Can Catholics be Freemasons?

[kooldood]

They can be Masons - but Rome has forbidden them to be Masons. It renewed the prohibition of 1738 in 1983, following some uncertainty as to whether Catholics were still forbidden to join the Masons. (The Church of Scotland forbade its members to be Masons in 1736.)​

Hey, no making fun of my posts. I cant help it if I am grammatically challenged.

 

[kooldood]

I am a freemason (recognized Blue Lodge) and have been now for a number of years. I can honestly tell you from my perspective, Freemasonry is not a religion, nor a substitute for religion; in fact all freemasons (at least in my jurisdiction) are instructed to be steadfast in the faith of their acceptance. There is an altar in the lodge where the Holy Bible or other VSL is on display to remind us of our obligation to God. I agree with you that there really is no benefit, spiritual or temporal, of Freemasonry that a Catholic cannot find in the Catholic Church. I’d go father to say that there really is no benefit, spiritual or temporal, of Freemasonry that a person of any religious persuasion cannot find in a House of Worship.

If your joining a Masonic Lodge for spiritual or religious reasons, you’ll be extremely disapointed and will be referred to the House of Worship of your choice.

I know that the Catholic Church does not permit membership in the Freemasons, but I think its safe to say that my lodge is composed of approximately 40% Roman Catholic members, so while they may be considered to be in a state of grave sin, none of them seem to have an issue with it.

Just an honest perspective from a Freemason.

yeah I read about that… you know, about Freemasonry not being a religion or a substitute for a religion.

 

[gamewell45]

yeah I read about that… you know, about Freemasonry not being a religion or a substitute for a religion.

Great; thanks for taking the time to read up on it. If you have any questions, I’ll be more then happy to answer them for you if I can.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I’d go father to say that there really is no benefit, spiritual or temporal, of Freemasonry that a person of any religious persuasion cannot find in a House of Worship.

If your joining a Masonic Lodge for spiritual or religious reasons, you’ll be extremely disapointed and will be referred to the House of Worship of your choice.

That’s not quite true given what many Masons say of Worship at The Masonic Temple - ha, the “Temple”, no less. Some have postulated that Scotland has a high ratio of Masons because of the “drabness” as they have described it of Presbyterian services in Scotland. They identify more with colorful Rituals in Freemasonry for spiritual sustenance.

Not a religion? Then why the Altars in the Temple, the secret names for God, why Masonic Benedictions performed at Masonic Funerals? Why do so many Christian Freemasons go to the grave with a Masonic Funeral (not Christian) and have the Masonic sign for the Great Architect put on their and their wives’ tombstones. I haven’t seen any Masonic tombstone with a Cross on it anywhere! The GAOTU symbol replaces the cross as if in this, a man and woman’s end to earthly life, the most important thing to be noted is that they were a Freemason and wife, not that they were Christians (i.e. cross, Virgin Mary statue). And in keeping with Masonic humbo-jubmo, they can even put an Egyptian obelisk on their graves since so many regular Masons, unaware of ancient history, buy into the garbage of their older brothers that Speculative Freemasonry goes all the way back to the Pyramid Builders.

Heck I will even quote you chapter and verse from Masonic authors stating Freemasonry is the ultimate “supra-religion”. (ever heard of Windex’s Light Invisible?)

You say you are Blue Lodge? Have you gone into the higher degrees yet and advanced beyond Blue Lodge?

 

[gamewell45]

That’s not quite true given what many Masons say of Worship at The Masonic Temple - ha, the “Temple”, no less. Some have postulated that Scotland has a high ratio of Masons because of the “drabness” as they have described it of Presbyterian services in Scotland. They identify more with colorful Rituals in Freemasonry for spiritual sustenance.

Not a religion? Then why the Altars in the Temple, the secret names for God, why Masonic Benedictions performed at Masonic Funerals? Why do so many Christian Freemasons go to the grave with a Masonic Funeral (not Christian) and have the Masonic sign for the Great Architect put on their and their wives’ tombstones. I haven’t seen any Masonic tombstone with a Cross on it anywhere! The GAOTU symbol replaces the cross as if in this, a man and woman’s end to earthly life, the most important thing to be noted is that they were a Freemason and wife, not that they were Christians (i.e. cross, Virgin Mary statue). And in keeping with Masonic humbo-jubmo, they can even put an Egyptian obelisk on their graves since so many regular Masons, unaware of ancient history, buy into the garbage of their older brothers that Speculative Freemasonry goes all the way back to the Pyramid Builders.

