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salusanimarum17
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Maybe, except who could quote the Protestant Sheila Rausch Kennedy as if she was some sort of authority/expert on canon law or church courts.TrueLight said:
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naycampbell
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I would greatly appreciate any thoughts or guidance. My husband and I are both Catholic. It’s a second marriage for us both. We were both formerly married to Catholics; my first wedding was performed outside the Church and his was a Catholic wedding. We have no children together, but 5 between us. During our first marriages we had fallen away from the Church. I attended CCD as a child, was confirmed, etc… but did not attend Mass because my Methodist father would not allow us to. I am desperately wanting to come back, attend Mass regularly, and be in full communion with the Church. My husband does not believe in the annulment process so even if I were to try and obtain one, he will not. I am trying to come to grips with the idea of going to Mass, and abstaining from Communion until my husband has a change of heart. The stigma of sitting in the pew while everyone else goes up for Communion is almost too much for me to bear. Please pray for me and I would appreciate any guidance or insight, especially those who have walked in my shoes. I’ve found it’s easy for those who have never been divorced and remarried to take a staunch position on this topic but please try to have some compassion for those of us who are just trying to repent for our past and start anew.
RC
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Cider
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There is no stigma to sitting in the pew while others receive. I did it for years before I was received into the Church. No one should be even paying attention to who is staying in the pews and if they are it is on them for not minding their own business.
You should make an appointment with your parish priest and sort out your situation.
You should make an appointment with your parish priest and sort out your situation.
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TimothyH
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I would ask what you mean by “Allow?”
I neither allow nor deny them communion. That is not my place. Nor is it my place to comment on whether someone other than myself and my Children, and possibly my mom or a very good friend, should or should not recieve communion. Whether they recieve communion is between themselves, their pastor, the Bishop and God.
I know the teaching of the Church. It is clear, as is scripture, but it is not my place to allow or deny anyone communion, nor is it my place to comment on whther they should or shouldn’t.
By love I mean invite them to your barbeque, carpool with them to school, invite them to your Bible study, and don’t ever treat them like they are anything other than someone of infinite value to God nor beyond salvation. By love I mean treat them like they are a full and equal member of God’s Church.
-Tim-
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skeyes
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“naycampbell” it must be a tough situation in which you feel you have no control over. The advice was correct about setting up a meeting to speak with a Priest for counseling and possibly setting in motion a plan to follow.
On another note, since yopu are uncomfortable sitting while others go to communion, you may walk to the front and instead of receiving Communion, you may cross your arms and receive a blessing from the Priest. I would make sure I was in the line the Priest is distributing Communion.
All may feel lost at this point, but we are His children and it will work out for the best when we persevere in face of challenge.
I pray that our Lord will give you the Grace to seek out a Priest who can explain your options.
Stan
On another note, since yopu are uncomfortable sitting while others go to communion, you may walk to the front and instead of receiving Communion, you may cross your arms and receive a blessing from the Priest. I would make sure I was in the line the Priest is distributing Communion.
All may feel lost at this point, but we are His children and it will work out for the best when we persevere in face of challenge.
I pray that our Lord will give you the Grace to seek out a Priest who can explain your options.
Stan
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TrueLight
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I don’t recall anyone saying you shouldn’t do the above. So if you are not commenting about the thread (which is about the OP’s prayer that remarried be allowed by the Church to receive), and don’t feel you should, what are you commenting on?
I give up.
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naycampbell
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Stan, thank you for your kind words. I had read somewhere that receiving a blessing was not really an option in most parishes but I’ll look into it. I agree, we need to set up a meeting with our priest. Thanks again.
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naycampbell
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Thanks Cider, I appreciate your empathy. We do need to talk to our priest; the challenge has been having enough courage to do it.
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mamaslo
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He still said “Go and sin no more.” The church does extend mercy. The price is a steep one but do-able.
