CAF Bible Study - The Gospel of John

  • Thread starter Thread starter Church_Militant
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
The final words of Zechariah.

Zecha 14:19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zecha 14:20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD’s house shall be like the bowls before the altar.
Zecha 14:21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, … there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.

The next part of John up to V37 is about unbelief even in the face of signs.

[37] On the last day of the feast, the great day, Jesus stood up and proclaimed, "If any one thirst, let him come to me and drink.

This appears as a paraphrase of Isaiah 55:1~3, the final invitation.

[38] He who believes in me, as the scripture has said, `Out of his heart (κολιας) shall flow rivers of living water.’"

‘Out of his belly’ is another translation. Belly can also refer to womb.

similar ideas: Isaiah 58:11
and perhaps a paraphrase of Jerimiah 2:13, 17:13,
and with the trees of the feast: IS 41:17-19

From what I understand, Jesus’ words may have been referring to the scripture of the liturgy for the feast of tabernacles. Perhaps the way the priests of his day said it.

[39] Now this he said about the Spirit, which those who believed in him were to receive; for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Even as with the idea of Solomon and the temple, the presence of the spirit was in the desert where the Israelites first humbled themselves to dwell in tents while escaping Egypt. But more-so, the desert is where God first dwelt in a tent – the tent of meeting which would become the temple for Solomon.

Also, consider Moses and the striking of the rock from which came the water. The lance which would enter the side of Jesus once rather than twice, would physically fulfill this at the crucifixion.

Also, the new testament scripture talks of Jesus tabernacling with us – and that our bodies are earthly tents / booths / tabernacles. The twist of phrase about the destruction of the temple vs. the destruction of Jesus’ body shows that there is an identity of sorts between them. One is a model of the other in some way.
 
All of you writing on John’s Gospel are superb. I’m so far behind on really understanding all of these deep meanings when you go back to the Old Testament and compare. But I would like to comment on the last 2 paragraphs of Huiou Theou. I believe my body to be a living tabernacle and to keep it clean and away from sin. Awaiting each time I may recieve the Holy Eucharist. Also I believe, when the lance pierced Christ’s body, the Blood flowing out was a sign of the Holy Spirit coming out into the world. This last sentence I heard from a member of the Papal Household at a presentation I attended at a Charismatic Conference early this year. I will never forget it.
One can only know about this living water and the tabernacle within… thru reading scripture and attending Mass.
38 Whoever believes in Me, “Rivers of living water will flow from within him.” I believe in Him, my Comfortor and yours.
Sincerely, Franny
 
[24] Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment."

That verse really packs a lot of applications into it doesn’t it?

I can think of many many times when I had a response to the person I saw and then later after investing some time in them) discovered that the person was far better, (or in some cases, worse) than I had initially thought.

I guess my prayer should be, “O Lord Jesus Christ, let my senses be like yours in all things, that I might be like you in all things.” 😊
 
Church_Militant said:
[24] Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment."

That verse really packs a lot of applications into it doesn’t it?
Click to expand...
Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever! Let’s get on with it, CM!!! This native is getting restless and ready to move on to chapter 8!!!

BTW, I hope you’re not judging me to critically right now, my brother!!! 👍
 
NotWorthy said:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever! Let’s get on with it, CM!!! This native is getting restless and ready to move on to chapter 8!!!

BTW, I hope you’re not judging me to critically right now, my brother!!! 👍
Click to expand...
:rotfl: Don’t even know what ya look like. :rotfl: 😉 🙂
 
