Bisexuality / Homosexuality and Radical Feminism - Connection ?

[Stephen168]

. According to your line of argument, non-one can have a valid point if they write from their own experience, because there are lots and lots of other experiences. Now you are even intimating about the veracity or otherwise of what he wrote. Good way to stifle debate and denigrate anothers point of view. That’s disingenuous.

I’ve seen this argument before. For example; I claim men are taller than women and then to personalize it, say how I’m taller than all the girls in my high school class. Then someone who wants to believe that men and women are the same height tells me that it is only my experience. They are assuming that my experience is not consistent with the broader truth. They may even find an exception to show me how wrong I am, not realizing my Mother is taller than most men therefore I’m aware of exceptions but the rule and my personal story stand as fact.
In this case, the military is an example of what happens in the society. She wants to believe that society is different than it is, so the military is just my experience. I’m sure I could list many examples but she would just say they are my experience. She doesn’t have the experience to understand, yet. I have a daughter-in-law like that. I’m sure she will understand someday.

 

[Stephen168]

I did actually Stephen but you convineantly left that part out when you quoted me in your post. Why did you leave the first bolded part out of that paragraph I wonder?

Men don’t receive special “man bonuses”, they are on the SAME pay scale as women but AVERAGE higher pay…why would that be?

 

[LemonAndLime]

Men don’t receive special “man bonuses”, they are on the SAME pay scale as women but AVERAGE higher pay…why would that be?

I am not going to answer your question until you answer mine in giant letters in bold at the end of my post, which I asked long before you have been asking me this.

 

[Peepers]

I apologize to the group, if I have been ranting about Dr. Nicolosi. As an aspiring medical professional, my training has emphasized doing no harm to the patient above all else. I am not qualified to judge his competence. I leave it to anyone following the thread to decide if the American Psychological Association is qualified to judge the competence if its practitioners, and I have posted what they have to say about him. The American Psychiatric Association is also on record as finding his therapeutic methods harmful to the health of his patients. That is my last word on that topic, as Elvis and I as simply going around in a circle.

 

[Peepers]

Men don’t receive special “man bonuses”, they are on the SAME pay scale as women but AVERAGE higher pay…why would that be?

I have heard that the largest number of job losses in this economy have been male workers, proportional to the workplace ratios of male to female. Also, the ratio of women graduates to men at the collegiate and professional level favors women. The average starting wage of women entering the work force is not higher than men entering the work force. Somewhere, I heard that this is true even with equivalent qualifications, but I cannot back that up with a citation. Another issue at the executive level is that women are more likely to interrupt their career for child rearing and birth. I have seen figures that women on average are paid more than men for actual seniority, which opens a whole other topic. In Sweden, men are legally required to take a certain amount of time off from work to care for newborns kids, in order to equalize the load on the mother, and also the findings are that the relationship between father and child is improved. In practice, men are taking the minimum required while women are more likely to take the maximum.

 

[Stephen168]

I apologize to the group, if I have been ranting about Dr. Nicolosi. As an aspiring medical professional, my training has emphasized doing no harm to the patient above all else. I am not qualified to judge his competence. I leave it to anyone following the thread to decide if the American Psychological Association is qualified to judge the competence if its practitioners, and I have posted what they have to say about him. The American Psychiatric Association is also on record as finding his therapeutic methods harmful to the health of his patients. That is my last word on that topic, as Elvis and I as simply going around in a circle.

I see your conversation with Elvis this way. I am left-handed. If the American Psychiatric Association had always considered left-handedness a problem that had to be fixed then changed its mind, this would not change everyone’s mind about left-handedness. There might still be psychiatrists who would think curing people of left-handedness would be worthwhile. And there might be one that seems to be able to do this with some regularity.
I would like the idea that the APA thinks I’m OK. The APA and I would not like psychiatrists ‘fixing’ what we think is not broken. But it would not change the fact that someone is helping lefties becoming right handing.

 

[Peepers]

I see your conversation with Elvis this way. I am left-handed. If the American Psychiatric Association had always considered left-handedness a problem that had to be fixed then changed its mind, this would not change everyone’s mind about left-handedness. There might still be psychiatrists who would think curing people of left-handedness would be worthwhile. And there might be one that seems to be able to do this with some regularity.
I would like the idea that the APA thinks I’m OK. The APA and I would not like psychiatrists ‘fixing’ what we think is not broken. But it would not change the fact that someone is helping lefties becoming right handing.

I over-reacted out of concern that he was being held out as a competent therapist. My concern was that people would read that and believe it. I have said my peace, people can come to their own conclusions. I have not heard him speak. He is reputed to be charming and persuasive about his methods. Supposedly he puts on a little show with his “cured” patients, but there are an equally large number who revert back, and also those who can talk about the harm that he has done them. In medical practice, if a treatment actually harms a statistically significant sample of patients, then it is not generally used, if there is another alternative. The current trends are every more toward evidence based medicine and risk analysis of treatment modalities.

 

[elvisman]

Elvis. Thanks for the unsolicited advice. Next time you feel inclined, please keep it to yourself.

