Birth Control

[Jennifer_J]

Gosh, how did the human race survive without 5 bedroom houses?

No kidding. We have 6 kids and 3 bedrooms–4 girls in one room, 2 boys in the other. We would adjust accordingly if another baby joins us (and I don’t mean buying a new house!).

 

[lovemyboys]

NFP is just as “evil” as a condom. You are deliberately picking a time when you probably wont get pregnant, because you dont want to have another child. Its so evil to not want another child! (that is sarcasm) And with a condom, you “probably” wont get pregnant as well. Its still leaving the choice up to god right?

Look- Do you really think god is really this tyrant who wants you to feel no joy in life? I dont think a condom is going to stop gods will. He gave us brains and wants us to act responsibly. He also gave us human urges- which will not prompt us into hell just because we have a “thought” or something.

What a life you guys are living. Even when your married you cant use a condom? Really? Are you kidding me? And it is because this barrier is preventing a potential birth?

Here is a scenerio- A friend wants to set me up no a blind date- but i choose not to. By not meeting this woman- i am deliberatly denying a potential birth I guess aren’t I?

God doesn’t want us to micromanage every facet of life. If you really believe in him- then his will will surmount all of our futile attempts to control our lives.

Even leaving the theological aspects out of the argument (I’m sure you already know them)-- what married people would even want to use condoms? They’re really dreadful. Men hate them. Since all of the hormonal contraceptives (and IUDs) can potentially cause abortions, who would want to use those? Also, as an ex-pill user, I can tell you that those things can RUIN your life with depression and they take all of the fun out of sex for most women. Research the pill and sex drive and you’ll see what I mean… IUDs can also cause abortion (and ectopic pregnancies). I have nothing to say about diaphragms other than the thought of the them grosses me out.

NFP (in my case, the Marquette Method) is just so much better than all of the alternatives… If you learn NFP and can avoid all of those unnatural things, it’s healthier and happier for the couple.

 

[Scardinoz]

For the record, throwing out ABC has made our marriage so much more intimate. My wife really are able to come together completely in total surrender to each other and God’s pivotal role in our marriage.

 

[TLM08]

Gosh, how did the human race survive without 5 bedroom houses?

It galls me to see people with no plans to have children buying these 5 bedroom “McMansions”
two SUVs, and 60-70 hour work schedules. People like that aren’t who we are talking about here. They are too selfish to qualify as parents anyway.

But this guy you quoted has a family of four and a 2 bedroom house. Any more children and that house has to go. This isn’t the 1800’s when children were able to contribute financially to the upkeep of the family and population levels were still quite low.

Again, for the family raising numerous children on a limited income, non-abortive birth control measures are not forbidden by scripture therefore is reasonable conduct for a christian.

 

[wanner47]

Again, for the family raising numerous children on a limited income, non-abortive birth control measures are not forbidden by scripture therefore is reasonable conduct for a christian.

The Church that Christ established and gave authority to teach disagrees with you. I’d rather follow Christ’s teachings than your teachings, personally.

Besides, I could see a family of 4+ managing in a two-bedroom home. Bunk beds ate a marvelous invention.

 

[Jennifer_J]

It galls me to see people with no plans to have children buying these 5 bedroom “McMansions”
two SUVs, and 60-70 hour work schedules. People like that aren’t who we are talking about here. They are too selfish to qualify as parents anyway.

But this guy you quoted has a family of four and a 2 bedroom house. Any more children and that house has to go. This isn’t the 1800’s when children were able to contribute financially to the upkeep of the family and population levels were still quite low.

Again, for the family raising numerous children on a limited income, non-abortive birth control measures are not forbidden by scripture therefore is reasonable conduct for a christian.

I (and anyone speaking of Church teaching) must be on your ignore list, because you don’t read and respond to anything posted regarding authentic Church teaching. You just keep spouting off your own personal (mis)interpretation. House size has probably never been a limiting factor through the centuries for limiting family size. People somehow managed. Now, today, we feel like each child should have their own bedroom or something. Ridiculous.

 

[ryecroft]

I (and anyone speaking of Church teaching) must be on your ignore list, because you don’t read and respond to anything posted regarding authentic Church teaching. You just keep spouting off your own personal (mis)interpretation. House size has probably never been a limiting factor through the centuries for limiting family size. People somehow managed. Now, today, we feel like each child should have their own bedroom or something. Ridiculous.