John Chapter 8
[1] but Jesus went to the Mount of Olives.
[2] Early in the morning he came again to the temple; all the people came to him, and he sat down and taught them.
[3] The scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in adultery, and placing her in the midst
[4] they said to him, “Teacher, this woman has been caught in the act of adultery.
[5] Now in the law Moses commanded us to stone such. What do you say about her?”
[6] This they said to test him, that they might have some charge to bring against him. Jesus bent down and wrote with his finger on the ground.
[7] And as they continued to ask him, he stood up and said to them, “Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her.”
[8] And once more he bent down and wrote with his finger on the ground.
[9] But when they heard it, they went away, one by one, beginning with the eldest, and Jesus was left alone with the woman standing before him.
[10] Jesus looked up and said to her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”
[11] She said, “No one, Lord.” And Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you; go, and do not sin again.”
[12] Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world; he who follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”
[13] The Pharisees then said to him, “You are bearing witness to yourself; your testimony is not true.”
[14] Jesus answered, “Even if I do bear witness to myself, my testimony is true, for I know whence I have come and whither I am going, but you do not know whence I come or whither I am going.
[15] You judge according to the flesh, I judge no one.
[16] Yet even if I do judge, my judgment is true, for it is not I alone that judge, but I and he who sent me.
[17] In your law it is written that the testimony of two men is true;
[18] I bear witness to myself, and the Father who sent me bears witness to me.”
[19] They said to him therefore, “Where is your Father?” Jesus answered, “You know neither me nor my Father; if you knew me, you would know my Father also.”
[20] These words he spoke in the treasury, as he taught in the temple; but no one arrested him, because his hour had not yet come.
[21] Again he said to them, “I go away, and you will seek me and die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come.”
[22] Then said the Jews, “Will he kill himself, since he says, Where I am going, you cannot come'?" [23] He said to them, "You are from below, I am from above; you are of this world, I am not of this world. [24] I told you that you would die in your sins, for you will die in your sins unless you believe that I am he." [25] They said to him, "Who are you?" Jesus said to them, "Even what I have told you from the beginning. [26] I have much to say about you and much to judge; but he who sent me is true, and I declare to the world what I have heard from him." [27] They did not understand that he spoke to them of the Father. [28] So Jesus said, "When you have lifted up the Son of man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority but speak thus as the Father taught me. [29] And he who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what is pleasing to him." [30] As he spoke thus, many believed in him. [31] Jesus then said to the Jews who had believed in him, "If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, [32] and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free." [33] They answered him, "We are descendants of Abraham, and have never been in bondage to any one. How is it that you say, You will be made free’?”
[34] Jesus answered them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, every one who commits sin is a slave to sin.
[35] The slave does not continue in the house for ever; the son continues for ever.
[36] So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed.
 
[37] I know that you are descendants of Abraham; yet you seek to kill me, because my word finds no place in you.
[38] I speak of what I have seen with my Father, and you do what you have heard from your father."
[39] They answered him, “Abraham is our father.” Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would do what Abraham did,
[40] but now you seek to kill me, a man who has told you the truth which I heard from God; this is not what Abraham did.
[41] You do what your father did.” They said to him, “We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.”
[42] Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I proceeded and came forth from God; I came not of my own accord, but he sent me.
[43] Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word.
[44] You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
[45] But, because I tell the truth, you do not believe me.
[46] Which of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me?
[47] He who is of God hears the words of God; the reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”
[48] The Jews answered him, “Are we not right in saying that you are a Samaritan and have a demon?”
[49] Jesus answered, “I have not a demon; but I honor my Father, and you dishonor me.
[50] Yet I do not seek my own glory; there is One who seeks it and he will be the judge.
[51] Truly, truly, I say to you, if any one keeps my word, he will never see death.”
[52] The Jews said to him, “Now we know that you have a demon. Abraham died, as did the prophets; and you say, `If any one keeps my word, he will never taste death.’
[53] Are you greater than our father Abraham, who died? And the prophets died! Who do you claim to be?”
[54] Jesus answered, “If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing; it is my Father who glorifies me, of whom you say that he is your God.
[55] But you have not known him; I know him. If I said, I do not know him, I should be a liar like you; but I do know him and I keep his word.
[56] Your father Abraham rejoiced that he was to see my day; he saw it and was glad.”
[57] The Jews then said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?”
[58] Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.”
[59] So they took up stones to throw at him; but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple.
 
