Bible corruption/islamic point of view

[LilyM]

gurrato alaien:

Oh, brother you believe in tha bible and what it say The Bible say God needs to Sleep. (Psalm 4:23)
do you think that almighty God do sleeps and take rest like man?!!!

"AWAKE, WHY DO YOU SLEEP, O LORD? Then the Lord AWAKED AS ONE OUT OF SLEEP, and like a mighty man that shouts by reason of wine. (Psalm 4:23)

“For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day He RESTED, and was REFRESHED” (Exo. 31:17)

Also Genesis says GOD created the world and rested on the seventh day:
Ge 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Ge 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

I think the point is that the all powerful GOD does not need to rest.It is only man who has these weaknesses and need to sleep. It is only when man is comparing GOD to man then he would beleive that GOD really rested.I mean can you really fathom GOD resting. Does that mean he rests every Saturday. This implies GOD does Sabbath.
If man really sits and thinks can he really see a god who rests or is it written there so it makes him have to believe it. I think if GOD was speaking in the First person saying I created the world and I rested then that might have a different meaning. But this is man wanting others to think GOD rested. I cannot see how I can call one who rested, slept, or even died, as a GOD.

This is another proof prove that tha bible has been corrupted.

Peace

Gurrato this is sad even for you. Your verses singularly fail to prove corruption of the Bible. The use of ‘rested’ in no way indicates that God was sleeping or anything similar- after all Noah’s ark ‘rested’ (finished its journey) on Mount Ararat and lawyers always ‘rest’ their cases when they’ve finished giving all their evidence. It’s simply a slightly unusual use of the word, and means that God ceased his work of creating the world on that day.

Maybe you find it difficult to believe in a God who has also taken on human form. Personally, judging by your previous post where you called normal human bodily functions ‘insulted’, I think you have problems seeing how much dignity and beauty human beings have. I come from a family of doctors, and the more I learn from them about our bodies the more I truly see that we are a fantastic creation truly made in the ‘image and likeness’ of God.

Perhaps you don’t think we’re worth God’s time or attention or something that our form is so hateful to him that he would refuse to take it? If humans are so awful or inferior then why did God bother communicating with us at all - through the Prophets or in any other way?

 

[gurrato_alaien]

LilyM:

Gurrato this is sad even for you. Your verses singularly fail to prove corruption of the Bible. The use of ‘rested’ in no way indicates that God was sleeping or anything similar- after all Noah’s ark ‘rested’ (finished its journey) on Mount Ararat and lawyers always ‘rest’ their cases when they’ve finished giving all their evidence. It’s simply a slightly unusual use of the word, and means that God ceased his work of creating the world on that day.

Maybe you find it difficult to believe in a God who has also taken on human form. Personally, judging by your previous post where you called normal human bodily functions ‘insulted’, I think you have problems seeing how much dignity and beauty human beings have. I come from a family of doctors, and the more I learn from them about our bodies the more I truly see that we are a fantastic creation truly made in the ‘image and likeness’ of God.

Perhaps you don’t think we’re worth God’s time or attention or something that our form is so hateful to him that he would refuse to take it? If humans are so awful or inferior then why did God bother communicating with us at all - through the Prophets or in any other way?

You just keep ignoring facts you and inJESUS even in your book, go and check sleep and rested and refreshed before you come and talk.

Peace.

 

[LtTony]

gurrato alaien: No, Christians don’t think God needed a nap. The verses you quoted are allegorical. In context, they contain fundamental truths, however. (i.e., God is THE creator). Add: They are not meant to be interpreted literally. Using the days of the week to describe the story of creation was likely an easy-to-understand manner used in oral tradtion before the story was written down on paper.

 

[LilyM]

gurrato alaien:

You just keep ignoring facts you and inJESUS even in your book, go and check sleep and rested and refreshed before you come and talk.

Peace.

Hey, you guys are the ones with four wives each - you can’t possibly know the meaning of the words ‘sleep’, ‘rested’ or ‘refreshed’ better than we do You clearly must never have been exposed to real literature or poetry for that matter.

Anyways, you just keep ignoring the facts that your ‘prophet’ was most likely just oversexed and bloodthirsty and that your ‘allah’ appears to be too stupid to properly understand and explain the very basics of the Christian concept of the Trinity. Not to mention that your ‘allah’ can only speak the fullness of his truth in Arabic? Who’s trying to fool who here?