Hi - I am a Catholic, but I do take exception to what you say. It almost seems as though you think that as a Catholic (and correct me if I’m wrong), we should allow ourselves to have as many children as are possible and if we have to shove 4 in a room well, then oh well. As a Catholic AND as a responsible citizen and hopefully soon to be parent, I know that I would rather have only a couple of children and give them every possible advantage in life. No that doesn’t mean that each will have to have a seperate room - but it does mean that I won’t want any of them to go without things they need and even things they might want. I have no intention of giving them every single thing they look at, but at the same time I don’t want them to be ridiculed at school because their clothes have holes or for any other reason like that. Life is hard enough - I have no desire for it to be harder for them. I do believe that being able to provide well for your children should be a reason to space them. I had a brother and sister each 10 and 11 years older - so I was basically like an only child most of my life- I was not a planned pregnancy but a “mistake” - a “mistake” my parents were happy about - am I embarassed about that? No, not one bit - I figure, if God wanted me here, then come condom or pill, He was going to make sure my mom got pregnant. Never once did I wish I had another brother or sister around my age. I’m glad my parents were able to provide for me the way they did and they way they still help me- I’m also glad that in their retirement that they were able to have saved up enough money to provide themselves with a very comfortable residence. I hope and pray that at their age my husband and I will be able to do the same. Also, I am glad that the pill came along - otherwise, I probably would have had to had a hysterectomy early on because of the excessive bleeding that occurs from my body - the pill keeps that in check and also has allowed for the possibility of when things get better with my health (as it has now) we’ll be able to try again for another pregnancy. The pill doesn’t just help prevent pregnancy, it helps women with a host of other medical problems - no one really ever seems to mention that.

God Bless
Rye AKA Annie

 

[ryecroft]

I have no dog in this fight, because I am age 60, never married, and still perpetually single. Parenthood will not come my way.

Without any direct experience of marriage, it is not my place to judge those in the state of wedlock. Other people’s reproductive choices are not my business.

Because children are so vitally important, parenthood requires an absolute devotion to the tasks of raising a family. If married people do not have this commitment, I would not urge them to conceive. If a couple is not married, they ought marry before starting a family.

All the artifacts of human life are artificial, from toilet paper to microchips. Calling birth control artificial is a red herring. The more important issue is how couples and families can surmount the challenges of modern life, and remain faithful to their consciences and values.

Children are a gift and a wonder. No doubt about that. But perhaps there can be too much of a good thing.

This fellow, who is Catholic, I believe speaks with quite a bit of wisdom. I agree that children should be brought into the world and have an active father and mother in their lives. That being said, it doesn’t seem that the push for “abstinance” isn’t really succeeding - people are still having sex outside of marriage and I don’t think this trend is going to cease -
Just some food for thought

 

[Jennifer_J]

Hi - I am a Catholic, but I do take exception to what you say. It almost seems as though you think that as a Catholic (and correct me if I’m wrong), we should allow ourselves to have as many children as are possible and if we have to shove 4 in a room well, then oh well. As a Catholic AND as a responsible citizen and hopefully soon to be parent, I know that I would rather have only a couple of children and give them every possible advantage in life. No that doesn’t mean that each will have to have a seperate room - but it does mean that I won’t want any of them to go without things they need and even things they might want. I have no intention of giving them every single thing they look at, but at the same time I don’t want them to be ridiculed at school because their clothes have holes or for any other reason like that. Life is hard enough - I have no desire for it to be harder for them. I do believe that being able to provide well for your children should be a reason to space them. I had a brother and sister each 10 and 11 years older - so I was basically like an only child most of my life- I was not a planned pregnancy but a “mistake” - a “mistake” my parents were happy about - am I embarassed about that? No, not one bit - I figure, if God wanted me here, then come condom or pill, He was going to make sure my mom got pregnant. Never once did I wish I had another brother or sister around my age. I’m glad my parents were able to provide for me the way they did and they way they still help me- I’m also glad that in their retirement that they were able to have saved up enough money to provide themselves with a very comfortable residence. I hope and pray that at their age my husband and I will be able to do the same. Also, I am glad that the pill came along - otherwise, I probably would have had to had a hysterectomy early on because of the excessive bleeding that occurs from my body - the pill keeps that in check and also has allowed for the possibility of when things get better with my health (as it has now) we’ll be able to try again for another pregnancy. The pill doesn’t just help prevent pregnancy, it helps women with a host of other medical problems - no one really ever seems to mention that.