There are many clinical psychologists in the world. Dr. Nicolosi chose to be licensed in a way which did not even require him to complete even one clinical hour of practice. It is a matter of public record. Dr. Nicolosi is specifically named by the American Psychological Association as being a practitioner who harms his patients. This is a nearly unprecedented act for an organization as prestigious as the APA.

If the moderators would like to ban me for pointing that out. That is fine. Your adoration of Dr. Nicolosi is astounding considering his apparent incompetence. It is actually difficult to achieve his level of notoriety.

You ask me to answer to Dr. Nicolosi’s claims of success. I have answered you directly with the citing of the proclamations of the APA which specifically warns against the danger of his practices.

What more do you want? The APA is more reputable, more learned, more qualified, and more authoritative on the topic than you or me or Dr. Nicolosi himself.

You accuse me of lying. Look in the mirror as you type your next adoring comment about Nicolosi. You have failed to answer my question, why do you adore him so, when the evidence as to his incompetence is so overwhelming. While I have answered you directly, you have avoided my question.

I already addressed this immature and false accusation about the “adoration” of Dr. Nicolosi.
As for his “incompetence” – the disagreement of his methods by the APA doesn’t make him “incompetent”, but merely alternative.

You forget - the APA isn’t the final authority on everything, just as the FDA isn’t the final authority on drug therapies. Every country has their own ways of dealing with physical as well as psychological and emotional problems. Many druds that are available in Europe are banned here. Why? Because of differences of opinion.

I asked YOU what YOU think about Dr. Nicolosi’s and Joe Dallas’s (and others) success rate – NOT what the APA has to say about it.
What do YOU think and why? I think the fact that you have claimed to be homosexual back in post #43 has clouded your views and has instead caused you to become irate and angry.

Radical feminism might not be the reason for your sexual proclivities, but it may indeed be for others. I think Dr. Nicolosi and Joe Dallas have proven this to be the case.

 

[Stephen168]

I am not going to answer your question until you answer mine in giant letters in bold at the end of my post, which I asked long before you have been asking me this.

My answer relies on you understanding this “mystery;” which I think you could, but haven’t. It also relies on you having the feelings of a mother, which you are not. Because you fail in both prerequisites, I understand why you misunderstood my post, and why I think there is a slim chance you ever will understand it.

 

[elvisman]

I over-reacted out of concern that he was being held out as a competent therapist. My concern was that people would read that and believe it. I have said my peace, people can come to their own conclusions. I have not heard him speak. He is reputed to be charming and persuasive about his methods. Supposedly he puts on a little show with his “cured” patients, but there are an equally large number who revert back, and also those who can talk about the harm that he has done them. In medical practice, if a treatment actually harms a statistically significant sample of patients, then it is not generally used, if there is another alternative. The current trends are every more toward evidence based medicine and risk analysis of treatment modalities.

There’s only one problem with that explanation:
**There is NO proof that most homosexuals are born with this proclivity.
**
Research study after research study had not conclusively determined that there is a cause or “gay gene” that renders most people helpless to this proclivity. Until there IS such a conclusive proof - alternative therapies can and must be welcomed.

 

[elvisman]

I see your conversation with Elvis this way. I am left-handed. If the American Psychiatric Association had always considered left-handedness a problem that had to be fixed then changed its mind, this would not change everyone’s mind about left-handedness. There might still be psychiatrists who would think curing people of left-handedness would be worthwhile. And there might be one that seems to be able to do this with some regularity.
I would like the idea that the APA thinks I’m OK. The APA and I would not like psychiatrists ‘fixing’ what we think is not broken. But it would not change the fact that someone is helping lefties becoming right handing.

There’s only one problem with that explanation:
There is NO proof that most homosexuals are born with this proclivity.

Research study after research study had not conclusively determined that there is a cause or “gay gene” that renders most people helpless to this proclivity. Until there IS such a conclusive proof - alternative therapies can and must be welcomed.

 

[Peepers]

There’s only one problem with that explanation:
There is NO proof that most homosexuals are born with this proclivity.

Research study after research study had not conclusively determined that there is a cause or “gay gene” that renders most people helpless to this proclivity. Until there IS such a conclusive proof - alternative therapies can and must be welcomed.

Elvis - Let’s just agree that we disagree about Dr. Nicolesi. It is clear that you and I will not resolve anything there. Perhaps you can answer a less contentious question for me. You make a lot of claims about human sexuality. What is your professional and educational background on the topic? Don’t take this the wrong way, it is not intended as an aspersion, but are you gay? Or have you been gay, and are now straight? You would have a lot more cred with me if you can point to some professional qualifications, or if you have direct experience in the topics which you are holding yourself out to be an expert on.

 

[LemonAndLime]

My answer relies on you understanding this “mystery;” which I think you could, but haven’t. It also relies on you having the feelings of a mother, which you are not. Because you fail in both prerequisites, I understand why you misunderstood my post, and why I think there is a slim chance you ever will understand it.

From this I must assume you are too intellectually/emotionally immature to be able to understand my posts and what I have repeatedly asked you.

I fail to see how I must be older and a parent to be able to read English and have the intellectual capacity to respond to you in a way that would be pleasing to you or the point you are trying to make.