 

[gurrato_alaien]

Here for the Hebrew. The word in transliteration is nuwach.
noo’-akh
Definition

1. to rest
   1. (Qal)
   1. to rest, settle down and remain
   2. to repose, have rest, be quiet

means rested and applies in this context

Ex 20:11

"For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.

So proof from the Hebrew bible that GOD of the Bible literally rested on the seventhday.

Another translation is here Transliterated Word: shabath.shaw-bath’

Definition

1. to cease, desist, rest
   1. (Qal)
   1. to cease
   2. to rest, desist (from labour)
   2. (Niphal) to cease

Ge 2:2 And by the seventh day God completed His work which He had done; and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. Ge 2:3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
So my point is proven, The GOD in the bible rested on the seventh day.He was tired and had to rest.Pevidence given.I rest my case.
peace

 

[gurrato_alaien]

I think you arguments are nonsensical since in the Bible it also claims that GOD (who is almighty and knows everything enterred paradise and Asked Adam where ho was.So this is not strange that they make him rest too. if he does not know wher Adam is then i am sure he needs a break.That is not GOD:
Ge 3:
9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

11 ¶ And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

So didn’t GOD know did he have to ask him if he had eaten from the tree?What Kind of a GOD is this.No wonder you people beleive he was a man cos it also says GOD walked in the Garden:

Ge 3:8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day:

I thought the bbile claims no one has seen GOD so how are we sure in the bible that he walks.Does he have legs and a butt and genitals too?
What blaspheme about GOD
No wonder you lot are confused , from the beginning you cannot figure out who is GOD
Peace

 

[LtTony]

al·le·go·ry (ăl**’**ĭ-gôr’ē, -gōr’ē)
n., pl. -ries.

1. 
   *]a.The representation of abstract ideas or principles by characters, figures, or events in narrative, dramatic, or pictorial form.
   

          b. A story, picture, or play employing such representation. John Bunyan's *Pilgrim's Progress* and Herman Melville's *Moby Dick* are allegories.

   1. A symbolic representation: The blindfolded figure with scales is an allegory of justice.

 

[LtTony]

g.a. : Again, the word “walks” is a figure of speech that even as children we understood (therefore, I find even having this conversation as unbelievably rudimentary even for a non-christian yet charming in a way). Regardless, what walking means is that at that time God dwelt with his children in the Garden.

 

[LilyM]

gurrato alaien:

I think you arguments are nonsensical since in the Bible it also claims that GOD (who is almighty and knows everything enterred paradise and Asked Adam where ho was.So this is not strange that they make him rest too. if he does not know wher Adam is then i am sure he needs a break.That is not GOD:
Ge 3:
9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

11 ¶ And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

So didn’t GOD know did he have to ask him if he had eaten from the tree?What Kind of a GOD is this.No wonder you people beleive he was a man cos it also says GOD walked in the Garden:

Ge 3:8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day:

I thought the bbile claims no one has seen GOD so how are we sure in the bible that he walks.Does he have legs and a butt and genitals too?
What blaspheme about GOD
No wonder you lot are confused , from the beginning you cannot figure out who is GOD
Peace

Of COURSE God knew exactly where Adam was, AND he knew he had eaten from the tree - he was allowing Adam the chance to come clean and admit what he had done. You don’t think God occasionally does things for our benefit - like, for example, talk to us through the prophets? He doesn’t have to do that for us, you know.

What about your ‘allah’ who is too stupid to chose a LITERATE person to reveal his infallible book to, resulting in 20 years gap where the Koran wasn’t written down and could have been corrupted any number of ways! AND your prophet who is too stupid to know the difference between SATAN’S words and God’s??? and actually mixes up some of Satan’s words with those that are meant to be in the Koran? It’s laughable.

 

[LtTony]

“from the beginning you cannot figure out who is GOD”

I could say the same about you.
Sad really. It would be like having a parent who never put an arm around you and said they loved you.

Take care.

 

[George_Waters]

Based on this forum it seems that while Muslims have no concrete documentary evidence that the Bible is corrupt some will keep insisting it is so and the only sources they can cite are works done hundreds if not thousands of years later with a blatant religious or political agenda. (It is amusing how any scholar, public or religious person becomes great if they agree with Islam regardless of how obscure they are or how self-serving their motivations.)

It also appears that most Muslim members of this forum seem to take everything concerning God literally as if God must operate according to our limited knowledge and understanding and preconceived notions. Except in cases where they can not readily explain it and then cry we must just trust God.