Heck I will even quote you chapter and verse from Masonic authors stating Freemasonry is the ultimate “supra-religion”. (ever heard of Windex’s Light Invisible?)

You say you are Blue Lodge? Have you gone into the higher degrees yet and advanced beyond Blue Lodge?

I think you’ve been reading too many fiction books.

I don’t think you have a true understanding of Freemasonry. “Temple” in this sense has no religiious meaning, in Masonry it means a “place of knowledge”. The “altar” is a place where only a bible or other VSL is allowed to be displayed. Again it has no religious meaning or significance.

When a Mason dies the Masonic organnization has no say on what goes on his tombstone; thats up to the family just as if they want a Masonic service and/or religious service. Many deceased Masons, including many of our Catholic Brothers have both. I know of plenty Masons who have died and have a simple plain tombstone with just their name on it with no cross or other religious symbol on it.

We have no “humbo-jubmo”–as you call it–in our lodge. As a matter of fact, almost everything you’ve mentioned in your post i’ve never heard of before. I suspect you’ve confused us with some clandestined or irregular lodge–there are hundreds of them in the US–thats outside of mainstream Masonry and of course we have no control over their customs or rituals; its quite possible that they might have these so-called Gods and supra-religion you mention but I cannot confirm nor deny your allegations regarding that.

Finally, to answer your question, I am only in Blue Lodge. Thats where the bulk of Masons are.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I think you’ve been reading too many fiction books.

I don’t think you have a true understanding of Freemasonry. “Temple” in this sense has no religiious meaning, in Masonry it means a “place of knowledge”. The “altar” is a place where only a bible or other VSL is allowed to be displayed. Again it has no religious meaning or significance.

When a Mason dies the Masonic organnization has no say on what goes on his tombstone; thats up to the family just as if they want a Masonic service and/or religious service. Many deceased Masons, including many of our Catholic Brothers have both. I know of plenty Masons who have died and have a simple plain tombstone with just their name on it with no cross or other religious symbol on it.

We have no “humbo-jubmo”–as you call it–in our lodge. As a matter of fact, almost everything you’ve mentioned in your post i’ve never heard of before. I suspect you’ve confused us with some clandestined or irregular lodge–there are hundreds of them in the US–thats outside of mainstream Masonry and of course we have no control over their customs or rituals; its quite possible that they might have these so-called Gods and supra-religion you mention but I cannot confirm nor deny your allegations regarding that.

Finally, to answer your question, I am only in Blue Lodge. Thats where the bulk of Masons are.

I am not basing this on Fiction. You state you are only in Blue Lodge so I assume you do not have the most basic idea then of what goes on in the Royal Arch Ritual in the York Rite, or what happens in the higher levels of Scottish rite. Fiction? Well I have a family member in the highest degrees of Freemasonry who froze when I asked him to pronounce the hidden and omnific name of the pagan mongrel deity prayed to in Royal Arch Masonry: JAH-BUL-ON. He froze like a kid because the oaths prevent him from saying the name in full. Up until then I assumed maybe all this ritual was just a joke and not to be bothered with. Just a bunch of old boys’ club stuff.

Perhaps you should look this stuff up since you come on defending the Brotherhood. Look, I will do you a favor and quote from a pro-Masonic source for info. on the Omnific Name for God given in the Royal Arch Ritual (York Rite) to show this is based on reality not “fiction”. Check here please: it’s a Masonic source: masonicinfo.com/name.htm There you have pagan deities mixed with the Old Testament God to make a mongrel god as the Masonic deity to be prayed to. Maybe you are just stuck in the lower degrees and have not come across this personally as I have. Coil’s Masonic Encyclopedia and Mackey’s book on Masonic Ritualism are not fiction but written by Freemasons themselves. Maybe you should read them sometime?