God Bless
Rye AKA Annie

You’ve made a lot of assumptions about what I said (am I an irresponsible citizen for having 6 children?). I never said that a couple should have all the children physically possible. What I said or meant to imply, is that our reasons for avoiding need to be just or grave or serious (depends on your translation). The number of bedrooms is, for most families, not really all that grave. I think we Catholics,today, in this country, are too soft. We expect things to be easy–no suffering for me, no hardships for me. Check out how other Catholics lived in the past and how they live in other countries. We have it E.A.S.Y., yet we complain about everything and insist that the Church must change, because we sure won’t.

For what it’s worth my 4 girls aren’t “shoved” into their bedroom. They live there quite comfortably with each other (bunk beds are GREAT!). We also provide quite well for our 6 children and I’m a stay at home mom so we aren’t rolling in dough. We do without a lot of new things. We use hand me downs. We borrow things from people. We fix things ourselves to avoid excess costs. We reduce, reuse and recycle. We may have an SUV, but I transport 8 people in it making it more fuel effecient per person than most cars. My children have never been made fun of for whatever perceived issues you can come up with. We have 3 children in Catholic school. We manage quite well.

You and I are different, my (non catholic) parents had my sister and then me 8 years later and then divorced. I WAS lonely. I always wanted more siblings. Siblings are the best gift to give your child and a lack of bedroom space is not the most serious reason to avoid more children (yes, at some point it might become an issue, I’m talking about most middle income families here in modest dwellings). I know many a Catholic family in the past managed in close quarters. However, I DO think that there ARE serious/just/grave reasons to avoid and a couple must discern this via prayer and spiritual advisement if they are having difficulty discerning. But neither do I think that NFP is the default position in marriage.

Additionally, the pill doesn’t really “cure” anything (Endometriosis is the only thing that comes to mind). It doesn’t “regulate” your cycles. It mimics the chemicals of pregnancy and then removes the chemicals for a false “bleed”. Your symptoms were treated, but the underlying cause of your heavy bleeding wasn’t. I was on the pill before we converted and the things made me sick–horribly sick all the time. It was such a relief when we converted and I learned about NFP. Also, all the use of pharma gets into our water, with no way to filter it all out (no, not just the pill, other meds, too) and it affects the fish and frogs and such. I in no way think that the pill is a good thing for most women, for our environment and for our Church. (And yes, I know that the current “church” thought on the pill is that if a medical condition exists that requires the pill then it is okay to use, I happen to think many [no, not all] women use this as a convenient excuse to use contraception. This is a great temptation in my mind.). I’m blessed to have a doctor who won’t prescribe such things and will find the root cause of problems, if at all possible.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I have no dog in this fight, because I am age 60, never married, and still perpetually single. Parenthood will not come my way.

Without any direct experience of marriage, it is not my place to judge those in the state of wedlock. Other people’s reproductive choices are not my business.

Because children are so vitally important, parenthood requires an absolute devotion to the tasks of raising a family. If married people do not have this commitment, I would not urge them to conceive. If a couple is not married, they ought marry before starting a family.

All the artifacts of human life are artificial, from toilet paper to microchips. Calling birth control artificial is a red herring. The more important issue is how couples and families can surmount the challenges of modern life, and remain faithful to their consciences and values.

Children are a gift and a wonder. No doubt about that. But perhaps there can be too much of a good thing.

The bible actually calls children a BLESSING. Would God give us too many BLESSINGS?

The Church is against contraceptives. She is not against controlling births (via abstinence). It has nothing to do with contraceptives being artificial–it has to do with misusing the act of sex.

 

[ryecroft]

The bible actually calls children a BLESSING. Would God give us too many BLESSINGS?

The Church is against contraceptives. She is not against controlling births (via abstinence). It has nothing to do with contraceptives being artificial–it has to do with misusing the act of sex.

Hmmm - you do bring up a good comment - would God Provide too many - just as it’s argued that through technology some people don’t have as many as they “comfortably could” (and yes I agree, your version of comfortably is extremely different from mine - I was thrilled I had “nanasan” (my nanny) - when I was younger, and I really have a hard time imagining having more than one child without having at the very lahave no doubt my kids will enjoy having a nanny as well) - but I also think that through technology, some are having too many - (and I am in no way bashing IVF or any orther way of getting pregnant, I think that for those that have trouble getting pregnant it’s a life saver) - look at the woman that just had the octuplets - or lets take another family (one that didn’t use something controversial like IVF) -lets say the TV touting Duggars. I think they have had too many kids - without that TV show (and there are plenty others who don’t have those shows who apprently seem to want to have as many kids as is humanly possible) - I literally got sick to my stomach when I heard them say on TV -(the parents) that at 6 months of a age the newest child is moved out of the crib next to the parents and sent to a room (whichever gender) - (personally, I believe this has to do with trying to add yet another)-
At this point they said that one of the older kids becomes that childs “buddy” - in other words becomes the “responsible” person who cares for the youngers needs. No child should have to endure playing parent like that because the parents don’t have enough “hands” to handle all the needs of the kids. I’m not saying that kids should not have to help out around the house but being responsible - slmost parent like for another is not a childs Job or purpose.

