Birthrates Help Keep Filipinos in Poverty

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AgnosTheist said:
the secular government is an effective authority on morality.
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slavery used to be the law of the land here in the united states, and that aint moral. if what you wrote were true, there would be no need for civil disobedience yet it happens all the time. just last week protestors in manhattan disrupted traffic to stage a “pray in” in order to protest the sean bell verdict. what could possibly have motivated them to make that statement if what you wrote is true?
& how does that definition disqualify the skeptic from making a moral judgement?
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i’m running out of different ways to say this, but here goes: because for people who don’t believe in god, or who don’t think he is involved in what goes on here on earth, there is no moral authority to appeal to when something morally objectionable is happening. there is no independent standard of morality against which to measure the behavior of people (including governments which are after all just made up of people) here on earth.

all that is left when god is banished from earth is the moral authority of men. and what authority is that, given that we are all only human beings? the slaveowner has every bit of moral authority as the abolitionist by virtue of their both being humans.
 
ralphinal said:
But, not having them will not increase what people make or what kind of job they have.
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I agree. But without hungry mouths to feed for the low earning couple, there would be no suffering. Less crime for trying to make ends meet.
 
tomarin said:
“slavery used to be the law of the land here in the united states, and that aint moral.”

“all that is left when god is banished from earth is the moral authority of men.”
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slavery was the law of the land in biblical times. how can something immoral be a part of your religious heritage? thats because your religion is but a product of a one sided human opinion. thats why its inferior to secularism. for secularism takes the opinion of everyone into consideration. in this way secularism is better than religion in promoting humanity’s gene-encoded social nature.
 
AgnosTheist said:
slavery was the law of the land in biblical times. how can something immoral be a part of your religious heritage? thats because your religion is but a product of a one sided human opinion. thats why its inferior to secularism. for secularism takes the opinion of everyone into consideration. in this way secularism is better than religion in promoting humanity’s gene-encoded social nature.
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I wish this wasn’t so long…it is definitely a great candidate for my next “Quote of the Month” signature.
 
Sterilization and contraception will always be the rich man’s solution to eliminating poverty. Once those methods don’t work the next call is for legalized abortions. When that doesn’t work you’ll see things like forced 1 child laws.

Basically, the rich man wants to eliminate poor people, not poverty.

When some one is hungry teach him to farm, don’t hand him a condom.🤷
 
iamrefreshed said:
Sterilization and contraception will always be the rich man’s solution to eliminating poverty. Once those methods don’t work the next call is for legalized abortions. When that doesn’t work you’ll see things like forced 1 child laws.
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…and the next step after that is apparently to encourage people to have more children, like they are doing in places where the populations are dropping.
 
rlg94086 said:
…and the next step after that is apparently to encourage people to have more children, like they are doing in places where the populations are dropping.
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I’m not aware of places like that. Do you have an example?
 
AgnosTheist said:
slavery was the law of the land in biblical times. how can something immoral be a part of your religious heritage? thats because your religion is but a product of a one sided human opinion. thats why its inferior to secularism. for secularism takes the opinion of everyone into consideration. in this way secularism is better than religion in promoting humanity’s gene-encoded social nature.
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agnostheist,

yes, slavery existed in the ancient world. in fact it pre-existed christianity in greece and rome. the fact that the world christianity was born into condoned slavery doesn’t mean that christianity is false. in fact if a christian master owned slaves he would be compelled to treat them better, since christianity teaches that we are all made in god’s image so i would say that slaves had it better once christianity arrived on the scene and made an impact on hellenistic society.

i guess you still don’t see the link between theism and morality. you are still attacking christianity as immoral even as you also want to question god, the only credible author of an absolute moral code. the two positions are not tenable at the same time. if you are right then not only christianity but everything, including secularism, is “one sided human opinion”. so one ideology can’t be more moral or true than another because there is no absolute standard of truth to measure it against.
 
iamrefreshed said:
I’m not aware of places like that. Do you have an example?
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I don’t have links handy, but they are certainly encouraging people to have more kids in some European countries and in Japan.

It will be interesting to see what happens in China as their population is aging, since they instituted their one-child policy. There will still be a lot of people there, but they may go upside down financially when it comes to the workforce and the elderly.
 
rlg94086 said:
I don’t have links handy, but they are certainly encouraging people to have more kids in some European countries and in Japan.

It will be interesting to see what happens in China as their population is aging, since they instituted their one-child policy. There will still be a lot of people there, but they may go upside down financially when it comes to the workforce and the elderly.
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Agreed on the European countries and birthrates but I don’t put them in the same category as the poor nations. Europeans brought on their own low birthrates due to their own selfishness and secular life.

Seems to me that rich nations are the ones wanting to control poor nations populations.

Why is that?
 
iamrefreshed said:
Agreed on the European countries and birthrates but I don’t put them in the same category as the poor nations. Europeans brought on their own low birthrates due to their own selfishness and secular life.

Seems to me that rich nations are the ones wanting to control poor nations populations.

Why is that?
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Well, obviously it is because they measure a successful life on how much wealth you have. To them secular selfishness is the way to go. They look at the correlation between birth rates and wealth and come to the false conclusion that a low birth rate leads to wealth. In reality, as you point out, that is not how it happened in the West. The low birth rates came **after **economic success.
 
iamrefreshed said:
When some one is hungry teach him to farm, don’t hand him a condom.🤷
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I say give them both (1) a means to a good livelihood, and an (2) effective means to postpone kids until they earn enough income to support a larger family.
 
AgnosTheist said:
I say give them both (1) a means to a good livelihood, and an (2) effective means to postpone kids until they earn enough income to support a larger family.
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If you really want to help those people, maybe you could stop buying clothes that say "Made in "
 
tomarin said:
you are still attacking christianity as immoral even as you also want to question god,
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i dont hold to that opinion. for me its a lot more moral than immoral. 🙂
tomarin said:
i guess you still don’t see the link between theism and morality.
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theism promotes a bunchload of really good moralities. but it failed to tackle such important issues as slavery, racism, & sex discrimination. now it is also failing on the issue of overpopulation.
tomarin said:
god, the only credible author of an absolute moral code.
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i honestly want to hear his opinion. until then, we are on our own.
 
AgnosTheist said:
Joseph & Mary’s lives have changed even though they had many children.
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Stop adding to scripture. It’s not there.
And its reasonable for married lovers to make love. Right? 🙂
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Today, it seems only non-married lovers do that. You have epoxied those 21st century glasses to your head and just can’t take them off! I think that playing a part in establishing God’s eternal Covenant with man is a little more important than submitting to primal urges.
 
po18guy said:
I think that playing a part in establishing God’s eternal Covenant with man is a little more important than submitting to primal urges.
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The bible God’s eternal Covenant does not contradict the bible God’s commandment to go forth and multiply. There is nothing biblically wrong with Joseph & Mary making love. :love: :blushing:
 
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