Cafeteria Catholics are getting it worse than non-Christians

[mschrank]

Luke 12:47

“That servant who knows his master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows. 48But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.”

Catholics who choose to take Catholic teachings “Cafeteria Style”- that is, accepting the nice parts like heaven, and rejecting the parts they don’t like, like the sexual and moral teachings, are going to be in a heck of a worse state than any other type of person.

You get no “God points” for going to Church twice a year on Christmas and Easter and having the fortune of being born into the Catholic faith. If anything, your situation is more dire.

Who is going to get a worse time of judgement? A Muslim, Hindu, Animist or Agnostic who has never heard the Word of God, or a “Creaster” (Christmas-Easter) Catholic who has no excuse? I’d even go so far as to say a suicide bomber who honestly believes that God is going to give him virgins in heaven is probably going to have an easier time getting into heaven than a Catholic who knows what the Bible says, but sleeps around, supports abortion and contracepts.

“But I’m a nice person”

Which builds on to the next point. Christianity doesn’t put much stock in niceness. It’s really quite irrelevant, although people who are good most often are nice (but not always). Nice has to do with pleasantness. Sleeping with a $5500 an hour prostitute like the (ex) Governor of New York is probably pretty nice. Having a good meal is nice too. Cats feel nice when you pet them. You might say your friend is “nice” to hang out with, because he tells funny jokes and picks up your bar tab.

The niceness of something has no bearing on its goodness. Sleeping with a $5500 hooker is BAD, even though it’s nice. A thing is good as so far as it conforms to its function. A good knife is a knife that doesn’t get chipped and cuts well. A good human being is one that conforms to its function, that is, knowing, praising and glorifying God.

Of course, maybe this is wrong, and just the twaddle of some “drunken Jews” (someone I know who calls themself Catholic). Then why be Catholic at all?

 

[savienu]

I agree. In fact I said to this my mother the other day, when she said she doesn’t agree with the church’s teaching on IVF among other things, but claims to be against abortion. I asked her, if she didn’t agree with the Church’s teachings on so many things, why she is even Catholic? I’m a cradle Catholic, but I had fallen away from many years. I’ve only really been a believer for just under a year, but I’m doing my best to follow the teachings, although I surely fail a lot, as we all do. But there seems to be so much disregard today, and this attitude of “As long as I don’t kill anyone, I get to be in Heaven, because God loves me.” I just pray for the Lord to open their hearts to Him.

 

[nobeerinheaven]

It is an act of mercy to admonish the sinner, but it is a grave matter to think God - through his grace - has made you better than the “Cafeteria Catholics” whose religion is more cultural than real. Admonish them in love, not in anger.

 

[dmelosi]

It is an act of mercy to admonish the sinner, but it is a grave matter to think God - through his grace - has made you better than the “Cafeteria Catholics” whose religion is more cultural than real. Admonish them in love, not in anger.

I think the op makes a great point. We are to do our best to emulate Christ that we each are able to in this life. A cafeteria Catholic is certainly not doing the best they can when it comes to the most important thing in our life.

 

[nobeerinheaven]

A cafeteria Catholic is certainly not doing the best they can when it comes to the most important thing in our life.

That’s the point: you don’t know - nor could you know - that this is true. God alone is competent for judging these cases, but you can lovingly try to remind these people of what they ought to be doing, given the possibility that they are not acting on their knowledge of what would be virtuous and loving toward God. However, you cannot say anything more than this is a possibility, and (perhaps) from the outside it seems as though the possibility is actual.

 

[dprewett]

This is my first year teaching CCD, when I began I thought that this was just to back up what Catholic Children were learning at home. I have now come to the conclusion that other than dropping their kids of like a daycare service and going grocery shopping that the parents want nothing to do with the childrens Catholic Education. Do not get me wrong, I am happy to get the chance to reach out to the children and they are now doing well in my class. What is interresting to me is why they feel this is what they want for the kids but not themselves. It was so sad when the parents walked the kids into the church for stations of the cross and then did not take the time to participate in the stations. I know that this seems like a rant and possibly off topic but in reality I now believe that there is a greater need for good teachers than I would have ever imagined. So in conclusion, I feel that a parent being a so called Cafeteria Catholic can have far reaching destruction. Just a thought with no anger attached.

 

[duskyjewel]

We MUST take into account that most Catholics have been poorly catechized. My generation (Gen X) got the “let’s draw pictures of rainbows and Jesus loves you” catechesis. My parents’ generation had parents who forbade them to question the Church, but never told them why, nor did they explain much when asked. From them came the “revolution” of the 60s and 70s. My grandparents’ generation were raised and had families during the Catholic “golden age” in America. They were raised under an extremely strict form of Catholicism, with a very authoritarian structure. They were given commands and they obeyed, thinking that was the way to Heaven. When their children asked questions, they told those kids never to question the Church.