I am in no way trying to infer that this is anything like you -you and I are obviously very different people - you seemed to have longed to have siblings close to your age- I was extremely content to be on my own with my own friends. You mentioned that you have four girls in one room (and I am not criticizing, just asking) - if one of the girls came to you and said she felt she needed more privacy, that she didn’t feel she really had any time to herself, what would you do? (In no way am I inferring that you had too many - it takes all types of people to make up the world and all types of Catholics to make up the faith - as the word Catholic means - Universal-) I’m really happy for you that you’ve been able to give your kids what you felt was important for them to have - and I understand that you didn’t want them to feel the lonliness that you felt as a child. As I said, I never felt that - I even remember my mom asking me if I wanted a brother or sister and saying “NO”. I saw many large families at the Catholic Schools in the states that I went to - some with 9 or 10 kids - rarely ever did I see anything showing that they were a happy, cohesive, familial unit - I saw kids fighting with each other and was told multiple times by some of these kids that were my friends “you sure are lucky you don’t have any brothers or sisters” - I know some of it was just talk - but I also knew some of it was very serious. Of course I didn’t really grow up in the states- most of my childhood was spent in Japan, where people having more than 2 children was something I never saw. So like I said, we are completely different creatures. And I truely do wish you all the happiness in the world for you and your family!

 

[lovemyboys]

I think that the number of children a couple has is a matter of listening to God’s calling. I have SOOO much respect for all of those who are called to have more than the usual 2. We are going to be outnumbered by Muslims in this world in the near future-- I say more power to all the Christians who want to have a “quiverfull!!” Qudafi (sp?) recently made a comment on the Muslim birthrate versus the Christian birthrate, saying (with regard to Muslims taking over the world) something like “we don’t need terrorists; we just need time.” Scary…

 

[Priscilla_Ann]

The bible actually calls children a BLESSING. Would God give us too many BLESSINGS?

The Church is against contraceptives. She is not against controlling births (via abstinence). It has nothing to do with contraceptives being artificial–it has to do with misusing the act of sex.

 

[Priscilla_Ann]

The bible actually calls children a BLESSING. Would God give us too many BLESSINGS?

The Church is against contraceptives. She is not against controlling births (via abstinence). It has nothing to do with contraceptives being artificial–it has to do with misusing the act of sex.

Responsible, reliable birth control is not misusing the act of sex, nor is it a sin. It is a moral responsibility. Get over it!

 

[kage_ar]

To say that a family makes you sick because they have too many children, I’m gobsmacked.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Responsible, reliable birth control is not misusing the act of sex, nor is it a sin. It is a moral responsibility. Get over it!

Get over what, exactly? Trying to live according to the Catholic Faith as best we can? We are not permitted to contracept, what should I get over?

 

[Jennifer_J]

