Bishops rip HHS mandate That Forces Coverage of Birth Control, Abortion Drugs

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The poll done on the HHS mandate by Public Policy Polling that polled Catholics and I think non Catholics was sponsored by Planned Parenthood - therefore credibility is gone!

Number 2 poll was released by Public Polling Institute which found a slim majority of Catholics supported the mandate, this is the same polling company that indicated Romney was going to win big in Colorado Republican Caucus. Instead, Rick Santorum won the Rocky Mountain State.

NPR Cites Mandate Poll, Ignores Planned Parenthood Sponsored
 
Rence said:
I don’t see parishes not qualifying for the exemption. They usually only hire Catholics and they serve specifically Catholics, unlike hospitals and schools that really serve all.
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No they don’t. They usually state they PREFER Catholics but I see the postings for our Archdiocese and they never say one must be Catholic…unless it’s a position that requires one to be a Catholic.

Also have you ever heard of a parish that checked ID at the door? We welcome all, regardless of faith…or no faith. Further most parishes have some sort of outreach such as a food pantry, shelter, assistance for the poor. They do not require the recipients of such services be Catholic.

Lisa
 
iloveangels said:
Because sometimes they serve populations that aren’t Catholic. And not all Catholic school teachers are Catholic. All Catholic school students aren’t Catholic either. I used to work in a Catholic school and I know this first hand.

The church secretary couldn’t even answer a question on the phone from a non-Catholic.

Our outreaches to the community would cease. Catholic Family Services and all of that.
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Yes I know about schools. There’s a difference between the teacher who might be Methodist and could use these benefits and the parish office secretary who’s Catholic.
 
CMatt25 said:
Rence, are you basically saying Catholic employees like yourself who are already covered now with these benefits don’t have a choice of what is in their benefit pkgs? So it would be no different for Catholic employers as it is for Catholic employees now?
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Of course it will be different - that is why there is so much outrage, there are ways currently a religious employer can avoid contraceptive mandate, but what the HHS wants is for it to be compulsory for contraception, sterilization and abortificants to be in health insurance that employers must provide.
 
Rence said:
I don’t see parishes not qualifying for the exemption. They usually only hire Catholics and they serve specifically Catholics, unlike hospitals and schools that really serve all.
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I don’t see it either. That was probably part of the compromise and the reason for the exemption. But then I don’t necessarily prescribe to the theory that big, bad Obama is out to getcha.
 
CMatt25 said:
Yes I know about schools. There’s a difference between the teacher who might be Methodist and could use these benefits and the parish office secretary who’s Catholic.
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It won’t work that way. The Church will not pay for those benefits for anyone. It can’t.
 
Teresara said:
Catholic Charities, Catholic Hospitals, and Catholic Colleges accept Federal and State Funding. Operating such institutions while taking government money means accepting at least some regulation on how that money is used.

That being said, it still leaves me with the basic premise of the First Amendment. It’s gets tossed around like a volleyball when needed however, in this case I believe this is the kind of thing our forefathers intended to address. But one can’t have it both ways – you accept govt funding and you have to accept some of their influence.

Am I missing something here? This seems fairly straightforward, my personal feelings about the issue’s aside.
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I live on a military base. The chapel, the supplies for mass, the priest’s salary all come directly from the government. Does that give the govt. the right to tell priest he has to marry gay couples, report illegal activities heard in confession, modify any Church teaching?
 
CMatt25 said:
I don’t see it either. That was probably part of the compromise and the reason for the exemption. But then I don’t necessarily prescribe to the theory that big, bad Obama is out to getcha.
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How much proof do you need? There is such a thing as a person for whom no proof is enough because they won’t accept it. This is what happened in the Third Reich. Some people wouldn’t accept any amount of proof until it came around to their own houses in the middle of the night.
 
JReducation said:
The big question is deeper. It’s really about how far can citizens allow government to go before you have wiped out all semblance of morality and rights.

At what point do citizens say to governments, “That is immoral; therefore, we will not comply until you fix it.”
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A clever politician, like Obama, will advance tyranny one benefit at a time. As Rence and Matt are nicely demonstrating for us, most Catholics are not directly affected by this new policy and, thus, are more than happy to sit on their hands. (I don’t know if they are operating from Democrat talking points but they might as well be.)

So today it will be the bishops and a few Catholic institutions that are forced to choose between abandoning their conscience or their current activities. To paraphrase Stalin, how many lobbyists do the bishops have?
 