I had always believed Islam was far more learned on such matters, but the majority of posts on this forum have sadly led me to believe otherwise. Now that I am a father I have, in an infinitesimal way, an understanding of God’s love for His children. It is too bad that the Islam as portrayed here considers God distant and only concerned with a very small part of His glorious creation.

I have a lot of respect for many Muslim members of this forum, and I am happy they love their religion, but I think their religion does not do these good God fearing people justice.

God Bless you all.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

Whatever you see proofs infront of you will keep ignoring it and since you and inJESUS keep ignoring proofs whether from Quran or from the bible, I just want to inform you that Islam is the last religion and the prophet Muhammad is the last prophet. its impossible for the false prophet to live in hearts of billions of people and still growing up, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and after 50 to 100 years more than half of the world will become Muslims. You may will ignore this also, so the decision is yours
Islam only the salvation, Jesus will blame you in the day of judgment because you make him a God and then what you will tell him what you will answer Almighty Allah.

Making miracles is not enough to believe that person is God, and you believe that the anti Christ will come at the end of time. and he will do miracles more than Jesus then you would make him a God also!!!?

Just think brothers

Peace.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

George Waters:

Based on this forum it seems that while Muslims have no concrete documentary evidence that the Bible is corrupt some will keep insisting it is so and the only sources they can cite are works done hundreds if not thousands of years later with a blatant religious or political agenda. (It is amusing how any scholar, public or religious person becomes great if they agree with Islam regardless of how obscure they are or how self-serving their motivations.)

It also appears that most Muslim members of this forum seem to take everything concerning God literally as if God must operate according to our limited knowledge and understanding and preconceived notions. Except in cases where they can not readily explain it and then cry we must just trust God.

I had always believed Islam was far more learned on such matters, but the majority of posts on this forum have sadly led me to believe otherwise. Now that I am a father I have, in an infinitesimal way, an understanding of God’s love for His children. It is too bad that the Islam as portrayed here considers God distant and only concerned with a very small part of His glorious creation.

I have a lot of respect for many Muslim members of this forum, and I am happy they love their religion, but I think their religion does not do these good God fearing people justice.

God Bless you all.

Good but why you twist the facts just tell me who take everything concerning God literally as if God must operate according to our limited knowledge and understanding and preconceived notions.

And who considers God distant and only concerned with a very small part of His glorious creation.

Who make God take rest after he created the creation and slept and walked in the paradise and was searching Adam, Who portray God in limited understanding just tell me .

Sure Christians do this. You don’t esteem God as he is

Peace.

 

[gurrato_alaien]

No matter how much evidence we will give you. you will still go into denial mode. they will twist and turn until they are happy inside that they have interpreted the verse the way they want to even if proof is put in front of them. Even if the Bible scholars have given the explanation

Peace.

 

[LilyM]

gurrato alaien:

Whatever you see proofs infront of you will keep ignoring it and since you and inJESUS keep ignoring proofs whether from Quran or from the bible, I just want to inform you that Islam is the last religion and the prophet Muhammad is the last prophet. its impossible for the false prophet to live in hearts of billions of people and still growing up, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and after 50 to 100 years more than half of the world will become Muslims. You may will ignore this also, so the decision is yours
Islam only the salvation, Jesus will blame you in the day of judgment because you make him a God and then what you will tell him what you will answer Almighty Allah.

Making miracles is not enough to believe that person is God, and you believe that the anti Christ will come at the end of time. and he will do miracles more than Jesus then you would make him a God also!!!?

Just think brothers

Peace.

Gurrato, please, ‘it is impossible for a false prophet to live in the hearts of billions of people’? There are still just as many Christians out there as Muslims - so far so even. So far either my ‘false prophet’ or your ‘false prophet’ has billions of followers. So your very first assertion is wrong.

Your religion may be growing, it may be growing as fast as you say it is. It may be growing faster for all I know. So does cancer grow fast, doesn’t make it any more desirable or right. Numbers don’t prove a thing. If all the world except myself were Muslim it still wouldn’t prove the correctness of your religion, presumably you’d feel the same if the whole world except yourself was Muslim?

‘Islam only is the salvation’ huh? Even we Catholics are not so arrogant as to say only Catholics are saved. Do you really presume to know the mind of God in that way? Talk about cutting him down to your human size!

