Can Catholics learn things from Protestants... things they need to learn?

[Cat]

very interesting to read your story… Thanks…

Maybe you should go into more detail and get it published… like maybe as one of the stories in Surprised by Truth… You may know there are 3 volumes or so of that… VERY interesting reading…

If some non-catholics would just read those books… well… i can’t see how they would stay protestant… (oh oh… i just blew it…)

or anotoher way poster could begin to appreciate Catholicism …

he could become Evangelical Free…

Thanks. I’ve actually written it all down.

We did so to have a record of the exact timeline just in case there was ever an inquiry, or in case one of our daughters came forward with…well, let’s just say that we suspected that there may have been some sexual abuse of one of our daughters by someone in that church, as while we were attending, that daughter refused to go into the church unless she was with one of us (mom or dad) or with her boyfriend. She was actually afraid of the church, and the night we came home after the tribunal, she was waiting at home. After she heard what had happened, she screamed out, “I TOLD YOU! All these years, I’ve been telling you that that church is EVIL! We should have quit years ago. You should have listened to me.”

Yes, it sends chills up and down your spine, doesn’t it? I wish we had listened to our daughter, but who listens to a little girl?

Anyway, we kept a record of it all.

A word about the Evangelical Free Church in America, in their defense and FYI.

Please don’t get the idea from my account that all EFree churches are like this one.

We know several EFree churches that are filled with delightful Christians and rock-solid pastors and teachers (yes, Protestant, of course!). These churches do much good, and as one of the readings (the Gospel?) stated a few weeks ago, “If they’re not against us, they’re for us!”

The biggest EFree church in our city partnered with the Catholic churches and the huge Assembly of God church and a lot of little Protestant churches to do the 40 Days for Life Prayer Vigil this Easter. That was wonderful–the EFree church hosted several of the big rallies, which worked out well because their church building is so ideal for hosting rallies (unlike the Catholic church buildings in our city).

That E Free church also has a huge outdoor ampitheater, and during the summer, they host a weekly FREE concert that features some of the top names in Christian music, like Sandy Patti, Michael W. Smith, Glen Campbell, and other groups that are more contemporary (but since I don’t follow CCM, I can’t remember their names! sorry!)

It’s really really nice to attend these concerts–clean, wholesome atmosphere, cheap food, a special program for the children with puppets and singing and crafts–it’s just really special. I miss this–Catholic churches don’t do this kind of thing, and if they do, there’s liquor.

So there are some really good E Free churches. Don’t assume they’re all creepy like the one we attended and were ousted from.

Here’s the scoop–remember it. The Evangelical Free Church in America is comprised of autonomous churches.

What this means is that each church is free (hence the name “Free”) to do as they please within their church. They can preach or teach any book of the Bible that they wish–there is no “liturgy” or “curriculum” that they have to follow.

They can support whatever missionaries or missionary groups that they wish, and they don’t have to give money to support a denominational headquarters or denominational missionaries–it’s their free choice.

They can have a youth group, or not. They can host a home-school co-op, or not. They can have communion services once a month or once a year. It’s their free choice.

They can support the local food pantry (non-religious, but still a great refuge for the poor), or not. They can support local pro-life activities, or not. It’s their free choice.

They are FREE–there is no denominational council or consistory or convention or board to oversee them and force them to offer a certain kind of church.

This is really nice for a local church, as you can imagine. It’s kind of like “Republican church!” No government interference! You get to keep your money and spend it the way YOU like!

However, this “freedom” can backfire. In autonomous churches, a “bad” pastor can lead an entire congregation astray. Hopefully the deacons and elders would speak up and kick the pastor out, but often, the bad teaching happens gradually, and the people become so attached to the pastor that they tend to ignore disturbing little signs, and then they get sucked into some bad teachings or practices.

We believe this is what happened at the E Free church that we attended. We’ve talked to Christian counselors who’ve told us that others have been “damaged” by that church. Something bad is happening there.