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TimothyH
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The hard cold reality is that there are people who have done exactly what you have described, and later came to understand their mistake, but are now in a situation where there are children involved. They must think of the wellbeing of the Children. Tearing the family apart is often not what is best for a child.
If there is a person other than Our Lady who has had absolute obedience, I would like to meet them. If there is a person other than Mary who recieved our Lord and does not go back to sinning, I would like to read about them.
-Tim-
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mamaslo
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I did the cross your arms and recieve a blessing for about 10 years. I needed what grace I could get. There are many who would say that this is a not appropriate, or even wrong…I figure, they wouldn’t allow it if it was either of those things.
It is a difficult journey to make this right, but it can be done.
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TimothyH
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My first comment was on Gertabell’s assertion that Christianty is not for pansies.I don’t recall anyone saying you shouldn’t do the above. So if you are not commenting about the thread (which is about the OP’s prayer that remarried be allowed by the Church to receive), and don’t feel you should, what are you commenting on?
I give up.
You then started asking me questions. I’m sorry my answers frustrate you. That was not my intent.
-Tim-
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ProVobis
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Scandal is everyone’s business, unfortunately.
But nothing is to stop them from attending Mass. That should be love enough, IMO.
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Hallelujah16
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Thanks!
I have to say that I’m pretty down hearted as most of the posts I read are so, how can I put it, “up tight”? So closed up to any adjustment even though there is a great need for that to happen! The Church has evolved throughout the centuries and certain “practice, tradition, teaching” have been readjusted…I believe there is room for more adjustment. When something doesn’t work it is useless and detrimental to hold on to it for the sake of keeping everything the same…What needs to be pruned from the Church needs to be pruned.But it is well known that many people do fear “change” and will resist “change” like if their life depends on it…
Aren’t you glad that the Church is not selling indulgences anymore??? Wasn’t it a good readjustment???
Yep, it is between them and God and we ought to give them the credit that the Spirit of God has born witness in their heart that they are indeed in a state of Grace and should receive the Eucharist!Anyway, IMO it is a big mistake to keep them away from communing with Christ when God looks upon them with mercy and compassion! It is not like our God, who is just and loving to punish an innocent!!! And that is what the victims of divorce are “INNOCENT”. My best friend and my cousin never, ever wanted to be divorced! And no matter what some say, they had “NO” choice! Their husbands just left them to fornicate with other women…how could they have known that they were wolves in sheep clothing??? How could they know that they were “Catholics” by name only???
Our God would never want for any of His children to spend an entire life of Celibacy, when He has not called them for that, just because their spouse didn’t “walk the talk” and abandoned them to indulge in fornication ever more so!!!
Not even a “human” judge would do such a thing as to punish an obvious innocent like that!
Thus God who is perfect in everything and so full of compassion would certainly not do such injustice! That would be so cruel and heartless! How can anyone even suggest that it is the “Will of God”??? It is not because the Church says so that it is so. The Church made mistakes throughout the centuries and doesn’t always apply “the Will of God”. And keeping an innocent from the Eucharist is certainly not the “Will of God”.
Why are most of you holding dearly to swallow any practice or teaching without “testing” without using the gifts that God bestowed upon you which are a “sound mind, His Holy Spirit inside of you”. No Scripture can be taken out of context and no doctrine can be based on few scriptures while neglecting the harmony of the Word of God!
And if you take the word of our Lord in Mat.5:31-32 does mention “fornication” in the Greek.
Moreover, if we have so many priests, theologians and bishops who we know have the “knowledge and the skills” to understand the Scriptures, believing that the Eucharist should be given to divorced/remarried children of God…doesn’t it tell you something? Or are you going to say that those are heretic priests, theologians and bishops, and need to be “burned at the stake!”???