_Abyssinia said:
Of course it will be different - that is why there is so much outrage, there are ways currently a religious employer can avoid contraceptive mandate, but what the HHS wants is for it to be compulsory for contraception, sterilization and abortificants to be in health insurance that employers must provide.
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But a Catholic employee can already now have benefit pkgs, all of which can have ABCs included. And the employee pays co pays, deductibles on the policy.
 
CMatt25 said:
But a Catholic employee can already now have benefit pkgs, all of which can have ABCs included. And the employee pays co pays, deductibles on the policy.
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If you work for a private company or the federal government, yes. BUT NOT IF YOU WORK FOR THE CHURCH.

This means Catholic hospitals, schools, parishes, diocesan offices, parishes, religious orders, social service agencies, food banks, soup kitchens, adoption agencies, etc etc etc.

All of these will have to drop insurance coverage and pay a fine for every single person they employ.

Perhaps some of them will just have to stop operating…

NOW do you understand?
 
CMatt25 said:
But a Catholic employee can already now have benefit pkgs, all of which can have ABCs included. And the employee pays co pays, deductibles on the policy.
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I don’t think if you work for Catholic institutions.
 
iloveangels said:
If you work for a private company or the federal government, yes. BUT NOT IF YOU WORK FOR THE CHURCH.

This means Catholic hospitals, schools, parishes, diocesan offices, religious orders, social service agencies, food banks, adoption agencies, etc etc etc.

All of these will have to drop insurance coverage and pay a fine for every single person they employ.

Perhaps some of them will just have to stop operating…

NOW do you understand?
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I think the whole idea is for example to assure coverage for people who work in Catholic hospitals for instance and Catholics don’t have to use the coverage if they don’t want. Catholics are already paying was my point and I think Rence’s.
 
_Abyssinia said:
I don’t think if you work for Catholic institutions.
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If you work for the diocese, yes.

If you work for an organization that only has a Catholic name but is really run by a lay board, that’s up to the lay board. There are some organizations out there like this. They aren’t part of the church.
 
CMatt25 said:
I think the whole idea is to assure coverage for non Catholics who work in Catholic hospitals for instance and Catholics don’t have to use the coverage. Catholics are already paying was my point.
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No CMatt25. Catholics are NOT already paying. The Catholic Church does not pay for these benefits for its employees at the present time.

This has nothing to do with wanting to give people benefits. This is about forcing the bishops to provide benefits that are against Catholic teaching. This is about power and force.
If you work for a private company or the federal government, yes. BUT NOT IF YOU WORK FOR THE CHURCH.

This means Catholic hospitals, schools, parishes, diocesan offices, parishes, religious orders, social service agencies, food banks, soup kitchens, adoption agencies, etc etc etc.

All of these will have to drop insurance coverage and pay a fine for every single person they employ.

Perhaps some of them will just have to stop operating…

NOW do you understand?
 
The point is forcing Catholic institutions to violate Catholic morals by paying for immoral things.

Individual Catholics can buy contraceptives if they want; the Church is not following them around. Unlike HHS, the Church does force Catholics in this way.

The point is that the HHS is now going to force Catholic institutions to do something that violates their conscience, their principles, and Catholic morality. If HHS can force Catholic institutions to do this, there is nothing to prevent it from mandating abortion coverage.

The administration gives Catholic institutions a choice: cease to be Catholic, or go out of business.
 
JimG said:
The point is forcing Catholic institutions to violate Catholic morals by paying for immoral things.

Individual Catholics can buy contraceptives if they want; the Church is not following them around. Unlike HHS, the Church does force Catholics in this way.

The point is that the HHS is now going to force Catholic institutions to do something that violates their conscience, their principles, and Catholic morality. If HHS can force Catholic institutions to do this, there is nothing to prevent it from mandating abortion coverage.

The administration gives Catholic institutions a choice: cease to be Catholic, or go out of business.
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Correct. And if we buckle on this one, what will be the next demand??

And how could we stand up to the next one, if they threw this one in our faces if we buckled???
 
iloveangels said:
No CMatt25.

This has nothing to do with wanting to give people benefits. This is about forcing the bishops to provide benefits that are against Catholic teaching. This is about power and force.
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I disagree with your opinion that it’s not about benefits. But here’s what I don’t quite get. If Catholic employees already pay for these benefits to be included through co pays and deductibles on the insurance coverage they get through their private or govt employers, besides the fact that you just don’t like the mandate, how is that all that much different than a Catholic employer having to pay towards such a policy? Catholics are already paying. So you would require the Catholic employee who has such insurance now through their private or govt employer, not to pay towards their health coverage, drop it, and go without health care?
 
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