Bob Jones anyone?

[Nanor]

I stand corrected, Kevan, But I do think he has some degree which is ratified by BJU, I remember hearing this in a TV documenatary about him, and I presumed that he attended

can any one confirm??

Being Catholic & from Dublin, Ireland - I don’t think the Big Man would tell me if I phoned him up to ask!!

But, I alway associate Paisley-With being totally anti-Catholic, and BJU likewise.

 

[Kevan]

You’re right. I’d overlooked the honorary doctorate he received from BJU while in prison. He’d been engaged in some public protest against ecumenism, got arrested for some minor civil disobedience, and refused to post bond. The president of BJU got the Board together and said “Let’s give him a doctorate,” since he was fighting the same battles as they.

Many Fundamentalists have disapproved publicly of Paisley’s more inelegant vituperations, such as when he referred to the IRA as “murdering scum and papist rats.” But then, it’s hard to remain calm when your friends are being slaughtered week by week.

Paisley has a long track record of being eminently congenial and fair when dealing with Catholics in government or in private. The fierceness comes forth when he fights in defense of orthodoxy as opposed to liberalism, or Protestantism against Catholicism. And I can say from personal knowledge, his motivation is not selfish, but he’s concerned for the eternal salvation of those who would be led astray by something other than the true gospel. :bible1:

 

[whitake]

I live about 15 miles from the BJU campus. I live in Pickens county, in Easley, which is a bedroom community for Greenville and Clemson. The local population is probably 90% various varieties of Baptists. BJU is generally well regarded by the local Baptists.

I’m a parishioner of St. Mary’s in Greenville, and a convert. (I was received into the Church in '81, in North Carolina.) I refuse to set foot on the BJU campus, largely due to their extremely inflammatory and hate-filled website. (This is bju.edu: the real hate is not on the main page, but the “library” section is full of it.)

My county is part of the Wesleyan (Calvinistic Methodist) homeground.My family was Methodist Episcopal Church, South: that church was incorporated into the United Methodist Church some decades back, but most of my family has left the UMC since then.

Elizabeth
graduate student at Clemson

 

[Little_Mary]

Elizabeth,

I would like to see an example of the ‘hate’ materials that BJU has. I went to the link you provided but could not get past the library catalog. Mack Libraray, right? Can you tell me how to access some articles, etc?

Thanks

 

[S.to_P]

Here is one, and it should get you to all of the others.

Also worth mentioning, the BJU Home Page used to state that Catholicism was a cult, and put it in the same category as Mormonism. Once the '00 election hoopla took place, it came down.

bju.edu/resources/faith/1976/issue1/catholic.html

 

[Little_Mary]

S. to P.:

Here is one, and it should get you to all of the others.

Also worth mentioning, the BJU Home Page used to state that Catholicism was a cult, and put it in the same category as Mormonism. Once the '00 election hoopla took place, it came down.

bju.edu/resources/faith/1976/issue1/catholic.html

Thanks so much. That helps a lot.

 

[TAquinas]

I remember I visited the BJU Bookstore in the mid 80’s. I remember seeing a number of examples of anti-Catholic literature there.

 

[MGEISING]

My niece graduate from a small christian academy this past June and Bob Jones actually came (it was their 40th celebration). There were only 10 graduates. I was impressed by that - but that’s about all … he speach wasn’t anything to write home about!

 

[Little_Mary]

OK - I am currently in an e mail correspondence with a graduate student at BJU who insists that the school is not anti-Catholic.

I sent him an anti-Catholic article by Ian Paisley that I found on the BJU website (with help - thanks)! He defended the article but still insisted he was not anti-Catholic. Just non-CAtholic. He actually took offense to being called anti-CAtholic stating that anti means bigoted and hatred. I responded in so many words ‘DUH’ - Paisley’s article and website are pretty hatful and bigoted.

Does this guy truly believe he is not anti Catholic or is he denying it in hopes I wil listen to him so that he can ‘save’ me??? Should I end the correspondence? If not, what else can I say to this guy?

Thanks

 

[MGEISING]

Little Mary:

My inlaws who are fundamentalist bapstists a couple of people in the family attended or is in the process of attending BJU … also swear the school isn’t ANTI anything … but it isn’t true.

Just up until the 2000 presidential campain did they have a rule banning inter-racial dating …

Unless you are very very strong in your faith and can stand your own with this person … I personally wouldn’t keep up the correspondence. If you are strong – then YOU GO GIRL! and evangilize to BJU!

 

[Kevan]

Obviously there is a dispute about the definition of the term anticatholic. I myself have wondered what it means as I’ve read these boards. Sometimes it seems to apply to everyone who says that Catholicism is incorrect. If so, then it is practically indistinguishable from “noncatholic.”

As noted earlier here, BJU had Alan Keyes speak to the entire school. When Keyes was through, the university president hugged him and thanked him for being frank in his speech. Can you be anticatholic and do those three things? (Just wondering, since I can’t really define the term.)

Rather than getting the BJU student to accept a certain label, why not just ask him if he (1) believes certain things, (2) says certain things, or (3) does certain things? If you find the answers objectionable, try to explain why to him.

I’m a BJU graduate and I know what the atmosphere there is like. It’s highly unlikely that your correspondent has any personal antipathy toward Catholics.

 

[dream_wanderer]

I think they might be anti-catholic NOW in the sense that they think anti-catholicism is wrong. I don’t think they spew out the hatred that they used to.

I wouldn’t talk to the BJ guy unless you are very well grounded in your faith. He will always try to ‘save’ you and undermine your faith. If you know your Bible and catechism well and are experienced in defending the faith, go ahead. Make sure you tell him though that you know some BJU grads and former students who were now Catholic. I would be curious as to his reaction.

dream wanderer

 

[MGEISING]

I guess my main concern with BJU and Fundamental’s - is … they Judge other’s … and if I am correct … even Jesus, our Lord and Savior, says, I have not come to Judge, Only My Father in Heavan Judges.