The American Church, even without counting active dissenters in the power structure, has not done a good job of educating Catholics as to their own beliefs, nor of explaining why we have those beliefs and where they come from. This is why Evangelicals can stump so many Catholics with a simple Bible quote, which usually does not disprove the Catholic view anyway. But the Catholic doesn’t know that. I think being charitable requires that we must take into account that, even if people seemingly know what the Church teaches, they may not know the origins of the belief or the seriousness of the issue.

I think we must strive for better education, and offer it compassionately. We must encourage adults to learn more about their faith. I have only learned so much because I have actively sought it out on my own and found good resources. (Other parents in my parish seem to think I am so well-educated. I usually tell them there is a hundred times more stuff that I don’t know than what I do. Then I tell them to look up Catholic Answers! )

I don’t know what God will do with “cafeteria Catholics” on the judgement day. Wait, actually, I do. He will judge them individually, based on His own criteria, and determine whether they were in error or were just being rebellious and refusing to follow rules they knew and understood. There is a huge difference.

 

[turtle18]

I agree with you. The sad thing is the Church teaches that to know the full truth and then turn away from it is far worse for someone to not have known the full truth at all…i.e. Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Muslims, etc. So it is ironic to say the least.

 

[savienu]

Duskyjewel, you are very right! I for one have learned more about my Catholic faith in the last year of independent study and research than I did in my fourteen years of Catholic schooling. Not for anything, but most of my religious education teachers were not very versed in the faith themselves- one of them was even a Protestant. (Not condemning Protestants here, just saying that they won’t be able to adequately explain and a teach a faith they don’t ascribe to.)

So the question then becomes: what can we do about this? Is there anything we can do about this?

 

[dprewett]

I have an idea, if everyone would get involved with the religious education programs at their parishes after 2 generations things would change. I hear lots of catholics on this forum that have the knowledge to make a huge difference. I wish every CCD class had 5 teachers per 5 students.

 

[savienu]

Dprewett, that’s a really good idea. I really feel like God has been nudging me to volunteer for the faith formation, as they are looking for leaders right now in my Parish. I’ll be praying about it.

 

[Island_Oak]

A cafeteria Catholic is certainly not doing the best they can when it comes to the most important thing in our life.

I feel much “safer,” supported and encouraged struggling within the doors of the church than being outside of it. If someone takes note of my shortcomings and wants to label me a “CC” so be it, it doesn’t affect me in the least, I know to whom I will answer. I also prefer to see the pews filled with fellow sinners and strugglers–those who fall publicly and privately, but keep getting up and back in the fight–than to see the church empty or populated only by a holy few.

 

[Penny_Plain]

I guess I’ll take my chances.

If I thought any of you wanted to engage in some sort of “discussion,” I’d be happy to. Instead, enjoy your gloating.

 

[goofyjim]

Once again I must disagree. We’re making judgements that we shouldn’t be making. It is NOT our decision on who gets into heaven and we don’t have the faintest clue who is and is not getting there. We may be surprised when we get there and the very ones we thought should have been excluded are right next to us.

 

[Norseman82]

It is an act of mercy to admonish the sinner, but it is a grave matter to think God - through his grace - has made you better than the “Cafeteria Catholics” whose religion is more cultural than real. Admonish them in love, not in anger.

The OP may just be expressing frustration at what he sees.

 

[Scanner]

Catholics who choose to take Catholic teachings “Cafeteria Style”- that is, accepting the nice parts like heaven, and rejecting the parts they don’t like, like the sexual and moral teachings, are going to be in a heck of a worse state than any other type of person.

You get no “God points” for going to Church twice a year on Christmas and Easter and having the fortune of being born into the Catholic faith. If anything, your situation is more dire.

Who is going to get a worse time of judgement? A Muslim, Hindu, Animist or Agnostic who has never heard the Word of God, or a “Creaster” (Christmas-Easter) Catholic who has no excuse? I’d even go so far as to say a suicide bomber who honestly believes that God is going to give him virgins in heaven is probably going to have an easier time getting into heaven than a Catholic who knows what the Bible says, but sleeps around, supports abortion and contracepts.

“But I’m a nice person”

Which builds on to the next point. Christianity doesn’t put much stock in niceness. It’s really quite irrelevant, although people who are good most often are nice (but not always). Nice has to do with pleasantness. Sleeping with a $5500 an hour prostitute like the (ex) Governor of New York is probably pretty nice. Having a good meal is nice too. Cats feel nice when you pet them. You might say your friend is “nice” to hang out with, because he tells funny jokes and picks up your bar tab.