I see that I cannot have a mature and intellectual conversation with you, so I shall no longer respond to you until you answer this simple question -

WHAT DID YOU MEAN BY SAYING THAT HOMOSEXUAL WOMEN ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO COMPLAIN ABOUT UNEQUAL PAY?

 

[Stephen168]

I fail to see how I must be older and a parent to be able to read English and have the intellectual capacity to respond to you in a way that would be pleasing to you or the point you are trying to make.

I didn’t say that. I said:

My answer relies on you understanding this “mystery;” which I think you could, but haven’t. It also relies on you having the feelings of a mother, which you are not. Because you fail in both prerequisites, I understand why you misunderstood my post, and why I think there is a slim chance you ever will understand it.

You have to complete grade one before you can enter grade two.

 

[elvisman]

Elvis - Let’s just agree that we disagree about Dr. Nicolesi. It is clear that you and I will not resolve anything there. Perhaps you can answer a less contentious question for me. You make a lot of claims about human sexuality. What is your professional and educational background on the topic? Don’t take this the wrong way, it is not intended as an aspersion, but are you gay? Or have you been gay, and are now straight? You would have a lot more cred with me if you can point to some professional qualifications, or if you have direct experience in the topics which you are holding yourself out to be an expert on.

No, I am not a homosexual nor have I ever been. I am a husband (for 20 years) and father of 1. I do have a problem with the hijacking of the word, “gay” to describe homosexuality, especially because the many, many homosexuals I have known over the years are anything but happy (gay). This is not a generalization of all homosexuals – just a personal observation due to the fact that there are MANY homosexuals in my industry (publishing).**

As for my professional qualifications – I never claimed to have any psychological or sociological credentials on the subject, nor have I claimed to be an expert (another false accusation on your part). I have stated over and over on this thread that I am merely parroting the professional opinions of a couple of therapists who have had great success.

You have refused to offer any sort of answer to my question – a question that I have asked you and others: What do YOU think about their successes.

You want to agree to disagree? That’s fine with me – however, by refusing to respond to questions, we can hardly have a charitable dialogue.

 

[LemonAndLime]

I didn’t say that. I said:
You have to complete grade one before you can enter grade two.

Still waiting for a reply to my question.

 

[Stephen168]

There’s only one problem with that explanation:
There is NO proof that most homosexuals are born with this proclivity.

There is no left-handed gene either, so there is no problem with my analogy.

Until there IS such a conclusive proof - alternative therapies can and must be welcomed.

I agree. That was my point. Just because I would not like it, others do and have been successful at it. To call it “harm” or the practitioner incompetent is just on opinion of those who disagree.

 

[Stephen168]

I have heard that the largest number of job losses in this economy have been male workers, proportional to the workplace ratios of male to female. Also, the ratio of women graduates to men at the collegiate and professional level favors women. The average starting wage of women entering the work force is not higher than men entering the work force. Somewhere, I heard that this is true even with equivalent qualifications, but I cannot back that up with a citation. Another issue at the executive level is that women are more likely to interrupt their career for child rearing and birth. I have seen figures that women on average are paid more than men for actual seniority, which opens a whole other topic. In Sweden, men are legally required to take a certain amount of time off from work to care for newborns kids, in order to equalize the load on the mother, and also the findings are that the relationship between father and child is improved.** In practice, men are taking the minimum required while women are more likely to take the maximum**.

I agree with many of these random facts, but I was wondering what your conclusion meant.

 

[elvisman]

There is no left-handed gene either, so there is no problem with my analogy.
I agree. That was my point. Just because I would not like it, others do and have been successful at it. To call it “harm” or the practitioner incompetent is just on opinion of those who disagree.

After reading your original post - I saw where you were going but it was too late to delete my response.

 

[Peepers]

No, I am not a homosexual nor have I ever been. I am a husband (for 20 years) and father of 1. I do have a problem with the hijacking of the word, “gay” to describe homosexuality, especially because the many, many homosexuals I have known over the years are anything but happy (gay). This is not a generalization of* all* homosexuals – just a personal observation due to the fact that there are MANY homosexuals in my industry (publishing).

**As for my professional qualifications – I never **claimed to have any psychological or sociological credentials on the subject, nor have I claimed to be an expert (another false accusation on your part). I have stated over and over on this thread that I am merely parroting the professional opinions of a couple of therapists who have had great success.

You have refused to offer any sort of answer to my question – a question that I have asked you and others: What do YOU think about their successes.

You want to agree to disagree? That’s fine with me – however, by refusing to respond to questions, we can hardly have a charitable dialogue.

For the third of fourth or fifth time… and this is the last time. I am not qualified to judge the treatment modalities employed by Dr. Nicolosi. The American Psychological Association, and the American Psychiatric Association - the two largest and most prestigious organizations in the world, and the authorities which set the medical standards for treating psychological problems - have both taken the unprecedented steps of specifically naming Dr. Nicolosi as a practitioner of harmful techniques.

Now will you please give it a rest. I have made my opinion clear. You tell us that you “parrot” opinions which you lack the expertise to understand. Fine. It is time to stop being a parrot. Let go of it.