Bishops remain focused on 'responsible restrictions' on gun ownership

[Ender]

Guns are ending up in the hands of people without morals, or mental deficiencies. Gun controls can be a moral judgement, to prevent guns being so accessible and more lives being lost.

The debate is not between those who want to keep guns away from people who shouldn’t have them and those who don’t care. The debate is about defining laws that find the best balance between protecting the public from those who shouldn’t own guns without infringing on the right of the vast majority of the public to own them. And that is not a moral judgment.

It’s the same as Catholics challenging Roe vs. Wade. We seek legislation, because of our moral choices.

It is not at all the same. Obtaining an abortion is an intrinsic evil. Obtaining a gun is not.

Ender

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

The debate is not between those who want to keep guns away from people who shouldn’t have them and those who don’t care. The debate is about defining laws that find the best balance between protecting the public from those who shouldn’t own guns without infringing on the right of the vast majority of the public to own them. And that is not a moral judgment.
It is not at all the same. Obtaining an abortion is an intrinsic evil. Obtaining a gun is not.

Ender

I believe what these shooters have done, including the one that spurred the Call to Action from our Bishops, committed an intrinsic evil with the guns they used. Or, if you prefer, an abortion clinic is not an intrinsic evil. It’s the application…

We work to overturn Roe vs. Wade, we should support the guidance from the Bishop to seek safer gun laws to prevent the same atrocities.

 

[Geist]

Why would anyone want to go to Juarez at all, armed or unarmed? Or to some of the gang neighborhoods in Chicago, for that matter? Is travelling and seeing the world that important to everyone?

Plenty of people live in those cities, legally forcing them to be defenseless is OK with you?

If I may ask where do you live? You exhibit the privilege of not needing to sleep with a loaded gun handy, many are not so fortunate, and your eagerness to throw them under the bus is disheartening.

 

[Swiss_Guy]

I guess you have a point. If we’re not sure where the ‘err’ is, its better to follow the Bishops.

With that said, Im buying two AK’s next week.

Er, you’re not?

 

[Ender]

We work to overturn Roe vs. Wade, we should support the guidance from the Bishop to seek safer gun laws to prevent the same atrocities.

Why do you believe the bishops know anything about the effects various different gun control laws will have? Those are not moral issues and they are not issues about which one would expect the bishops to have any expertise. The point is that they don’t know what “safer gun laws” are. The simple answer is “ban guns”, but that doesn’t appear to work quite like people expect so the right answer appears to be something else. We would all like safer communities the problem is that there is a great deal of disagreement on how to achieve them.

It should also be pointed out that the bishops have not called for a ban on the private ownership of guns nor even a ban on hand guns or assault rifles. They have in fact made no specific recommendations at all. They have implied certain things but they have been very careful not to say that Church doctrine requires any particular position.

Ender

 

[TEPO]

Er, you’re not?

Yes, after I get what I want, then I’ll support all the bans in the world.

…I know they’ve gotten pretty pricy here in the last few weeks, I hope I can find some.

 

[ProVobis]

Yes, after I get what I want, then I’ll support all the bans in the world.

…**I know they’ve gotten pretty pricy here **in the last few weeks, I hope I can find some.

That’s one way of limiting sales. If they become cost prohibitive, who needs laws?

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Why do you believe the bishops know anything about the effects various different gun control laws will have? Those are not moral issues and they are not issues about which one would expect the bishops to have any expertise. The point is that they don’t know what “safer gun laws” are. The simple answer is “ban guns”, but that doesn’t appear to work quite like people expect so the right answer appears to be something else. We would all like safer communities the problem is that there is a great deal of disagreement on how to achieve them.

It should also be pointed out that the bishops have not called for a ban on the private ownership of guns nor even a ban on hand guns or assault rifles. They have in fact made no specific recommendations at all. They have implied certain things but they have been very careful not to say that Church doctrine requires any particular position.

Ender

Common sense. The stricter regulations are, the harder it should be for bad guys to get their hands on weapons.

Tell me how controls are going to affect a law abiding citizen from being able to hunt, or protect themselves and their families?

Requiring stricter gun registrations, and documentation of private transfers, for accountability purposes.

Require secure gun storage, for when weapons are not being used, and apply stiffer penalties for proven violations.

Require mental health disclosures for everyone in a residence.

Smaller magazines.