Hmmm - you do bring up a good comment - would God Provide too many - just as it’s argued that through technology some people don’t have as many as they “comfortably could” (and yes I agree, your version of comfortably is extremely different from mine - I was thrilled I had “nanasan” (my nanny) - when I was younger, and I really have a hard time imagining having more than one child without having at the very la[have no doubt my kids will enjoy having a nanny as well) - but I also think that through technology, some are having too many - (and I am in no way bashing IVF or any orther way of getting pregnant, I think that for those that have trouble getting pregnant it’s a life saver) - look at the woman that just had the octuplets - or lets take another family (one that didn’t use something controversial like IVF) -lets say the TV touting Duggars. I think they have had too many kids - without that TV show (and there are plenty others who don’t have those shows who apprently seem to want to have as many kids as is humanly possible) - I literally got sick to my stomach when I heard them say on TV -(the parents) that at 6 months of a age the newest child is moved out of the crib next to the parents and sent to a room (whichever gender) - (personally, I believe this has to do with trying to add yet another)-
At this point they said that one of the older kids becomes that childs “buddy” - in other words becomes the “responsible” person who cares for the youngers needs. No child should have to endure playing parent like that because the parents don’t have enough “hands” to handle all the needs of the kids. I’m not saying that kids should not have to help out around the house but being responsible - slmost parent like for another is not a childs Job or purpose. I am in no way trying to infer that this is anything like you -you and I are obviously very different people - you seemed to have longed to have siblings close to your age- I was extremely content to be on my own with my own friends. You mentioned that you have four girls in one room (and I am not criticizing, just asking) - if one of the girls came to you and said she felt she needed more privacy, that she didn’t feel she really had any time to herself, what would you do? (In no way am I inferring that you had too many - it takes all types of people to make up the world and all types of Catholics to make up the faith - as the word Catholic means - Universal-) I’m really happy for you that you’ve been able to give your kids what you felt was important for them to have - and I understand that you didn’t want them to feel the lonliness that you felt as a child. As I said, I never felt that - I even remember my mom asking me if I wanted a brother or sister and saying “NO”. I saw many large families at the Catholic Schools in the states that I went to - some with 9 or 10 kids - rarely ever did I see anything showing that they were a happy, cohesive, familial unit - I saw kids fighting with each other and was told multiple times by some of these kids that were my friends “you sure are lucky you don’t have any brothers or sisters” - I know some of it was just talk - but I also knew some of it was very serious. Of course I didn’t really grow up in the states- most of my childhood was spent in Japan, where people having more than 2 children was something I never saw. So like I said, we are completely different creatures. And I truely do wish you all the happiness in the world for you and your family!

The problem is, those who use IVF AREN’T following God’s law, they are abusing the gift and blessing of children. However, the children are still blessings. I’m leaving the octuplets out of this as that family dynamic is very dysfunctional. As for the Duggar comment, while I have problems with some of the discipline ideas they have, MORE POWER TO THEM. They are debt free (and I think would be debt free even without the tv show). They do not have too many children. There is nothing wrong with children helping out with family life–be that watching children, doing chores or what have you–they are learning valuable life skills. This is what life is like in families and has been for centuries (even in Japan!!). I also find it distubing that you don’t want to offend those who use IVF, but have no issue basing and judging as unfit those couples who naturally have a large family. This tells me you have a less than good grasp on authentic church teaching regarding marriage and family. The immorality of IVF is not the number of children, it’s divorcing reproduction from the sex act.

We have a large family regardless of how I felt as a child. In fact, when we were first married we had it all “planned” out—2 children and maybe foster/adopt. Then we converted and learned the beauty and meaning of being married Catholics. NFP opened our hearts to more children. Each of their blessed little lives opened our hearts to a new brother or sister. The experience of the marital embrace totally changed for us.

The dynamics of a large family is not that of a small family. There is naturally some fighting, argueing, rough housing, laughing, sharing in joys and sorrows, supporting, etc and at a louder decible than a small family. Both large and small families can be dysfunctional or functional–it has nothing to do with family size and everything to do with parenting and personalities. If one of my daughters came to me with a need for privacy, I’d ask her what she wanted to do with privacy. Was it a need for quiet, for being alone, for thinking, for doing homework, to get into trouble? And then we’d solve the problem, though I doubt it would be with her own room.
[/quote]

 

[Jennifer_J]

Responsible, reliable birth control is not misusing the act of sex, nor is it a sin. It is a moral responsibility. Get over it!

No, the only moral way to limit children is via total or periodic abstinence. Contraception is immoral and it separates the procreative and unitive meaning of the marital embrace. I have nothing to get over at all because this is authentic Church teaching on the matter. Thanks for your contribution to this thread.

 

[ryecroft]

converted and learned the beauty and meaning of being married Catholics. NFP opened our hearts to more children. Each of their blessed little lives opened our hearts to a new brother or sister. The experience of the marital embrace totally changed for us.

The dynamics of a large family is not that of a small family. There is naturally some fighting, argueing, rough housing, laughing, sharing in joys and sorrows, supporting, etc and at a louder decible than a small family. Both large and small families can be dysfunctional or functional–it has nothing to do with family size and everything to do with parenting and personalities. If one of my daughters came to me with a need for privacy, I’d ask her what she wanted to do with privacy. Was it a need for quiet, for being alone, for thinking, for doing homework, to get into trouble? And then we’d solve the problem, though I doubt it would be with her own room.

