Can Catholics be Democrats?

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pnewton said:
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josh987654321:
How can one stand up for life in other regards and not do something so simple and so fundamental for the cause as to vote pro-life?
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This year, it was pretty tough. I voted third party myself. There was not major candidate that showed much consistency at all on life issues. Trump was a shaky, political anti-abortion candidate, but weak on other life issues. Then there was Hillary the Terrible.
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I see your point. Trump was a pretty unabashed pro-choice-er until he became a candidate for President. I think most would assume that his solidification on pro-life views is a matter of political expediency rather than one of genuine belief.

And, of course, Hillary’s views on the matter are much easier to cite and much more consistent.

If a bill to ban abortion ever came across his desk, I have very, very serious doubts he’d sign it. Even with Ryan and McConnell in each ear.
 
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Victorygirl,

Frankly, I truly believe that JESUS would have been a democrat.

Jesus would have charitably chided and tried to channel the Republican party, a political entity filled with hypocrisy, false moral equivalences, and possessing a central core devoid of any legitimate feelings of social justice and fairness for those born with traits that may compromise them in the ability to compete successfully with others in society in general, into a more accepting Christian posture when dealing with those who have less in this world and who are in need.

All you have to do is look at the man they have put in the white house to garner a good idea of where that party is today.

Look at the moral vacillations and ridiculous logical machinations they spout to justify the pedophilia of ROY MOORE for instance, comparing his predation of a 14 year old girl to the scenario surrounding Joseph and Mary!!

Contrary to what was said by some up above, this discussion CANNOT be had absent the political context we live in today.

The fruits of the Republican party are on display daily and they are troubling.

I am PRO LIFE and a PROUD democrat. Yes you can be both and very very easily.

I cannot conceive of any scenario where I would ever support a Republican for office (although at this point GW Bush is looking pretty good) given the parties lack of empathy for the kind of people that JESUS would have been seen associating with in his time.

Abortion is a particular sore point with me when it comes to dealing with Republican Hypocrisy and duplicitousness.

They will scream to high heaven about the right to life and then abandon the child once it is born, choosing to withhold support because of their sanctimonious distaste for “entitlements” and social programs meant to alleviate the suffering of those less fortunate. (I assure you most senior citizen Republicans are on social security and medicare, programs initiated by Democrats)

By the way, yes I did vote for CLINTON and would do it again in a heart beat, especially when you consider the alternatives.

Trump is the preferred candidate of the GOP?

That’s the true north of their moral compass??

BTW, you cannot believe that GOD is omniscient and all knowing and take the position that he/she does not know well in advance that someone is going to have a natural proclivity toward homosexuality for instance.

It was NOT a choice I assure you. It was a natural inclination and preference. Every man and woman will have to reconcile themselves with GOD, who I suspect will not be as hostile and cruel as some might believe. It is nature, not nurture.

The DEMOCRATIC party has a very large tent as they say and will accept those that the GOP tosses on the scrap heap of humanity.
While the “religious” hand wringing and pontificating is going on in some republican enclave, the democratic party is feeding, nurturing and providing sustenance and comfort to those in need without judgement or finger pointing.

The bigger question in my mind, is how do the Republican Catholics Justify their position.

I just don’t see how it can be done.
 
billcu1 said:
Hum. Now wait just a minute. I have to look at some things here. Here’s a link.
Code: 
govtrack.us
H.R. 7152. CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1964. ADOPTION OF A … – House Vote #182 – Jul…

unknown 289/126. House Vote #182 (1964). Jul 2, 1964.

It looks like maybe the dems and republicans in the house were half and half on party here. I am looking into this. Maybe there were dems voting. I’ll find out here.

More dems voted no than rep. And more Dems voted yea than rep. Just looking at numbers.
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And this vote happened before the George C Wallace Shenanigans.

The Dems States that voted NO that are now Reps States are from the Southern States:

Alabama, Louisana, Arkansas, Mississippi, Florida, South Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia, Kentucky, North Carolina.
 
Republicans had to be dragged kicking an screaming to the concept. It was part of Roosevelt’s NEW DEAL!!
 
htorres11 said:
They will scream to high heaven about the right to life and then abandon the child once it is born, choosing to withhold support because of their sanctimonious distaste for “entitlements” and social programs meant to alleviate the suffering of those less fortunate. (I assure you most senior citizen Republicans are on social security and medicare, programs initiated by Democrats)
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And I will echo that sentiment to my last breath.
 
I am PRO LIFE and a PROUD democrat. Yes you can be both and very very easily.
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KUDOS, Bravo Zulu, a voice of reason.
 