I have been told on a number of occassions by my fundamentalist mother inlaw that i am going to Hell …

Who do these people think they are …???

 

[Little_Mary]

Kevan:

Obviously there is a dispute about the definition of the term anticatholic. I myself have wondered what it means as I’ve read these boards. Sometimes it seems to apply to everyone who says that Catholicism is incorrect. If so, then it is practically indistinguishable from “noncatholic.”

Thanks, Kevan. To me, anti-Catholic is what Jack Chick does, or the stuff on Ian Paisley’s website, to name a couple. If someone goes out of his way to make nasty comments about Catholicism, I think that is anti-CAtholic. In short, that is what anti-Catholicism is to me. Is that too broad? Too narrow? I welcome opinions and I don’t want to come across as opinionated, but I am offended by the likes of Jack Chick and Ian Paisley.

Rather than getting the BJU student to accept a certain label, why not just ask him if he (1) believes certain things, (2) says certain things, or (3) does certain things? If you find the answers objectionable, try to explain why to him.

I am not trying to get him to accept a label. I asked him if his school (BJU) was anti-Catholic and he said no, it is non-Catholic. That’s OK with me, but then why would it keep scathing articles about Catholicism in its library? Again, not trying to point fingers or be too adament what I think their stand is, I just want to find out their rationale.

I’m a BJU graduate and I know what the atmosphere there is like. It’s highly unlikely that your correspondent has any personal antipathy toward Catholics.

He does not appear to. His e-mails seem friendly and courteous and he has stated that his primary concern is maintain a friendly, Christian-like correspondence. I have made it clear to him that it is not my intent to convert him - I just have a strong interest in making certain that Catholic teachings are not misrepresented. To quote Mr. Martignoni "I don’t care of you disagree with what I believe, but disagree with what I really believe"

 

[Little_Mary]

dream wanderer:

I think they might be anti-catholic NOW in the sense that they think anti-catholicism is wrong. I don’t think they spew out the hatred that they used to.

I wouldn’t talk to the BJ guy unless you are very well grounded in your faith. He will always try to ‘save’ you and undermine your faith. If you know your Bible and catechism well and are experienced in defending the faith, go ahead. Make sure you tell him though that you know some BJU grads and former students who were now Catholic. I would be curious as to his reaction.

dream wanderer

Believe me, I am being very careful. I wonder if I told him I knew some BJUE grads/students that are now Catholic - wouldn’t he come back saying he knows many BJU grads/students who are *former *Catholics? Guess I’ll have to ask to find out!

 

[Little_Mary]

MGEISING:

Little Mary:

My inlaws who are fundamentalist bapstists a couple of people in the family attended or is in the process of attending BJU … also swear the school isn’t ANTI anything … but it isn’t true.

Just up until the 2000 presidential campain did they have a rule banning inter-racial dating …

Unless you are very very strong in your faith and can stand your own with this person … I personally wouldn’t keep up the correspondence. If you are strong – then YOU GO GIRL! and evangilize to BJU!

Thanks Mgeising! I am certainly very strong in my faith but not too experienced in apologetics. If I don’t know something I’ll go find out before I try to answer. I don’t expect it will last much longer anyway. I don’t expect to change his mind about anything so how long can you beat a dead horse? I just hope I can give him a few things to think about.

 

[MGEISING]

Little Mary:

WE CAN ALWAYS PLANT SEEDS … right!

 

[Kevan]

Little Mary:

If someone goes out of his way to make nasty comments about Catholicism, I think that is anti-CAtholic. In short, that is what anti-Catholicism is to me. Is that too broad? Too narrow? I welcome opinions and I don’t want to come across as opinionated, but I am offended by the likes of Jack Chick and Ian Paisley.

I think that many others agree with your definition. It seems that offensiveness is the key ingredient. So long as one is polite, he may disagree on every point.

If this definition is correct, I would suggest that “anticatholic” is not a useful term if it merely refers to someone’s etiquette. Maybe I’m wrong. Other opinions?

By this present definition, BJU stands guilty. From time to time the administration has said “Catholicism is wrong” in impolite language.

On the other hand, besides the Alan Keyes event, the school hired the eminent constitutional attorney William Ball to defend them before the Supreme Court. Ball was Catholic, but the administration had no qualms about working with him for years–in fact, placing their welfare in his hands.

It seems to me that these forums’ use of “anticatholic” implies an attitude of hate and a willingness to disregard the human rights of Catholics (including lies, persecution, discrimination, etc.) That probably describes some off-the-wall groups, but not BJU.

Why would it keep scathing articles about Catholicism in its library? Again, not trying to point fingers or be too adament what I think their stand is, I just want to find out their rationale.

They believe in speaking forcefully, the way much of the Bible speaks. But they’ve become more polite in the last twenty-five years. Their motive is never antipathy; they simply care about making the truth clear with no waffling.

I have made it clear to him that it is not my intent to convert him

Well, his intent is to convert you, so go ahead and open up on him.

I just have a strong interest in making certain that Catholic teachings are not misrepresented.

An admirable goal, and formidable as well.

 

[Little_Mary]

Kevan:

…An admirable goal, and formidable as well.

Thanks for the response, Kevan. I’m not sure ‘formidable’ is the adjective that would apply here but I do appreciate the information. This may sound pretty pessimistic, but I never for one minute thought I might turn around his way of thinking. I can (try to ) correct mis-understandings regarding my faith, but I’m well aware that, on a case by case basis, the information I give is only as good as what the person I give it to chooses to do with it.

 

[hlgomez]

Is Bob Jones a singer?

Pio