 

[doormouse73]

there is a lot to be said about being free isnt there.

there is a quote ive heard that says…

liberty,what crimes you have committed in your name…

 

[TEPO]

there is a lot to be said about being free isnt there.

there is a quote ive heard that says…

liberty,what crimes you have committed in your name…

I’ve never heard that before. Is it from the Communist Manifesto?

 

[pnewton]

Requiring stricter gun registrations, and documentation of private transfers, for accountability purposes.

This is my big one. There simply is no down side I can see for the responsible gun owner. With privilege comes responsibility. I will go one step further and say I would like to see any gun owner that recklessly provides a gun used in a commission of a crime to be charged as an accomplice.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

This is my big one. There simply is no down side I can see for the responsible gun owner. With privilege comes responsibility. I will go one step further and say I would like to see any gun owner that recklessly provides a gun used in a commission of a crime to be charged as an accomplice.

I agree. You’ve articulated what I meant with ‘accountability’ purposes.

 

[pnewton]

A bishop, like anyone else, can err. T… The worse thing he can do is to confuse his own opinions with those of the Church. If he does not have a strong confessor, he will do this.

I seriously doubt you have any insight into the spiritual life of a bishop. I find this connection bizarre to sat the least. Funny how people want to distance their opinions from sin, but yet connect a bishop’s opinion to confession? Well, I don’t understand.

 

[pnewton]

The more we talk about it, the more I believe that too. I believe we’re delving into FIRST COMMANDMENT issues, forget the Second Amendment rights.

Hmm. Considering the lengths people go to to distance themselves from the Church on some issues, I believe there may be validity to this on some level. If the Catholic Church decreed it a matter of faith that we were to abandon our guns, would we do so, or would we switch to some other religion? Obviously this is hypothetical and is not going to happen.

 

[doormouse73]

I’ve never heard that before. Is it from the Communist Manifesto?

lololol…and you really think that communism is not pushing in the states? that was for i ironic post.

nanny state,socialism,break up of family… really the communist agenda is all over the place really if you would care to look…

 

[Geist]

Common sense. The stricter regulations are, the harder it should be for bad guys to get their hands on weapons.

Tell me how controls are going to affect a law abiding citizen from being able to hunt, or protect themselves and their families?

Requiring stricter gun registrations, and documentation of private transfers, for accountability purposes.

Require secure gun storage, for when weapons are not being used, and apply stiffer penalties for proven violations.

Require mental health disclosures for everyone in a residence.

Smaller magazines.

Chicago has gone further than you and banned all guns entirely yet has the highest rates of gun violence in the US, why?

Also all of your little ideas heavily infringe on my property rights.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Chicago has gone further than you and banned all guns entirely yet has the highest rates of gun violence in the US, why?

Also all of your little ideas heavily infringe on my property rights.

Are your rights placed above the possible risks to others?

Address the questions, and please explain the inconvenience to your ‘rights’.

 

[Geist]

Are your rights placed above the possible risks to others?

Address the questions, and please explain the inconvenience to your ‘rights’.

If I wish to leave five of MY pistols on MY dining room table, it is my right to do so. If I do not wish to purchase a safe I will not do so. If I wish to own a gun with a magazine that holds 1200 rounds and takes up half of one of my living rooms I will do so.

I will not sacrifice my rights for a “possible”.

BTW placing all your guns in one safe makes it one stop shopping for thieves. Its smarter to hide them about the house.

At the end of the day my possessions in my house are my domain. Not yours.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

If I wish to leave five of MY pistols on MY dining room table, it is my right to do so. If I do not wish to purchase a safe I will not do so. If I wish to own a gun with a magazine that holds 1200 rounds and takes up half of one of my living rooms I will do so.

I will not sacrifice my rights for a “possible”.

BTW placing all your guns in one safe makes it one stop shopping for thieves. Its smarter to hide them about the house.

At the end of the day my possessions in my house are my domain. Not yours.

You overlooked other suggestions, please respond to each.

BTW, the country’s welfare, specifically public safety, is more than your domain.

 

[Geist]

You overlooked other suggestions, please respond to each.

BTW, the country’s welfare, specifically public safety, is more than your domain.

I was not aware society was in my home. I may need more square footage.

Tell you what, you totally ignored my question, why, despite a total ban on guns does the city of Chicago have the highest rate of gun violence in the US?

You respond to that, I’ll give you more of my time.