"Book of Mormon Christian?"

[mfbukowski]

dunno bukowski, bomc has got the feeling that the bom is true…i can hear it, can’t you…‘i know the bom is true’.

but no burning for Joe

i suspect joe is a fallen prophet in this particular startup

yet, y’all are mormons…zerinus seems to have it reconciled

i noticed there is no what-we-believe about marriage

I missed this post. He is not LDS just exmo “christian” who still believes the BOM is true. So its kind of an evangelical twist with the BOM thrown in. But of course it doesn’t fly because evangelicals don’t believe in the priesthood, which the BOM clearly teaches. Unless you look at the original greek of the BOM of course

Now watch- he will inform us that the BOM was not written in Greek, with a wikipedia reference. If he shows up at all.

 

[BrianH]

It’s not about any person. If a person’s name were there, then that would be what they’d talk about.

Regarding the course for TBOM ministry, it is there for those who are led to it, nothing else.

Now, instead of wasting our time, have you received a witness of The Book of Mormon? If not, will you take the challenge to read it and ask God if it is true?

I don’t know. We are talking about it being anonymous. As far as the 395 bucks, once again there is a serious lack of information provided. Are there DVD’s or a books? If it is just written material, someone is making a 350 dollar profit on materials. It seems shady. Not the beliefs mind you. The shady way they are presented.
As far as wasting time, I think the topic is germaine. I will talk about what I wish to talk about

 

[RebeccaJ]

I missed this post. He is not LDS just exmo “christian” who still believes the BOM is true. So its kind of an evangelical twist with the BOM thrown in. But of course it doesn’t fly because evangelicals don’t believe in the priesthood, which the BOM clearly teaches. Unless you look at the original greek of the BOM of course

Now watch- he will inform us that the BOM was not written in Greek, with a wikipedia reference. If he shows up at all.

Greek, reformed Egyptian, both have about the same veracity.

 

[BartBurk]

Sounds interesting but I think that site is down

It’s still working for me …

 

[RebeccaJ]

It seems to me maybe I have mentioned a little about that before

something about being a god

 

[JohnVIII]

It is very much true that the Book of Mormon does not teach Mormon doctrine! But don’t think that the Book of Mormon teaches Christian doctrine either. The Book of Mormon teaches that the Father and the Son are one and the same person, the Trinity is not taught in the Book of Mormon. The original publication of the Book of Mormon makes this even more clear. So the Book of Mrmon is not a “Second witness for Christ” it’s a second witness for chaos, because it contradicts both Mormonism and Christianity.

 

[BOMC]

I missed this post. He is not LDS just exmo “christian” who still believes the BOM is true. So its kind of an evangelical twist with the BOM thrown in. But of course it doesn’t fly because evangelicals don’t believe in the priesthood, which the BOM clearly teaches. Unless you look at the original greek of the BOM of course Now watch- he will inform us that the BOM was not written in Greek, with a wikipedia reference. If he shows up at all.

As my love for God grew, certain LDS statements bothered me more and more like this one: “The only true church…all others are wrong.”

I learned that God works with those who are sincere, or, “the pure in heart.” Thus, Joseph’s mantra and priesthood focus lost weight in my life.

I was led to evaluate what was compatible with the Love of God and ended up with the Bible and TBOM. There are many Book of Mormon Christians out there who were never associated with any of Joseph’s churches.

---

The glorious part is we don’t have to argue whether TBOM had the same priesthood(s) as Joseph’s church did, we can look at the first witness, the Bible. No one was ordained a high priest after Jesus. Evangelicals understand this, thus, they don’t have high priests or priesthood(s). Same as TBOM.

Thus what “ordain” means in the NT is significant.

I don’t know. We are talking about it being anonymous. As far as the 395 bucks, once again there is a serious lack of information provided. Are there DVD’s or a books? If it is just written material, someone is making a 350 dollar profit on materials. It seems shady. Not the beliefs mind you. The shady way they are presented.
As far as wasting time, I think the topic is germaine. I will talk about what I wish to talk about

Bad guess on how much the materials cost. Since we don’t advertise them, you’ll never know. Here’s a guess - If a set of BoM editions were included for the purpose of comparative analysis, how much would they cost? ($100.00+) If a set of Royal Skousen’s Critical BoM Project volumes were included, how much would they cost? ($400.00+) Are you beginning to see how ridiculous your conjecture is? ($100+$400=more than $395.)

