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Neil_Anthony
Guest
Should we go back to the pre-Vatican II era when it was much harder to get an annulment?
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wifeandmomoftwo
Guest
it still is. I speak from experience, it is not a stroll in the park and it is never guaranteed
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Neil_Anthony
Guest
It should be easier today, because so few people getting ‘married’ actually intend to get married in the Catholic sense of the word.
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IrishAm
Guest
I agree. There have always been abuses, of course, before and after Vatican II.
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ASimpleSinner
Guest
AMEN.
The scandal of the annulment situation in the US is that there *** is not a heck of a lot more of them.***
There should be FAR more. I have seen the lit offered to friends of mine before their wedding in a Catholic parish known for being rather “average”. Not traditional, not liberal, rather run of the mill.
If they had been counting on that literature for ANY insight or preparation into the fullness of the Catholic understanding of the Sacrament of Matrimony, they would have been in some SERIOUS trouble.
What SHOULD be made tougher?
Getting married in a Catholic Church to begin with. Pimping the parish out to be a vegas wedding chapel is all too commmon in far too many places.
"You are living together already, fornicating, on abortifacient birth control, (with no plans to understand or observe the Catholic teaching on contraception), have signed a pre-nup, haven’t been to Mass since the last wedding you attended, haven’t been to confession since grade school and you want a Catholic wedding?"
What should the answer be to that one? For my friends “Suzie & Tom” it was:
“Sure! What date did you want?”***
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jmcrae
Guest
I agree with the above.
How do we get parishes, and parish priests, to become more discerning about who gets married in the Church?
How do we get parishes, and parish priests, to become more discerning about who gets married in the Church?
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nobeerinheaven
Guest
And you think that’s going to change by making the Church be more liberal in its recognition of annulment? Yes, it should be harder to get a Catholic wedding, but it should be equally as hard to get the Church to recognize annulment, so that people take the sacrament of marriage seriously.
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Neil_Anthony
Guest
If the couple (or one of them) getting married don’t truly intend to marry, then their ‘marriage’ isn’t valid. They have lied to God and the church and taken false vows. That means that they weren’t married in the eyes of God or the Church.
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themait
Guest
I agree with NOBEERINHEAVEN—From what I hear it is pretty much filing the paperwork—going through the motions—and getting signed off. What a horrible feeling for people that are fighting for their marriage and really know that an anullment is wrong.Prayers.
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lizaanne
Guest
An annulment is not wrong - divorce and living an unchaste life is wrong. If a marriage is not valid it’s not valid - period. There is nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is that the couple obviously had issues at the time of their marriage that were not either resolved or that they had a wedding at all. Poor preparation for marriage is what’s wrong.
Prayers.
~Liza
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cecilia97
Guest
Please, this is not intended to be personal, but I’m guessing you have never been through the nullity process. It was scandalously EASY for my ex and I to get married in the Church, with no helpful or searching preparation to speak of…just one 30 minute meeting with our pastor during which we discussed details of the Nuptial Mass, and a terrible Engaged Encounter weekend retreat.
In contrast, my annulment petition is now in its 9 month with at least 6 more to go. We were married 4 years, he is “cooperating” with the process, and the local Tribunal has suggested SIX possible grounds for nullity. Still, it will take a total of 12 months and several difficult meetings with Tribunal personnel, and MUCH painful soul-searching, plus at least 3 months for second Tribunal review before a decision is reached.
I’m not whining about the nullity petition process. I think marriage prep in most parishes frankly sucks.
So who exactly has decided that it’s too “easy” to get an annulment these days? And do people realize that in many places/cases, it’s already MUCH more difficult to “get” an annulment than it is to get married?
In my parents’ day, the Church required 6 months of intenstive Pre Cana. That’s what I think we need.