Actually, I have an excellent concept of “authentic” Church teaching - as I am finishing my masters in ecclesiastical history and have also been studying to work with the DRE - and the people at this parish are well acquainted with my views. Honestly, I don’t think you understood what I meant when I mentioned that the kids “help out with the Duggar family”
When one “buddies” up with another sibling- that child isn’t just helping out with a couple of chores or the occaisional diaper change - that older child become the Responsible party for the younger child - in other words acts as a fill in mom for that child - carrying the child around, changing diapers or taking to the toilet, bathing, feeding etc. etc. - all the thing a mother should be doing, not a child. While I have no qualms with a nanny doing this, no child should be saddled with having to constantly change diapers, feed and take care of another child- I can’t imagine my parents ever having the audacity to expect something like that from me -persoanlly if my parents had ever tried something like that, chances are I would have resented them and very possibly the child I had been stuck with caring for. In my opinion, those kids are sheltered from the real world and basically convinced that this is what is “normal” in todays society.

As far as Japan goes- when you’ve been brought up in that society, let me know, until then, don’t even try to comprehend the social dynamics of a society with which you are not familiar. Having been brought up in that society, I can tell you that it is an EXTREME rarity for there to be more than 2-3 children per family and has been for years (actually the average number of children is 1.35 kids). Birth control is a norm for a very high percentage of the society and I hate to tell some people on here that think that birth control is causing much of the divorce rate, but if you take Japan as an example, the divorce rate is only 13% - (granted this is the high estimate) -The main reason Japanese say they don’t have more children is because they don’t feel they can provide well enough for more children. Granted, 100 years ago it was different as female infanticide was not uncommon. Mortgages in Japan are often passed down from father to son or even father to daughter (if there is no son) - if I currently lived in Japan and had 6 children as you do, I can garuntee you that I would be looked if not down upon than looked at if I had a problem being responsible (I am not saying that you are I’m just saying that this would be a large possibility if you were in Japan) -

As far as birth control goes, I have had to use it for medical reasons - and I must say that there was no difference in our marriage as far as closeness in the “marital embrace” goes when we use the birth control and when we went against our Doctor’s advice and tried NFP for quite sometime. (And we stuck to the method religiously and still got pregnant - twice and I became extremely ill both times - almost bled out to the point of death once) So clearly, NFP doesn’t work for every couple (just like the pill doesn’t work for every couple either) - Granted, there are some people on here that it works wonderfully for, and more power to them. I’m thrilled it worked for you and you felt you got more out of your marriage - I’m sorry the pill made you ill. It (NFP) isn’t something that is an option for us. I don’t feel used or under appreciated or like an object because we have to use birth control and I certainly don’t feel like my husband doesn’t “appreciate” my fertility or understand it. There is no form of birth control that is a “one size fits all” model.

I noticed that when you answered the question regarding privacy with one of your girls you said you’d ask them some questions - but you got down to wondering if she wanted privacy in order to possibly get into trouble. I’m not going to say anything else about that -

As far as IVF goes, it’s easy to say with 6 kids that you don’t agree with it - but I know plenty of Catholics who didn’t believe in it until they were unable to conceive on their own. Now they literally thank God they were able to have a child that way.

I’m not trying to be down on you or anything - I think it’s great that you’ve gotten what you decided you wanted as a family. But personally, that wouldn’t work for us - I’m glad that my kids won’t have to worry about sharing a room, having hand me downs, not being one of the only families who isn’t vacationing in whatever the neat place that year to vacation is or other things like that. And if it means having less children to be able to do that then my husband and I are o.k. with that. There are positives to be said about having children both ways - each way gives each child something different - perhaps with yours they would learn more patience or how to share better - perhaps with mine, I’ll be able to take each to Japan or Europe each summer and they’ll always have the most up to date devices to work with. It doesn’t have to be one way or the other each way has positive and negative parts.

As far as the comment about the muslims and what Quadafi said about not needing terrorists but needing more time (implying that eventually there would be so many more muslims that their “job” would be easier) - personally, that does scare me, but it doesn’ t make me want to go out and have as many children as possible.

Thanks for sharing your opinion -

God Bless-
Rye

 

[ryecroft]

I (and anyone speaking of Church teaching) must be on your ignore list, because you don’t read and respond to anything posted regarding authentic Church teaching. You just keep spouting off your own personal (mis)interpretation. House size has probably never been a limiting factor through the centuries for limiting family size. People somehow managed. Now, today, we feel like each child should have their own bedroom or something. Ridiculous.

Personally, my husband and I, (as did our parents) want to do better than to just manage.