You are Episcopalian? O.K. from the World Wide Anglican Community. Check out the misgivings the Australian Anglican Church has with Freemasonry and the stark decision it gave its members: either the church or lodge. smh.com.au/articles/2003/10/20/1066631355799.html

Or what the worldwide head of the Anglican Church said of Freemasonry: archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2002/12/01/story604770528.asp

Does this appear to you as an Episcopalian as fiction: what the most learned hierarchs of your church are saying, or are you just more smart than they are?

 

[gamewell45]

I am not basing this on Fiction. You state you are only in Blue Lodge so I assume you do not have the most basic idea then of what goes on in the Royal Arch Ritual in the York Rite, or what happens in the higher levels of Scottish rite. Fiction? Well I have a family member in the highest degrees of Freemasonry who froze when I asked him to pronounce the hidden and omnific name of the pagan mongrel deity prayed to in Royal Arch Masonry: JAH-BUL-ON. He froze like a kid because the oaths prevent him from saying the name in full. Up until then I assumed maybe all this ritual was just a joke and not to be bothered with. Just a bunch of old boys’ club stuff.

Perhaps you should look this stuff up since you come on defending the Brotherhood. Look, I will do you a favor and quote from a pro-Masonic source for info. on the Omnific Name for God given in the Royal Arch Ritual (York Rite) to show this is based on reality not “fiction”. Check here please: it’s a Masonic source: masonicinfo.com/name.htm There you have pagan deities mixed with the Old Testament God to make a mongrel god as the Masonic deity to be prayed to. Maybe you are just stuck in the lower degrees and have not come across this personally as I have. Coil’s Masonic Encyclopedia and Mackey’s book on Masonic Ritualism are not fiction but written by Freemasons themselves. Maybe you should read them sometime?

You are Episcopalian? O.K. from the World Wide Anglican Community. Check out the misgivings the Australian Anglican Church has with Freemasonry and the stark decision it gave its members: either the church or lodge. smh.com.au/articles/2003/10/20/1066631355799.html

Or what the worldwide head of the Anglican Church said of Freemasonry: archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2002/12/01/story604770528.asp

Does this appear to you as an Episcopalian as fiction: what the most learned hierarchs of your church are saying, or are you just more smart than they are?

Thank you for your response.

Everything you have described above regarding the so-called Royal Arch Ritual in the York Rite I cannot confirm nor deny since i’m not involved in that appendent body of Freemasonry.

Let me reiterate; Freemasonry is not a religion, nor a substitute for religion; in fact all freemasons (at least in my jurisdiction) are instructed to be steadfast in the faith of their acceptance. I cannot make it any plainer to you then that.

 

[kooldood]

Get back on subject y’all.

 

[Janet1983]

pretty self-explanatory I think. Anyway, as an extension, can Catholics be members of socities affiliated with the freemasons, such as the rotary club?

I know that when I was still in High School we had some members of the rotary club come by and they told us about their fields of study… I talked to the member who studied theology… He was the vicar general of the diocese I lived in and a member of the club…

 

[Doxiemom]

How come back in the 70’s my husband(catholic) was asked to join a masonic lodge by a fellow catholic and my husband got a written letter of consent to join the lodge by our priest of our parish?

He is not now active in the lodge . …but it was a fraternal sort of group who were quite proud of the the number of historical men who were masons and founded our country.

Just a bunch of men wearing little aprons but who take the responsiblity of brotherhood and mutual help seriously.

Whenever this comes up, why, oh, why, do i think that the Knights of Columbus are behind these anti-freemasonry rumors?

I do not accept that my very catholic husband is in grave sin. For what? Joining a brotherhood/ get out of here. that even sounds silly.

 

[Janet1983]

How come back in the 70’s my husband(catholic) was asked to join a masonic lodge by a fellow catholic and my husband got a written letter of consent to join the lodge by our priest of our parish?

No clue… here is a list of people excommunicated by the Roman Catholic Church
It says the following for the 18th century:
“All Catholic members of Freemasonry.”

And this LINK declares the following:

The Church, through its Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, has formally declared that Catholics who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion. This declaration, which is the most recent teaching of the Church, has affirmed nearly 300 years of papal pronouncements against Freemasonry on the grounds that the teachings of the Lodge are contrary to Catholic faith and morals.

Here is the text for the declaration mentioned above (well I also put the link behind the word “declatation”):

Issued by the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith on November 26, 1983.

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church’s decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.