Greek, reformed Egyptian, both have about the same veracity.

Funny, since that is the original language of the NT and BoM.

Let’s put it this way. When TBOM was translated in heaven into English, great care was taken to make it compatible with “Biblical English,” which was based on Tyndale’s translation from the Greek.

Thus, it makes perfect sense to look at the Greek meaning of NT words in order to understand the meaning of TBOM’s English.

 

[BOMC]

It is very much true that the Book of Mormon does not teach Mormon doctrine! But don’t think that the Book of Mormon teaches Christian doctrine either. The Book of Mormon teaches that the Father and the Son are one and the same person, the Trinity is not taught in the Book of Mormon. The original publication of the Book of Mormon makes this even more clear. So the Book of Mrmon is not a “Second witness for Christ” it’s a second witness for chaos, because it contradicts both Mormonism and Christianity.

Right, wrong. Though a reference to the Godhead was later changed, TBOM has equal references to Jesus as Father as well as Son. You can interpret it anyway you want.

Besides, John said God would remain a “mystery” until the seventh angel sounded his trump. Our focus can be on the one people saw - Jesus Christ, our Master, Lord, and Savior.

 

[BartBurk]

It is very much true that the Book of Mormon does not teach Mormon doctrine! But don’t think that the Book of Mormon teaches Christian doctrine either. The Book of Mormon teaches that the Father and the Son are one and the same person, the Trinity is not taught in the Book of Mormon. The original publication of the Book of Mormon makes this even more clear. So the Book of Mrmon is not a “Second witness for Christ” it’s a second witness for chaos, because it contradicts both Mormonism and Christianity.

I don’t think the Book of Mormon teaches modalism any more than the Bible does. It all depends how you interpret those verses. There are places in the Book of Mormon where Jesus is praying to his Father which make it clear that the Father is a separate person from the Son. Or would you disagree with the statement in the introduction to the Book of Mormon which says “Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God”? You can declare a lot of things about the Book of Mormon, but there is never any clear teaching that would make the Father, Son and Holy Ghost into one person. The original Book of Mormon called Mary “the mother of God” and that was changed to Mary being “the mother of the Son of God.” Do you find something wrong with calling Mary “the mother of God?” And if you are worried about Jesus being referred to as the Eternal Father you might want to question Isaiah’s reference to the Messiah as the “Everlasting Father, the Prince of Peace.”

 

[amontoya]

The glorious part is we don’t have to argue whether TBOM had the same priesthood(s) as Joseph’s church did, we can look at the first witness, the Bible. No one was ordained a high priest after Jesus. Evangelicals understand this, thus, they don’t have high priests or priesthood(s). Same as TBOM. Thus what “ordain” means in the NT is significant.

The Bible clearly does have an established priesthood, with episkopoi and presbyteros (bishops and priests) being ordained. But, if the discussion is about the priesthood in the Book of Mormon, then does it matter what the significance of “ordain” is in the New Testament, since clearly priests were being “ordained” or “appointed” in the Book of Mormon?

If a set of BoM editions were included for the purpose of comparative analysis, how much would they cost? ($100.00+) If a set of Royal Skousen’s Critical BoM Project volumes were included, how much would they cost? ($400.00+)

Are those books included?

Let’s put it this way. When TBOM was translated in heaven into English, great care was taken to make it compatible with “Biblical English,” which was based on Tyndale’s translation from the Greek. Thus, it makes perfect sense to look at the Greek meaning of NT words in order to understand the meaning of TBOM’s English.

I don’t understand this statement at all. I thought the Book of Mormon was translated by Joseph Smith here on Earth. What’s “Biblical English?” How do you translate one book from reformed Egyptian into “Biblical English” based on the translation of a different book from Greek to English?

