us about Jesus…had they in mind the intention of writing a Bible to future Christians, we’d have a much better explained Bible…but this did not happen coz there was no need to written scriptures since they were transmitted orally…what we have is their letters to their churches and friends…thats why we need to put what they preached into doctrines. you find many doctrines that have “new” names or titles that did not exist in the Bible but the ideas are in the Bible , not only the Trinity…

And regarding 3 Gods: its vague its like the concept of the egg.It is 3 in one the white, the yolk and the shell.3 into 1 right?
Is it this your concept of God what God you worship?!

there are many threads that explained trinity in the best clear way.

Who come to the earth and walking and getting circumcised and urined and rode the donkey. Please forgive me I am not trying to insult you nor Christians nor the beloved Prophet Jesus pbuh,

when you see this as insult , we see it as the most beautiful form of Love…yes we believe in Jesus who took a human body , who slept, who when to toilet, who wept, who laughed, who gave us the Ideal representation of an ideal human being…the humanity of Jesus does in no way demean his divinity…yes we believe in such a loving God…if you are a dad, and if you play with your children and enter their world of infancy, does it mean you are being insulted as an adult? on the contrary, it shows what a great father you are…Jesus as well experienced our world to reveal to us His world…He became human to make us godly…He experienced everything except “sin” coz he was a great, ideal, sinless human being and God who is Holy as well…

112.001
YUSUFALI: Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
PICKTHAL: Say: He is Allah, the One!
SHAKIR: Say: He, Allah, is One.

yes beautiful but not new neither to Jews nor Christians.

112.002
YUSUFALI: Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
PICKTHAL: Allah, the eternally Besought of all!
SHAKIR: Allah is He on Whom all depend.

same here.

112.003
YUSUFALI: He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
PICKTHAL: He begetteth not nor was begotten.
SHAKIR: He begets not, nor is He begotten.

here it is meant sexually which is wrong.

112.004
YUSUFALI: And there is none like unto Him.
PICKTHAL: And there is none comparable unto Him.
SHAKIR: And none is like Him.

agree but we know why…do you?

thx for the quotes, but what did mohammad teach that it new? not to insult, but mohammads’ moral teachings regressed…Jesus’ teachings AND life were much more superior…if God sent His ideal “prophet”, why should He regress and change His final standard and teachings? and why does He allow His teachings to be corrupt when He says in the Bible, as well as the quran, that He preserves His word? did you even know that the quran promised to keep the Bible?

after we finish the textual corruption point which is not proved so far, we’ll go on to discuss what mohammad said about the Bible at his time.

 

[George_Waters]

inJESUS:

when you see this as insult , we see it as the most beautiful form of Love…yes we believe in Jesus who took a human body , who slept, who when to toilet, who wept, who laughed, who gave us the Ideal representation of an ideal human being…the humanity of Jesus does in no way demean his divinity…yes we believe in such a loving God…if you are a dad, and if you play with your children and enter their world of infancy, does it mean you are being insulted as an adult? on the contrary, it shows what a great father you are…Jesus as well experienced our world to reveal to us His world…He became human to make us godly…He experienced everything except “sin” coz he was a great, ideal, sinless human being and God who is Holy as well…

Beautifully said inJesus! Beautifully said!!!

 

[inJESUS]

George Waters:

inJESUS:

Beautifully said inJesus! Beautifully said!!!

i said nothing new it is Jesus ,our Lord, who is the most wonderful and beautiful in the world

 

[George_Waters]

inJESUS:

George Waters:

i said nothing new it is Jesus ,our Lord, who is the most wonderful and beautiful in the world

You are a credit to our faith my friend!

 

[inJESUS]

George Waters:

inJESUS:

You are a credit to our faith my friend!

i appreciate your kind word George, thx Jesus deserves much more …we should all try our best to be what Jesus wants us to be…it is not very easy in this world of sin, but Jesus’ love and power make miracles in our lives…

In Jesus.