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DrStachys
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You are absolutely wrong. While it might have been more accurate to say âEastern Catholicâ rather than âOrthodoxâ, comments like yourâs are terribly problematic and are no way supported by the Catholic Church. Quite the opposite in all actuality.
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MorEphrem
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Dear DrStachys, I believe that poster recanted the fallacious idea a few pages ago.
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Aramis
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Because 4 of the last 5 popes have said itâs good to be aware of the diversity of Rites. Albeit, the most recent has not said so as pope.
And also because the local Chaldean parish or Melkite Parish is every bit as Catholic as the OF parish, and MORE Catholic than the local SSPX chapel⌠seeing as how unlike the SSPX, they donât have the issue of being suspended ad divinis.
Most Romans are dangerously unaware of the actual diversity of the Church with its many Rites - 6 Major Rites (Roman, Alexandrian, Antiochene, Armenian, Byzantine, Syrian), over a dozen Minor Rites within those 6 (including the western Rites in use of Latin, Bragan, Mozarabic, Ambrosian, Dominican, Carthusian; also including three byzantine Traditions of Syro-Byzantine, Greko-Byzantine, and Slavo-Byzantine; also including the Syrian and Antiochene Traditions of the Assyrian, Syrian, Maronite, Syro Malabar, and Syro-Malankara, and the Alexandrian Traditions of Coptic and Ethiopian), with the Byzantines having multiple recensions within each tradition, and the Ethiopians and Eritreans being argualbly separate recensions⌠and most churches having at least two forms of liturgy in use (albeit, excepting the Romans, their use is calendrical, not parish choice)âŚ
One should, at the least, be AWARE that the diversity exists, and not leap to rash judgements grounded in ignorance of them.
The ideals of the Unions of Brest and of Uzhhorod had as their ideal of, and ordered by the popes in the treaties to, Add nothing, subtract nothing, change nothing. Aside from the papal commemorations, we are supposed to look like, pray, and believe like our parallel orthodox churches, and retain our unique theologies as well. And yet, we are fully Catholic. (Itâs not really our fault that they have drifted; synodal schisms do that.)
The Byzantine Cross is not an âOrthodox Crossâ. Itâs a Byzantine Cross, used by the Byzantines of the Eastern Orthodox Communion and by the Byzantine Catholics aka Greek Catholics as our cross of choice.
The scandal should be that Romans donât know about us, not that a Roman wears a cross like ours.
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patrick457
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He probably didnât die looking calm and serene and with no trace of blood or bruise on Him either, but most crucifixes show exactly that.
I mean, we arenât even totally sure what the exact shape of Jesusâ cross was, so all we have are peopleâs ideas of what it looked like.
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99th_Monkey
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These are really beautiful.
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johnthebaptist2
Guest
I still say that a plain wooden cross,is what Jesus die on,and that is what one should wear, because in Christian times, they wore a circle of the roman empire,but on the back they craved a cross, to show that were devoted to the love of Jesus,but if they were found with this symbol on the back,they were crufixfided . So why are we making a big Issue over the Orthodox Cross,because we older catholic,s will only wear the regular design Crosses,I don,t need to wear a differtant design cross to show how much I love Jesus,my love for him comes from my Heart.
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aeposada89
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Okay, I think I have to provide my thoughts here, John.
On the one hand, you initially realized your mistake, and apologized. Problem should have ended right there.
On the other hand, I noticed that others continued to make comments critical of your remarks and was about to comment on those in your defense; but then, you chose to reiterate your mistaken understanding.
I donât think that is the right thing to do.
On this issue, as a Latin Rite Catholic, I would just like to say to all of our Eastern brothers, that I apologize for the misunderstandings on behalf of your family in Christ from the West.
I recently discovered the Byzantine Rite, and am convinced God wanted me to see the One True Faith expressed as it was in Eastern Rome (what we today call, âByzantiumâ). The Liturgy is a beautiful expression of Faith that brings the spiritually profound Eastâs fruits to the forefront, through amazingly spiritual chant and song.
As far as the crosses/crucifixes are concerned, John, you are right IN THIS sense; if you find yourself more drawn to Christ with a Western style crucifix, that is what you should wear. Similarly, if others are more drawn to Christ with an Eastern crucifix or cross, they should wear that.