This section is one that makes me wonder which group I would have been in. I like to think it would be the ones who believed in Jesus, but knowing my own cynicism about self-declared prophets and such makes me not so sure.
I think, tho, that Jesus must have had a presence about him that was unlike anyone else. And then there were the miraculous works he did to help others.
 
katy said:
This section is one that makes me wonder which group I would have been in. I like to think it would be the ones who believed in Jesus, but knowing my own cynicism about self-declared prophets and such makes me not so sure.
I think, tho, that Jesus must have had a presence about him that was unlike anyone else. And then there were the miraculous works he did to help others.
Click to expand...
Makes me wonder too. It would depend if I had seen any of the miracles with my own eyes.

I know I wouldn’t have thrown stones (hate violence), but I may have made a sarcastic remark. “You’ve seen Abraham?”

“yeah right!”

I can so identify with Thomas.
 
It’s peculiar. Some early bibles omitted the story of Jesus and the Woman caught in adultery, because they were worried that the faithful would interpret it that Jesus was condoning adultery.
 
Not to jump around too much, I’m confused about this statement
[33] They answered him, "We are descendants of Abraham, and have never been in bondage to any one. How is it that you say, `You will be made free’?"Do these guys even know about the Exodus?
Click to expand...
 
NotWorthy said:
Not to jump around too much, I’m confused about this statement. Do these guys even know about the Exodus?
Click to expand...
Yeah, I’m not all that sure, but wasn’t Israel conquered by the Greeks before the Romans came a long?

Israel History Timeline

597 BC: Babylonians send army to put down a rebellion and take prominent Jews into exile​

586 BC: Babylonians arrive to put down another rebellion, destroy the First Temple, and remove more Jews into exile​

539 BC: Babylonians defeated by Persians​

538 BC: Cyrus the Great of Persia allows the Jews to return to Israel and rebuild temple in return for loyalty oath to Persia​

515 BC: Second Temple built​

332 BC: Alexander the Great of Macedonia conquers Persia and takes over their empire, including Palestine; Hellenization of Israel begins​

170-164 BC: Maccabee revolt against forced Hellenization; Jewish independence​

63 BC: Roman legions, under General Pompey, conquer Jerusalem​

37 BC: Herod the Great installed by Romans as vassal king​

4 BC: Jesus born​

 
This seems to be a replay of Wisdom 2,12-24. (Hope I’m not breaking any rules, pasting.)

12
Let us beset the just one, because he is obnoxious to us; he sets himself against our doings, Reproaches us for transgressions of the law and charges us with violations of our training.
13
He professes to have knowledge of God and styles himself a child of the LORD.
14
To us he is the censure of our thoughts; merely to see him is a hardship for us,
15
Because his life is not like other men’s, and different are his ways.
16
He judges us debased; he holds aloof from our paths as from things impure. He calls blest the destiny of the just and boasts that God is his Father.
17
Let us see whether his words be true; let us find out what will happen to him.
18
For if the just one be the son of God, he will defend him and deliver him from the hand of his foes.
19
With revilement and torture let us put him to the test that we may have proof of his gentleness and try his patience.
20
Let us condemn him to a shameful death; for according to his own words, God will take care of him."
21
These were their thoughts, but they erred; for their wickedness blinded them,
22
And they knew not the hidden counsels of God; neither did they count on a recompense of holiness nor discern the innocent souls’ reward.
23
For God formed man to be imperishable; the image of his own nature he made him.
24
But by the envy of the devil, death entered the world, and they who are in his possession experience it.
 
Welcome to the study Red!

Fascinating comparison to the Wisdom. I suppose that John had heard these things in the practice of his Jewish faith long before he was chosen as an apostle.

The saying is certainly true that the New Testament is in the Old concealed and the Old is in the New revealed.
 