 

[mfbukowski]

It is very much true that the Book of Mormon does not teach Mormon doctrine! But don’t think that the Book of Mormon teaches Christian doctrine either. The Book of Mormon teaches that the Father and the Son are one and the same person, the Trinity is not taught in the Book of Mormon. The original publication of the Book of Mormon makes this even more clear. So the Book of Mrmon is not a “Second witness for Christ” it’s a second witness for chaos, because it contradicts both Mormonism and Christianity.

CFR

 

[mfbukowski]

The glorious part is we don’t have to argue whether TBOM had the same priesthood(s) as Joseph’s church did, we can look at the first witness, the Bible. No one was ordained a high priest after Jesus. Evangelicals understand this, thus, they don’t have high priests or priesthood(s). Same as TBOM.

Thus what “ordain” means in the NT is significant.

First of all, the difference between “appointing” priests and “ordaining” them is insignificant. So even if I grant your ridiculous Greek language thesis, which I don’t, your result is still irrelevant. The bottom line is that the BOM shows clearly that there are priests ordained after the time of Christ, which shows there was still a priesthood. The absence of the words “high priest” is irrelevant since so much time is devoted earlier to an explanation of the Melchizadek priesthood which after all it says, will stay “forever”.

Bad guess on how much the materials cost. Since we don’t advertise them, you’ll never know. Here’s a guess - ***If ***a set of BoM editions were included for the purpose of comparative analysis, how much would they cost? ($100.00+) If a set of Royal Skousen’s Critical BoM Project volumes were included, how much would they cost? ($400.00+) Are you beginning to see how ridiculous your conjecture is? ($100+$400=more than $395.)

Very slippery. If you included a 5 carat diamond ring it would cost even more. But since you don’t say what’s included, this whole statement is irrelevant isn’t it? I think you may have heard that the internet is full of scams. If you are legitimate, you need at very least to show a list of what you allege to be included. Then perhaps you will find a few who trust your ad, and actually send money.

Let’s put it this way. When TBOM was translated in heaven into English, great care was taken to make it compatible with “Biblical English,” which was based on Tyndale’s translation from the Greek.

Thus, it makes perfect sense to look at the Greek meaning of NT words in order to understand the meaning of TBOM’s English.

Seriously, are you joking? I think you must be. So God didn’t want to have it translated clearly but chose 500 year old language to do so. Yet it is a modern scripture and he didn’t know that some would have a problem with that.

The correct answer is that Joseph used the biblical language he was familiar with from biblical study to translate it. That simple.

I am definitely leaning toward a hoax analysis of this whole thing. BOMC has got to be pulling our legs here guys.

 

[truthsilence]

Don’t need the BOM to convince me of who Jesus is. In fact, I’ve read it many times over and never received a witness of its truthfulness. If any thing, there’s been a witness of the Holy Spirit that it is not. For many years I wondered though, what was the harm in the book? I came to the conclusion that the problem is where it leads - taking more steps away from the Church Jesus himself established, and toward more and more erroneous doctrines.

Peace,
Tami

 

[mfbukowski]

Greek, reformed Egyptian, both have about the same veracity.

I am so so pleased that you have finally acknowledged reformed Egyptian to be a legitimate ancient language. I thought I’d never see the day. Man, a black president and Rebecca is Mormon again. What more could anyone want?

 

[BOMC]

This is so funny. Each issue we back up with two or more witnesses, and then we have you two who think the law of witnesses has no merit. We will be judged by what we say.

A recap since diversionary tactics are the form of the day:

LAW

High Priests

1. Does the NT demonstrate or teach, there will be high priests after Jesus? No.
**
2.** Does The Book of Mormon demonstrate or teach there will be high priests after Jesus? No.

3. Does Jesus in D&C 10 give permission for additions to TBOM of any kind, viz. high priests, baptizing eight year olds, confirmations, starting a church, polygamy attached to Christian Salvation/Joseph’s Exaltation, twelves apostles, “prophets” called by men, word of wisdom attached to Christian Salvation/Joseph’s Exaltation, temple endowment, etc. No.
**
Conclusion: There should be no high priests after Jesus.**

Priesthood

1. Does the NT demonstrate or teach a priesthood requirement for performing ordinances or establishing a group of believers, i.e. a church? No.
**
2.** Does the Book of Mormon demonstrate or teach a priesthood requirement for performing ordinances or establishing a **group of believers, i.e. a church? No.