Itâs basically personal preference. One thing I will note is the incredible symbolism of the third âbarâ (the pedestal to which Christâs feet are nailed), for which I have heard two explanations (Eastern friends, I would love clarification on if it is âeither/or,â or âand/orâ.):
Explanation one: The slanted pedestal represents the destinations of the two thieves crucified with Jesus. The repentant thief, going to Paradise, is symbolized by the âupwardâ slant, while the unrepentant thief, condemned, is symbolized by the âdownâ slant.
Explanation two: Since Jesus took on the sins of all the world during the Passion, the weight of all the worldâs sins is symbolized by a slanted pedestal, which was âslantedâ by the âweightâ of sin being borne by Christ âpushingâ the pedestal out of proper positioning.
Iâm not suggesting these are mutually exclusive, but would love some clarification/comments/any other symbolism to be found from our Eastern Rite brothers.
Overall though, I think the differences between East and West, from a cultural standpoint, have to do with our focus.
The Westâs systematic approach tends towards the academic, and reconciling philosophy with the Faith to defend it against those who would try and mislead/confuse the faithful. Hence, St. Augustine/St. Thomas Aquinas (2 of my favorite Latin Doctors).
The Eastâs very spiritual approach tends towards the mystical, and advancing the prayer life of the Christian in such a way that is not able to truly be âexplainedâ in the sense that Western society would perceive, but must, in a sense, be âexperienced.â Hence, St. Antony of the Desert/St. Athanasius (2 of my favorite Greek Fathers).
I think, rather than fighting and trying to either âLatinizeâ or âHellenizeâ each other, we should come together, and recognize the value and beauty of each Riteâs particular charism.
St. Ambrose is a perfect example of someone who tried to do that; his Milanese Rite (small, but still practiced today), a Western Rite, incorporated many of the Eastern Rite elements he noticed in his travels and experiences with his Eastern colleagues (particularly hymnody-Ambrosian hymns are still used today throughout the West).
I joke about it this way (please understand, this is meant to be HUMOROUS): âThe West doesnât like what it CANâT explain, and the East doesnât like what it CAN explain.â
But letâs remember; before the Church was âWestern,â or âEastern,â it was ROMAN. It spanned from Western Rome (all the way into modern-day Western Europe, like France and Britain) to Eastern Rome (in some areas, all the way into Syria, Bulgaria, and Russia).
The reason we are Roman Catholics, is that âRomeâ and âUniversal (i.e., âCatholicâ)â used to be almost synonymous terms. Rome spanned what was (at that time) almost the ENTIRE world.
We are all Romans. East and West.
In Christ,
Alex
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Thomas_White
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Would anyone know where I could find a good pair of Roman Catholic shoes?
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otjm
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Preach it, brother!
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otjm
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âTo each, his own!â said the old lady, as she kissed the cowâŚ
What suits you is fine, as there is room for more than one opinion. As to what other Catholics wear, as Aramis pointed out, Roman Catholic knowledge of our Eastern brethren, both those in union and those not in union, is horribly lacking. And that may have more to do with what people wear than anything.
And by the way, there is also the Cross of San Damiano.
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thequeen
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I agree with you LightBound I have a cross that was given to me by the Ukrainian Orthodox Bishop over twenty years ago when I was going through chemo. He would come and visit me at the hospital when my own priest could not be availableYour post is rather offensive and shows you are in need of education regarding the Eastern Catholics and the Orthodox. Neither are a âdifferent religionâ and the Orthodox do not have âstrange godsâ.
Hereâs a link to get you started: catholic.com/quickquestions/are-eastern-masses-valid-should-catholics-receive-communion-at-them
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KidCatholic1
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I agree, it is a very nice looking cross. I would use it, but people might mistake me for an Orthodox Catholic since there are Orthodox churches near in my area; they are brothers and sisters of the faith, too!
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thequeen
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You are part of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church and you are in communion with Rome By the way I visit a Byzantine Catholic Parish about once a month or so. A bishop from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church told me about the Byzantine Catholic Church that is not far from where I live.
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Thomas_White
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Back in the â50âs when I was in elementary school there was an Orthodox Church not far from our school and Roman Catholic Church. This was of course during the pre-Vatican II era.
The good Sisters more than once told us we could attend Sunday services there in fulfilment of our Sunday obligation.
The good Sisters more than once told us we could attend Sunday services there in fulfilment of our Sunday obligation.
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Peter_J
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Yes, if you have permission from the crossâs owner.
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