We Christians at least (unlike you clearly) believe that God extends His mercy to everyone who is sincerely seeking to come to Him, and that He takes into account the state of their knowledge at the time of their death. Otherwise no-one who lived before Jesus (in my case) or Mohammed (in yours) could possibly be saved. As a result I don’t really fear death or judgement.

I remain unconvinced by your best arguments in favour of Islam. In fact I lived for three years with a Muslim housemate who was certainly more knowledgeable about Christianity and seemingly just as knowledgeable about Islam as you, and was more convincing because of it. In spite of all of this I am still not convinced of the truth of Islam.

I am, however, convinced of the rightness of Christianity mainly because it seems to provide a better practical guide to living my life than Islam. And really that’s the main way in which we can judge any religion. Everything else is mere assertion and speculation.

As I have said, I’m not convinced of the ‘sublime morality’ or perfection of Islam, in spite of efforts from better scholars than yourself. Unless you have something radically different to bring to the discussion, I doubt I will ever be. I trust that God knows why this is the case, and He knows that it is not because I have deliberately blinkered my mind against Islam. And that’s where I’ll leave it, but I am open to any response you want to make.

 

[George_Waters]

gurrato alaien:

Whatever you see proofs infront of you will keep ignoring it and since you and inJESUS keep ignoring proofs whether from Quran or from the bible, I just want to inform you that Islam is the last religion and the prophet Muhammad is the last prophet. its impossible for the false prophet to live in hearts of billions of people and still growing up, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and after 50 to 100 years more than half of the world will become Muslims. You may will ignore this also, so the decision is yours
Islam only the salvation, Jesus will blame you in the day of judgment because you make him a God and then what you will tell him what you will answer Almighty Allah.

Making miracles is not enough to believe that person is God, and you believe that the anti Christ will come at the end of time. and he will do miracles more than Jesus then you would make him a God also!!!?

Just think brothers

Peace.

gurrato alaien,

I just asked for independent documentary evidence contemporary with the writing of the biblical books proving biblical corruption. It is not my fault that those claiming a source meeting this criterion exists than failed to provide that source. Why post on the thread if you know no such source exists? As far as proof in the Bible or the Quran we each have our own opinions.

We know Islam is not the last religion as hundreds have sprung up after Islam and many of them claim to have their own prophets. I believe that the religion of God is the last true religion, but once again we all have our own opinions don’t we? I also believe that John the Baptist was the last true prophet, a belief that is shared by over 33 million Christians.

Islam may be growing, but so is Christianity and there are still more than 13 million more Christians than Muslims in the world today. Maybe Islam will be half the population in 50 to 100 years, that is knowledge only God has, but based on current numbers Islam will have to more than double to get there and you and I both know that more numbers does not always equal the truth.

My view of God is that he will judge us compassionately and justly and that salvation is through His grace alone regardless of what particular faith you belong to. I believe that your best chance of salvation is to be a member of the Catholic church and to follow God’s law, but that is not your only chance of salvation as salvation is a gift from God. God knows what is in each of our hearts. Your view seems to be that if you are not a Muslim you will go to Hell, regardless of what is in your heart. Not very compassionate or loving is it?

I am sure some will make the anti-Christ God, just like many who have followed false prophets, but not true Catholics.

 

[George_Waters]

gurrato alaien:

Good but why you twist the facts just tell me who take everything concerning God literally as if God must operate according to our limited knowledge and understanding and preconceived notions.

And who considers God distant and only concerned with a very small part of His glorious creation.

Who make God take rest after he created the creation and slept and walked in the paradise and was searching Adam, Who portray God in limited understanding just tell me .

Sure Christians do this. You don’t esteem God as he is

Peace.

Why do I say it has been my observation that you take everything concerning God literally? Well, that is my opinion based on the posts made on this forum. Just look at the Muslim reaction to “Son of God”. How many times have we read that God does not sire children? Really, who is being literal? “Who make God take rest after he created the creation and slept and walked in the paradise and was searching Adam, Who portray God in limited understanding just tell me.” Thank you! You perfectly demonstrate my ascertain that many Muslims take things too literally! You are making assumptions based on your literal view.

As for who considers God distant; also my opinion and based on my observation that many Muslims do consider God distant and only concerned with Muslims and sending the rest of us to Hell.

We do esteem God as omnipresent and omnipotent and do not limit His nature. Do Muslim consider God omnipresent or do they limit Him? Do Muslims maintain that God can be three in one or do they say that is impossible and limit God?