3.** Does Jesus in D&C 10 teach that a priesthood is required or will be “restored?” No.
**
Conclusion: A priesthood is not required to perform ordinances or form a group of believers, i.e. a church.**

TESTIMONY

All who have been brought before the very throne of God (I previously gave two examples - Richard Sigmund and A Place Called Heaven, and Jesse Duplantis and Close Encounters of the God Kind.), the very highest point in heaven were never told: "Only those who hold the priesthood, or who were baptized by a priesthood holder can come this far. [Keep in mind, these men and others were specifically taught, shown, and commanded to tell people the truth about heaven, that Jesus will return, and what is required to enter therein. In other words, they didn’t leave anything out, just like The Book of Mormon does not.]

Conclusion: A priesthood is not required to either hold or to have received administrations from in order to see, or be with God.

MY TESTIMONY

Have I met my Lord and Savior? Yes I have. Have I seen the throne of God? Yes I have. And I have been saved miraculously from death, and hell? Yes. Thus, I know my source, and from whence salvation comes. It comes from God and His only Son, the Great One. Great because he gave all he had to follow God. And Great because he laid it all down for you and I.

The Book of Mormon, like the Bible, is full of accounts of people, who like me were saved from death and/or sin, and I encourage everyone to respect their testimonies.

And precisely, to those who routinely bash God, His Son, the Bible, or The Book of Mormon in these and other forums using pseudo names, God knows who you are, the games you play, and the vain glory you derive. If you bash God, His Son, The Book of Mormon or Bible, you will be judged by Him in like manner. And I ask right now that His judgments come sooner rather than later, that you may have time to repent and show forth good fruit.

.

 

[truthsilence]

And precisely, to those who routinely bash God, His Son, the Bible, or The Book of Mormon in these and other forums using pseudo names, God knows who you are, the games you play, and the vain glory you derive. If you bash God, His Son, The Book of Mormon or Bible, you will be judged by Him in like manner. And I ask right now that His judgments come sooner rather than later, that you may have time to repent and show forth good fruit.

.

Wow, BOMC…have you given us your real name yet?

And, you are on a forum set up by Catholics. We certainly do not bash God, His Son or the Bible. We don’t believe in the BOM or we’d be Mormon’s. Some of us were once.

I for one am not here to play any games. And I’m quite sure there’s a bunch of other folks here who aren’t playing games either.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I am so so pleased that you have finally acknowledged reformed Egyptian to be a legitimate ancient language. I thought I’d never see the day. Man, a black president and Rebecca is Mormon again. What more could anyone want?

:hey_bud:

The same veracity = zero. Maybe even -1. For the exact reason that “reformed egyptian” doesn’t exist.

Documents, documents, whose got the documents.

 

[BrianH]

Bad guess on how much the materials cost. Since we don’t advertise them, you’ll never know. Here’s a guess - If a set of BoM editions were included for the purpose of comparative analysis, how much would they cost? ($100.00+) If a set of Royal Skousen’s Critical BoM Project volumes were included, how much would they cost? ($400.00+) Are you beginning to see how ridiculous your conjecture is? ($100+$400=more than $395.)

Well the lack of being open about the contents is one of the problems. What BoM editions specifically? You said you used the printers manuscript. So you buy them and then turn and sell them for a profit?
olivewoodbooks.com/author/royal-skousen/

No my conjecture is not ridiculous. But to clarify, I find your ideas interesting. But your attitude stinks. No wonder you hide your identify…no offense

 

[RebeccaJ]

Hello, I have worked for a book publisher. Depending on the quality, it could cost very little to print and bind the works being discussed.

Similar to college texts…it costs maybe $15 (all costs, including overhead) for a book that the college bookstores sell for $90. For a cheaper binding, of paper and glue, it would cost half that.

And Royal Skousen, lol, I knew I smelled Skousen in your websites. You’ve embraced quite the assortment of bedfellows. Congratulations.

 

[BOMC]

You will see from my previous post that I have a testimony to share beyond what The Book of Mormon says. When TBOM is no longer associated with any church, or weird doctrines, I will gladly come out from “hiding.” Again, this is about The Book, we are letting it speak for itself.

.