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LeafByNiggle said:
They may have voted yes on allowing same sex couples to enjoy the secular benefits of the state’s recognition of marriage without implying that their relationship was actually the same as sacramental marriage and without implying their relationship was not sinful.
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the feds and state could have provide tax benefits in another way. for example they could have created domestic partnerships similar to marriage for tax purposes

imho this is just secularism trying to reduce religion to the point of irrelevancy
 
Vonsalza said:
“The classical liberal valued equal treatment under law as much as liberty.
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the key word is classic.

liberals today are not classic and don’t value equal treatment. look at what is going on in our colleges today. the liberals of today stand for follow our way of thinking or be quieted. even nancy pelosi gets shouted down by her supporters. they are eating their own.
 
Vonsalza said:
I think the best solution would be to remove the concept from secular government. But until then…
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agreed.

imho this would have happened if the scotus upheld religion as between 1 man and 1 woman but that is history.

i also don’t think that was the ultimate goal of why they wanted marriage legalized instead of just a legal contract confirming tax benefits for couples.
 
upant said:
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LeafByNiggle:
They may have voted yes on allowing same sex couples to enjoy the secular benefits of the state’s recognition of marriage without implying that their relationship was actually the same as sacramental marriage and without implying their relationship was not sinful.
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the feds and state could have provide tax benefits in another way. for example they could have created domestic partnerships similar to marriage for tax purposes

imho this is just secularism trying to reduce religion to the point of irrelevancy
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I agree. But it is still not heresy.
 
htorres11 said:
The DEMOCRATIC party has a very large tent as they say and will accept those that the GOP tosses on the scrap heap of humanity.
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Their tent does not easily include those that oppose abortion or homosexual marital union. They might find their numbers swell if they would at least allow for moral candidates to have equal footing.
 
upant said:
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Vonsalza:
“The classical liberal valued equal treatment under law as much as liberty.
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the key word is classic.

liberals today are not classic and don’t value equal treatment. look at what is going on in our colleges today. the liberals of today stand for follow our way of thinking or be quieted. even nancy pelosi gets shouted down by her supporters. they are eating their own.
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We see the same from the GOP, I’m sure you agree. They’ve managed to curb Trump’s stances on social issues quite a bit - no small challenge. And when any republican senator from Alaska voices dissent, their future political career is publicly and privately threatened.

And as to the key word being “classic”, that’s what I was discussing with the guy, so it was pertinent.
 
pnewton said:
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htorres11:
The DEMOCRATIC party has a very large tent as they say and will accept those that the GOP tosses on the scrap heap of humanity.
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Their tent does not easily include those that oppose abortion or homosexual marital union. They might find their numbers swell if they would at least allow for moral candidates to have equal footing.
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I’ll agree insomuch that I absolutely beg for the halcyon days before identity politics became one of the largest concerns in the party. Not a huge fan of the west-coast liberals under Pelosi’s leathery wings that have often dominated rhetoric since the aughts.

I’m much more a fan of east-coast liberals.
 
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htorres11 said:
Frankly, I truly believe that JESUS would have been a democrat.
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no he may have been a libertarian.

http://www.thefot.us/jesuslbt.html
a definition to Libertarian, from the Free Dictionary:
  1. One who advocates maximizing individual rights and minimizing the role of the state. 2. One who believes in free will.
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htorres11 said:
All you have to do is look at the man they have put in the white house to garner a good idea of where that party is today.
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as we see now that the dems are eating their own, the opposition was worse especially from a religious standpoint.
htorres11 said:
The fruits of the Republican party are on display daily and they are troubling
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so is 8 years of liberal control. obama was anti-religion. he mandated all pay for birth control even taxing little sisters of the poor for it. he pushed transgender bathrooms, gay marriage, erosion of free speech, etc. a lot for a catholic to be proud of.
htorres11 said:
Trump is the preferred candidate of the GOP?
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they fought him kicking and screaming and are still fighting him today. we need to drain the swamp of both parties.
htorres11 said:
It was NOT a choice I assure you. It was a natural inclination and preference.
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we all have a cross, some sex, some greed, some food, etc. it doesn’t make it right to engage in it. should a man not able to find a wife be allowed to engage in sex with a prostitute?
htorres11 said:
the democratic party is feeding, nurturing and providing sustenance and comfort to those in need without judgement or finger pointing.
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the biggest scam to date, they use our money to keep control of the poor.
When Jesus says to give to the poor, He does not mandate a welfare department and expanded powers for the tax police. In fact, He repeats the Old Testament commandment against theft (Matthew 19:18), thus putting His stamp of approval on private property. The New Testament also states that, “If a man will not work, he shall not eat” (II Thessalonians 3:10) and that “Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.” (II Corinthians 9:7). God asks for a voluntary contribution of 10 percent of our earnings, whereas Caesar puts a gun at our heads for half of our earnings.
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htorres11 said:
how do the Republican Catholics Justify their position
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the real question is how do the republican and democrat catholics justify their position

Jesus was more libertarian.
 
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