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puzzleannie
Guest
no 1 we don’t do a poll on canon law issues
no 2 the annulment process and the canon law tribunal in general is there to give Catholics recourse under canon law when they need it, and must be made available to all who need it
no 3, question attacks the wrong side of the issue
if poster feels there are too many annulments, it means there are too many invalid marriages, so a more logical approach would be exploring ways to make sure Catholics are prepared to marry validly and taught the conditions for valid marriage, and to intend what the Church intends for marriage.
no 4, how is this a traditional Catholic forum issue and not a liturgy and sacraments post?
no 2 the annulment process and the canon law tribunal in general is there to give Catholics recourse under canon law when they need it, and must be made available to all who need it
no 3, question attacks the wrong side of the issue
if poster feels there are too many annulments, it means there are too many invalid marriages, so a more logical approach would be exploring ways to make sure Catholics are prepared to marry validly and taught the conditions for valid marriage, and to intend what the Church intends for marriage.
no 4, how is this a traditional Catholic forum issue and not a liturgy and sacraments post?
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thecoach
Guest
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Friar_David_O.Carm
Guest
I could not vote because the poll question and answers are loaded.
To answer you have to admit that there has been a change that has made getting annulments easier.
This is like asking a married man, “Did you beat your wife today?” and only allowing a yes or no answer. If he answers he, in essence, admits that he beats his wife.
Annulments are not easier to get today, there are just a whole lot more “marriages” out there that should not have been contracted in the first place.
To answer you have to admit that there has been a change that has made getting annulments easier.
This is like asking a married man, “Did you beat your wife today?” and only allowing a yes or no answer. If he answers he, in essence, admits that he beats his wife.
Annulments are not easier to get today, there are just a whole lot more “marriages” out there that should not have been contracted in the first place.
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thecoach
Guest
why cant their be a poll on canon law issues?
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themait
Guest
Cecilia—I guess from everyone else I have heard from—it has appeared to be simply petitioning for one and getting approved. I guess I have never asked about the length of time it takes…or what the exact procedure is with meetings and everything.
It just seems to me, from what I have read (if it is true)—that a 90-95% approval of anullment petitions in the US seems ridiculous-especially when taking into account what happens on appeal…or the approval rate around the rest of the world.
I hope that you get through this process with the result you are looking for and your faith.
Does anyone have copies of any blank documents that they received (questionairres, etc) for starting out the anullment process? I am just curious as to the questions that are asked…I know basically the grounds, but am trying to figure out everything about the process-as I see that in my future.
It just seems to me, from what I have read (if it is true)—that a 90-95% approval of anullment petitions in the US seems ridiculous-especially when taking into account what happens on appeal…or the approval rate around the rest of the world.
I hope that you get through this process with the result you are looking for and your faith.
Does anyone have copies of any blank documents that they received (questionairres, etc) for starting out the anullment process? I am just curious as to the questions that are asked…I know basically the grounds, but am trying to figure out everything about the process-as I see that in my future.
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cecilia97
Guest
Don’t believe everything you hear.
Prayers.
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Sr_Sally
Guest
Absolutely agree. We went through the tests, meetings with priest, 2 weekends of pre-cana (and they were both good) and the first years of marriage were still hard in some ways.
Many things are too easy these days–deciding to get married should be a VERY BIG deal. A Catholic marriage should be special. It is the preparation that makes it so, not the ease or difficulty of getting it annulled.
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Cathryn
Guest
I believe there are too many Catholics who don’t have a clue what they are entering into or what their wedding vows mean. There are probably more invalid marriages today than ever before.
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Neil_Anthony
Guest
I fully accept V2 and I prefer the Novus Ordo mass. I was just interested in whether Traditional catholics who prefer the old liturgy also prefer the old way of dealing with marriages. Didn’t mean to offend.
(Why? Because growing up I heard stories from the older generation about how things didn’t used to be this way… about how the church was betraying the faith by allowing people to get divorced now, and this and that. I’m curious about it now and kind of unsure.)
Sorry if the question seems ‘loaded’. I just assumed most people agreed that annulments were more available now. It wasn’t intentional.
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