John Chapter 9
Code: 
  [1] As he passed by, he saw a man blind from his birth.
  [2] And his disciples asked him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?"
  [3] Jesus answered, "It was not that this man sinned, or his parents, but that the works of God might be made manifest in him.
  [4] We must work the works of him who sent me, while it is day; night comes, when no one can work.
  [5] As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world."
  [6] As he said this, he spat on the ground and made clay of the spittle and anointed the man's eyes with the clay,
  [7] saying to him, "Go, wash in the pool of Silo'am" (which means Sent). So he went and washed and came back seeing.
  [8] The neighbors and those who had seen him before as a beggar, said, "Is not this the man who used to sit and beg?"
  [9] Some said, "It is he"; others said, "No, but he is like him." He said, "I am the man."
  [10] They said to him, "Then how were your eyes opened?"
  [11] He answered, "The man called Jesus made clay and anointed my eyes and said to me, `Go to Silo'am and wash'; so I went and washed and received my sight."
  [12] They said to him, "Where is he?" He said, "I do not know."
  [13] They brought to the Pharisees the man who had formerly been blind.
  [14] Now it was a sabbath day when Jesus made the clay and opened his eyes.
  [15] The Pharisees again asked him how he had received his sight. And he said to them, "He put clay on my eyes, and I washed, and I see."
  [16] Some of the Pharisees said, "This man is not from God, for he does not keep the sabbath." But others said, "How can a man who is a sinner do such signs?" There was a division among them.
  [17] So they again said to the blind man, "What do you say about him, since he has opened your eyes?" He said, "He is a prophet."
  [18] The Jews did not believe that he had been blind and had received his sight, until they called the parents of the man who had received his sight,
  [19] and asked them, "Is this your son, who you say was born blind? How then does he now see?"
  [20] His parents answered, "We know that this is our son, and that he was born blind;
  [21] but how he now sees we do not know, nor do we know who opened his eyes. Ask him; he is of age, he will speak for himself."
  [22] His parents said this because they feared the Jews, for the Jews had already agreed that if any one should confess him to be Christ, he was to be put out of the synagogue.
  [23] Therefore his parents said, "He is of age, ask him."
  [24] So for the second time they called the man who had been blind, and said to him, "Give God the praise; we know that this man is a sinner."
  [25] He answered, "Whether he is a sinner, I do not know; one thing I know, that though I was blind, now I see."
  [26] They said to him, "What did he do to you? How did he open your eyes?"
  [27] He answered them, "I have told you already, and you would not listen. Why do you want to hear it again? Do you too want to become his disciples?"
  [28] And they reviled him, saying, "You are his disciple, but we are disciples of Moses.
  [29] We know that God has spoken to Moses, but as for this man, we do not know where he comes from."
  [30] The man answered, "Why, this is a marvel! You do not know where he comes from, and yet he opened my eyes.
  [31] We know that God does not listen to sinners, but if any one is a worshiper of God and does his will, God listens to him.
  [32] Never since the world began has it been heard that any one opened the eyes of a man born blind.
  [33] If this man were not from God, he could do nothing."
  [34] They answered him, "You were born in utter sin, and would you teach us?" And they cast him out.
  [35] Jesus heard that they had cast him out, and having found him he said, "Do you believe in the Son of man?"
  [36] He answered, "And who is he, sir, that I may believe in him?"
  [37] Jesus said to him, "You have seen him, and it is he who speaks to you."
  [38] He said, "Lord, I believe"; and he worshiped him.
  [39] Jesus said, "For judgment I came into this world, that those who do not see may see, and that those who see may become blind."
  [40] Some of the Pharisees near him heard this, and they said to him, "Are we also blind?"
  [41] Jesus said to them, "If you were blind, you would have no guilt; but now that you say, `We see,' your guilt remains.
 
[1] As he passed by, he saw a man blind from his birth.
[2] And his disciples asked him, “Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?”
[3] Jesus answered, "It was not that this man sinned, or his parents, but that the works of God might be made manifest in him

This passage always calls to mind people I have known over the years who have been told by others that their sufferings (or especially those of their children) are always the result of sin in their lives.

While this can be true, in light of passages like Exodus 20:1-4, and 2nd Samuel 12:1-24, obviously, according to the very words of Our Lord in this passage, to allege so without a direct proclamation from God is erroneous.

It is my own belief that our most holy faith offers the best (and most scriptural!) concept of dealing with human suffering of any religion.

Our Lord’s compassion for this particular man and His teaching concerning his affliction just reinforce this all the more.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top