 

[George_Waters]

gurrato alaien:

No matter how much evidence we will give you. you will still go into denial mode. they will twist and turn until they are happy inside that they have interpreted the verse the way they want to even if proof is put in front of them. Even if the Bible scholars have given the explanation

Peace.

gurrato alaien,

Don’t you think the exact same thing could be said about you? The real issue is that I do not agree with you.

 

[inJESUS]

gurrato alaien:

Oh, brother you believe in tha bible and what it say The Bible say God needs to Sleep. (Psalm 4:23)
do you think that almighty God do sleeps and take rest like man?!!!

"AWAKE, WHY DO YOU SLEEP, O LORD? Then the Lord AWAKED AS ONE OUT OF SLEEP, and like a mighty man that shouts by reason of wine. (Psalm 4:23)

“For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day He RESTED, and was REFRESHED” (Exo. 31:17)

Also Genesis says GOD created the world and rested on the seventh day:
Ge 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Ge 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

I think the point is that the all powerful GOD does not need to rest.It is only man who has these weaknesses and need to sleep. It is only when man is comparing GOD to man then he would beleive that GOD really rested.I mean can you really fathom GOD resting. Does that mean he rests every Saturday. This implies GOD does Sabbath.
If man really sits and thinks can he really see a god who rests or is it written there so it makes him have to believe it. I think if GOD was speaking in the First person saying I created the world and I rested then that might have a different meaning. But this is man wanting others to think GOD rested. I cannot see how I can call one who rested, slept, or even died, as a GOD.

This is another proof prove that tha bible has been corrupted.

Peace

sad. Didnt you know the Bible was written by HUMANS with HUMAN language pertaining to that time? if you don’t undesrtand the “way” it was written, it does NOT mean it is corrupt.

**Till, when he reached the setting-place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring, ** is this written by God?

Only the Face of your Lord of Might and Glory will remain." (ar-Rahman 55/27)
"Everything will perish save His Face." (al-Qasas 28/88)
"What kept you (Iblis) from falling prostrate before that which I have created with My Hands." (Sad 38/75)
**“Wait patiently for the Command of your Lord, [O Muhammad], for verily you are in Our Eyes.” (at-Tur 52/48)
:

“We carried him [Nuh] on an [ark] made of planks and nails; It floats under Our Eyes, as a reward for him who was rejected.” (al-Qamar 54/13-14)**
"The Beneficent One, Who is Settled on the Throne (al-Arsh)." and "Then He Mounted the Throne."
"He it is Who created the heavens and earth in six days; Then He Mounted the Throne."

You are arquing the word “rest” when your book says God “mounted” and God has “face” and “hands” and “eyes”? can we claim as well that the quran is corrupt coz it gives HUMAN attributes to God? no, we are not that hopeless.

You claimed the Bible is corrupt : the quran does NOT say this; so you changed your mind and said : the Bible was true but NOT the same one you have…i proved you wrong…you took a biblical verse out of context from Ahmad Abdalla’s site and i gave you a refutation…now you base it on “human” attributes given to God when your own book does exactly the same? sad, pretty SAD.

 

[inJESUS]

Whatever you see proofs infront of you will keep ignoring it and since you and inJESUS keep ignoring proofs whether from Quran or from the bible,

you did neither,neither the quran nor the Bible prove corruption…it’s the opposite, both say that God preserves His word.

Do you believe in a God that keeps His word or not?

I just want to inform you that Islam is the last religion and the prophet Muhammad is the last prophet

indeed, if God changed His morality then yes mohammad is a prophet.

. its impossible for the false prophet to live in hearts of billions of people and still growing up,

Buddha is…Ghulam Ahmad has 40 million believers…Hindu gods have billions…so???

Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, and after 50 to 100 years more than half of the world will become Muslims

aids is the fastes growing disease as well …dogs and cats and rabbits breed a lot as well…so??

You may will ignore this also, so the decision is yours
Islam only the salvation

you don’t even have a guaranty…mohammad himself said he doesnt know where he will end up in bukhari hadith,

Jesus will blame you in the day of judgment because you make him a God and then what you will tell him what you will answer Almighty Allah.

i will answer your allah : it is your fault you sent someone much greater and much sublime and with much higher standards than mohammad

Making miracles is not enough to believe that person is God,

so not making at all is a proof of what?

and you believe that the anti Christ will come at the end of time. and he will do miracles more than Jesus then you would make him a God also!!!?

no, we know many false teachers anti-Christs will do them as well…those who follow Jesus KNOW HIS VOICE.