The niceness of something has no bearing on its goodness. Sleeping with a $5500 hooker is BAD, even though it’s nice. A thing is good as so far as it conforms to its function. A good knife is a knife that doesn’t get chipped and cuts well. A good human being is one that conforms to its function, that is, knowing, praising and glorifying God.

Of course, maybe this is wrong, and just the twaddle of some “drunken Jews” (someone I know who calls themself Catholic). Then why be Catholic at all?

My. . .some of us are just a littttttttle bit more superior than others, aren’t we?

Can you do the Church Lady Dance too?

 

[melbourne_guy]

I think this joke sums this thread up quite nicely

A man was being shown around Heaven by God. They approached a wall and God said ‘we have to be very quiet here - tiptoe past and don’t make a sound’. The man was confused but did what God said. Later he asked what the deal was.
‘Behind that wall is where the Catholics are’, said God.

‘We had to be quiet because they think they are the only ones here’.

 

[mikew262]

Once again I must disagree. We’re making judgements that we shouldn’t be making. It is NOT our decision on who gets into heaven and we don’t have the faintest clue who is and is not getting there. We may be surprised when we get there and the very ones we thought should have been excluded are right next to us.

Exactly!!! Good points.

 

[dprewett]

Dprewett, that’s a really good idea. I really feel like God has been nudging me to volunteer for the faith formation, as they are looking for leaders right now in my Parish. I’ll be praying about it.

You will not regret it and the kids need your help. Also on a more selfish note, I learn tons from the kids.

 

[JustAnotherThou]

Dear OP,
I am going to relate to you, why I was a “Cafeteria Catholic” (your words not mine) for so many years and I pray that it will make you understand.
When I was in 3rd grade, my parents divorced. For a couple of years, my grandparents picked us up every Sunday to take us to Mass. They also paid for us to attend CCD classes. After a couple years, we moved out of State. We still went to Mass. For about 10 years we were dropped off on the Church steps Sunday mornings and sent in to go to Mass on our own.
During all of these years, not ONE person said anything to us. Not ONE person offered to sit with us (there were typically many seat available near us, even though the parish was pretty full). The priest never said more than 2 words to us outside of communion, confession or CCD. I do remember once when I was about 10 years old a CCD teacher did chided me for not attending mass 1 Sunday.
As a previous poster stated, in CCD, we were taught how to color pretty pictures of rainbows and lambs, we were taught that Jesus loves us and forgave our sins. That is pretty much about it.
Fast forward to my college years. Due to my circumstances growing up, I missed Confirmation. So when I entered college, I decided I would get confirmed. I went to my college parish, sighed up for classes. I was the only one. I attended 4 classes with a nice lay person. Was given a book to read, told to show up at the Archdiocese at on so and so date and with a Sponsor. Whala!!! I was confirmed!!!
After that I progressively quit attending Mass every Sunday. My rationale: 1) no one really showed they cared if I was there or not (with the exception of that CCD teacher that chided me for missing when I was 10 years old) 2) I didn’t understand 99% of my faith, I did understand that Jesus loved me and would forgive my sins (thanks to my many CCD teachers through the years) 3) I honestly don’t think anyone knew if I was there or not.
I will tell you, that I KNOW that Jesus was with me during all of this time, even when I was your “Cafeteria Catholic”. I thank God that he was there with me, if he wasn’t I might have joined a Cult or something!!!
During this time, the Church lost 2 of 3 of their children. Who is to blame?? Is it those children? Was it the Priest that for what ever reason did not talk to these children? Was it the 100’s of parishioners that watched these children attend Mass all alone every week, and chose not to sit next to them or take them under their wings? Was it the parents that felt they were abolished from the Church due to their divorce?
I appreciate that you are worried about this situation. I do not see where you mentioned in your post what you hope to do about your concerns. I PRAY that you will do more than post on here about it. I pray that you will keep an eye out for that “cafeteria catholic” and reach out to them, no matter if they are 10 or 50. I pray that you will sit next to that person that you are so afraid is “going to get a worse time of judgment”. I pray that you pray for all of those you are concerned about. I pray that you see Jesus in all of those you criticize. I pray that you teach the children (of all ages) about their faith. I pray that you say hello and welcome to that new face you see in the pew a few rows ahead of you. I pray that you offer kind words to those who are struggling with understanding their faith. I pray that you pray for the Church. I pray that you pray for the Priest so that they may have time to get to know those lost children sitting in their pews. I pray that Jesus treats those lost children kinder than you believe he will. I pray that you pray for all of the children the Church has lost. I pray that you pray for all the “non-cafeteria Catholics” that watched those children attend Mass alone and did nothing about it.
Peace be with you!!!