This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February 1981 (cf. AAS 73 [1981] pp. 240-241).

In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this Sacred Congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, 26 November 1983.

JOSEPH Card. RATZINGER
Prefect

• Fr. JEROME HAMER, O.P.
  Titular Archbishop of Lorium
  Secretary

The Catholic Encyclopedia about Masonry (Freemasonry)

 

[TEPO]

How come back in the 70’s my husband(catholic) was asked to join a masonic lodge by a fellow catholic and my husband got a written letter of consent to join the lodge by our priest of our parish?

He is not now active in the lodge . …but it was a fraternal sort of group who were quite proud of the the number of historical men who were masons and founded our country.

Just a bunch of men wearing little aprons but who take the responsiblity of brotherhood and mutual help seriously.

**Whenever this comes up, why, oh, why, do i think that the Knights of Columbus are behind these anti-freemasonry rumors? **

I do not accept that my very catholic husband is in grave sin. For what? Joining a brotherhood/ get out of here. that even sounds silly.

I dont know… Why do you think that the Knights of Columbus are behind these anti-freemasonry rumors??? Please enlighten me.

 

[Doxiemom]

I think all this was politcal and about power from the beginning. Not all popes were about doing just the business of God all the time.

It still is just so silly to be worried about this, much less a real sin.

The knights are just as capable of mis-information as the anti-catholic crowd. Rumors spread on what they think they know vs what really is.

Not to mention group competion.

 

[Doxiemom]

erase erase erase

 

[Doxiemom]

Again, again, church rules. Ugh.

Why can’t we just stick with Scripture?

 

[TEPO]

Again, again, church rules. Ugh.

Why can’t we just stick with Scripture?

What are you talking about?

 

[Doxiemom]

Church rules that is you break them it is a sin.

rules not found in Scripture.

legalism.

 

[Janet1983]

I dont know… Why do you think that the Knights of Columbus are behind these anti-freemasonry rumors??? Please enlighten me.

Good question… I don’t think they are…

The action of the Church is summed up in the papal pronouncements against Freemasonry since 1738, the most important of which are:

Clement XII, Constitution “In Eminenti”, 28 April, 1738;
Benedict XIV, “Providas”, 18 May, 1751;
Pius VII, “Ecclesiam”, 13 September, 1821;
Leo XII, “Quo graviora”, 13 March, 1825;
Pius VIII, Encyclical “Traditi”, 21 May, 1829;
Gregory XVI, “Mirari”, 15 August, 1832;
Pius IX, Encyclical “Qui pluribus”, 9 November, 1846;
Pius IX, Allocution “Quibus quantisque malis”, 20 April, 1849;
Pius IX, Encyclical “Quanta cura”, 8 December, 1864;
Pius IX, Allocution “Multiplices inter”, 25 September, 1865;
Pius IX, Constitution “Apostolicæ Sedis”, 12 October, 1869;
Pius IX, Encyclical “Etsi multa”, 21 November, 1873;
Leo XIII, Encyclical “Humanum genus”, 20 April, 1884;
Leo XIII, “Præclara”, 20 June, 1894;
Leo XIII, “Annum ingressi”, 18 March, 1902 (against Italian Freemasonry);
Leo XIII, Encyclical “Etsí nos”, 15 February, 1882;
Leo XIII, “Ab Apostolici”, 15 October, 1890.

Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith “Declaration on masonic associations”, November 26, 1983

 

[Janet1983]

I think all this was politcal and about power from the beginning. Not all popes were about doing just the business of God all the time.

It still is just so silly to be worried about this, much less a real sin.

The knights are just as capable of mis-information as the anti-catholic crowd. Rumors spread on what they think they know vs what really is.

Not to mention group competion.

I don’t know how detailed the information of the CC is, but in this case I totally agree with the CC… Try “Masonry: Beyond the Light” by William Schnoebelen… He was a very very high ranking Mason…

 

[miguel]

Let me reiterate; Freemasonry is not a religion, nor a substitute for religion; in fact all freemasons (at least in my jurisdiction) are instructed to be steadfast in the faith of their acceptance.

Faith of acceptance is odd terminology. Do you mean that Catholic freemasons are instructed to be steadfast in Catholicism? How can they be steadfast in Catholicism when they are forbidden by their Church from being freemasons?