What I don’t understand when I read your posts is that the Church is finding legitimate grounds for annulments…That means there are many cases when it was not a sin at all for a divorced person to remarry and the Church would bless that new marriage…
And that is why, many priests have decided to let divorced/remarried people in their parish receive the Eucharist as well as Absolution when they go to confession. Don’t you think that they know what they are doing??? On the top of that it is not an isolated case, it happens in many parishes from what I gathered. And why is that??? It is because these priests who have the knowledge of the Scriptures and who have talked to the divorced/remarried person see how unjust it would be to keep them from the Sacrament while they are innocent and not condemned by God Himself. They know that the person has legitimate grounds for an annulment and an annulment would be granted. Thus they go ahead as they don’t see why they would keep these souls from what they need.
I want to specify something that seems to be lost in the posts…This thread is not about “should the Church say it’s OK to divorce”; we are talking of the aftermaths of divorce and the injustice to punish the innocent party and keep he/she from the Eucharist and about the flaws found in the solution that the Church had come up with “Annulments”.
If you would accept to look the truth in the eyes, and admit that the Church can still make mistakes just like it did in the past…You would see that the Church has become “carried away” with the procedure of annulments: holding a tribunal, having attorneys, having a judge, having investigations, witnesses, bunch of paperwork, and so on and so forth!!! And in most cases this means a considerable amount of time…
This is going too far and it is not necessary! Going through such an extent like if the victim of a divorce was a “criminal”!!! Like if that divorced/remarried brother or sister would lie to his/her priest!!!
give me a break!And during all that time that is lost dealing with a tribunal system as bad if not worse than the civil ones, this child of God is kept from the most important part of his/her spiritual life “communion with his/her Lord”. This is preposterous!
And to top everything, some of them even if they fulfill all the requirements are denied!!! For so trivial reasons such as “you could not provide an eye witness” Like some post I read in another thread, someone having their spouse cheating with a same sex partner, or another also committing fornication of some sort I can’t remember the details while on business trips and the innocent victim could not provide an eye witness because the spouse was so good at hiding under false appearances…This is outrageous, totally unjust, and ungodly! The applicant for the annulment should have been believed! If that would make them feel better they could have made that child of God swear on the Bible! Come on, what a joke and even if I know many of you are going to slaughter me for that, I dare say: "This is a sin against God, to keep his/her child from the Eucharist just because they are not willing to believe him/her and have gone so bureaucratic at playing “tribunal”.When things go that far, the Church must wake up, swallow its pride, accept to say “sorry, we got carried away that was not right” and change the system! For details on how the procedure of annulment could be improved read my thread #24:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=696209&page=2
Finally I would like to add one more thing about those who have remarried like my best friend and my cousin and it is that I know without the shadow of a doubt that God was deeply grieved to see how His children were treated by their former spouse and by the Church and I know without the shadow of a doubt that He was the one who sent a new spouse to them.
And I know also that once “everything is set and done”… I’m glad that I will not be in the shoes of all those who have withheld an annulment for the sake of playing “tribunal” to the full, who have made his children wait, wait and some more without partaking to the Eucharist for no reason, who have pointed the finger saying “you are not in a state of grace, you are a sinner!”
Well, I said my piece…you can slaughter me now if you want, it doesn’t matter to me!
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Hallelujah16
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I am with you all heartedly and I will pray especially for you as I pray regularly for the Church to work on changing the way they deal with “divorced/remarried” Catholics and with the way they handled annulments. I fully understand your position which is the same as my best friend and one of my cousin.
My best friend and my cousin both say that it is unbearable to see all the others receive the Eucharist while being forced to abstain. Their soul crave for communion with our Lord and it is very painful to endure. I can also put myself in your shoes as I don’t see how I could attend Mass and be kept from the Eucharist.
Thus, trust me I’m fighting in prayer for all the “divorced/remarried” Catholics so that they will be able to partake to the Eucharist. And I will mention you by name (at least the one you give as your forum ID) when praying the Rosary.
God bless you and may His peace and love rest upon you.
:hug1:
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Cider
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Reagrding going up to receive blessings, here is the response to that question by the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Disciple of the Sacraments
First post in this thread
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=543513
This Congregation for Divine Worship and the Disciple of the Sacraments acknowledges receipt of your kind letter of 13 August, 2008 and would like to thank you for your interest and suggestions. This matter is presently under the attentive study of the Congregation.
For the present, therefore, this Dicastery wishes to limit itself to the following observations:
The liturgical blessing of the Holy Mass is properly given to each and to all at the conclusion of the Mass, just a few moments subsequent to the distribution of Holy Communion.
Lay people, within the context of Holy Mass, are unable to confer blessings. These blessings, rather, are the competence of the priest (cf. Ecclesia de Mysterio, Notitiae 34 (15 Aug. 1997), art. 6, § 2; can. 1169, § 2; and Roman Ritual De Benedictionibus (1985), n. 18).
Furthermore, the laying on of a hand or hands – which has its own sacramental significance, inappropriate here – by those distributing Holy Communion, in substitution for its reception, is to be explicitly discouraged.
The Apostolic Exhortation Familiaris Consortio, n. 84, “forbids any pastor, for whatever reason to pretext even of a pastoral nature, to perform ceremonies of any kind for divorced people who remarry.” To be feared is that any form of blessing in substitution for communion would give the impression that the divorced and remarried have been returned, in some sense, to the status of Catholics in good standing.
In a similar way, for others who are not to be admitted to Holy Communion in accord with the norm of law, the Church’s discipline has already made clear that they should not approach Holy Communion nor receive a blessing. This would include non-Catholics and those envisaged in can. 915 (i.e., those under the penalty of excommunication or interdict, and others who obstinately persist in manifest grave sin).
Please continue to pray for the Church’s ministers that they ever become more worthy of the mystery they celebrate.
With every good wish and kind regard, I am,
Sincerely Yours in Christ,
**See above link for the full post.
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zz912
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Then your feelings are wrong. The Church and Christ have spoken on the issue, and they shouldn’t. And you shouldn’t allow the Lord to be disgraced in such a way without trying to do something, specifically letting the priest/pastor know about it.
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fastenatingguy
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SILLARA
We are to be ready to bear witness to Our Lord and His love even to the point of death–or to the point of never marrying again if our marriage falls apart. To the point of separation from, or if children are involved, of celibate living with, an adulterous “spouse”.
When we sin, we nail Our Lord back to the Cross. Would you nail someone’s flesh to a tree and then ask to partake of that same flesh–all while planning to go back to the nailing immediately thereafter?
Our Lord offers to us Himself, offers the very flesh we have violated as the bread of our life. He asks only that we turn away from continuing to violate it.
Can we really say that it is all right to receive the greatest gift possible – the Body, Blood, Flesh, and Divinity of Our Lord – and then just go back to sinning again? To know that we will do so because we are continuing in adultery?
Very well stated. Thank you for your contribution!
We are to be ready to bear witness to Our Lord and His love even to the point of death–or to the point of never marrying again if our marriage falls apart. To the point of separation from, or if children are involved, of celibate living with, an adulterous “spouse”.
When we sin, we nail Our Lord back to the Cross. Would you nail someone’s flesh to a tree and then ask to partake of that same flesh–all while planning to go back to the nailing immediately thereafter?
Our Lord offers to us Himself, offers the very flesh we have violated as the bread of our life. He asks only that we turn away from continuing to violate it.
Can we really say that it is all right to receive the greatest gift possible – the Body, Blood, Flesh, and Divinity of Our Lord – and then just go back to sinning again? To know that we will do so because we are continuing in adultery?
Very well stated. Thank you for your contribution!
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fastenatingguy
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I have heard both sides (“Go up” AND “Don’t go up”) of this from good priests:
Priest#1) The whole congregation receives a blessing just before mass ends, so “personal” blessings are not required. Spiritual communion (reflection) is appropriate.
Priest#2) If you are unable to receive worthily, you may come up for a blessing with arms folded.
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breachway1101
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Actually Jesus DID judge the adulteress in The Gospel but He did not condem her. He acknowledged her sin and told her to sin no more.
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