Interestingly, at the E Free church that kicked us out, one teaching that was propagated and emphasized was the important of having many children. The Senior pastor and his wife had eight children, and all were homeschooled. The Youth pastor and his wife had seven children. The Head elder had eight children, and they were still working on more. Many of the families in that church had six or more children.

And there were other good things about the church. Some of the people were pretty decent. The kids and their parents were great.

But the big problem was, when my husband and I were thrown out, there was no one that we could appeal to for an investigation. The Senior Pastor is the final authority in the E Free church. There is no consistory or diocese or anyone to appeal to. No one holds the Senior pastor accountable except for his own congregation.

So different than the Catholic Church. When something is not right about your parish, you can appeal to the diocese, the bishop, and work your way up to the very top! Not the case with the autonomous churches like the E Free churches.

Anyway, hope this info is useful to some of you.

 

[nsper7]

This is not a game of who wins and who looses; reject what God has said and you will be in hell; accept what He has said and show it by living it out and you will be in heaven. You have rejected the Word at this point in your lfe; but as long as you are alive in the flesh there is that eternal Hope, but you will not find it in religion as you appear to have sought all your life.

Now, you have really pissed me off. Listen up, you arrogant snot: how dare you come onto a Catholic site and insult the Catholic Church and tell Catholics they are going to Hell for rejecting your flawed and worthless interpretations. You have nothing on your side but your own foolishness and pride. History shows that Protestantism, like all other heresies, was the invention of an individual and it all stems from Martin Luther whose own neuroses caused him to reject the Catholic Church outright and it was only because of the German principalities desire for increased power and the threat posed by the Ottoman Empire that prevented the Church from crushing the Protestant heresy.

You’re nothing, just a foolish Protestant with too much pride to accept the True Church. We don’t want to hear your drivel, just go back to your dumb Evangelical friends and you can all mouth off about how wrong the Catholic Church (and all the thousands of Protestant denominations) is and how right you are, so just leave.

 

[Cat]

That is where the gross error and assumption is made and causes most errors. God is the only authority; which is why no one can understand the Scripture without the resident truth teacher, which is the Holy Spirit; this is why most religious people, whether Catholic or Protestant will be in hell; they never accept nor understand God and His ways.

Voltaire said (paraphrased) “God made man in His image and man returned the favor and man made God in his image and called it religion.” There is so much truth in that and it is heart wrenching. :crying:

To answer your question; you cannot know if I am interpreting or anyone else is, including your own church, unless you have the Holy Spirit leading, teaching and guiding you into His Truth; just as the Bible teaches. Mans teaching is we know the way better than God; just follow us and you will be okay-it is the biggest lie from the devil-look what happened to Adam and Eve.

Do you believe that the Holy Spirit guides Catholics into all truth when they read the Bible?

Keep in mind that what Catholics believe can be summed up in the Apostles’ Creed, which is what Protestants and non-Protestant Christians also profess belief in. It’s straight from the Word of God.

So if I were you, I would be very careful about saying that Catholics are not Christians. You could be coming dangerously close to blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

For those that don’t know the Apostles Creed, here is a copy from a Reformed (Calvinist) website:

I believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Maker of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:

Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost,
born of the virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, dead, and buried;

He descended into hell. [See Calvin]

The third day He arose again from the dead;

He ascended into heaven,
and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty;
from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Ghost;
the holy catholic church;
the communion of saints;
the forgiveness of sins;
the resurrection of the body;
and the life everlasting.

Amen.

 

[CWBetts]

This is not a game of who wins and who looses; reject what God has said and you will be in hell; accept what He has said and show it by living it out and you will be in heaven. You have rejected the Word at this point in your lfe; but as long as you are alive in the flesh there is that eternal Hope, but you will not find it in religion as you appear to have sought all your life.

You have nothing to worry about. I was “saved” years ago as a Baptist. You know, once saved always saved! In all seriousness, I have accepted the fullness of His Truth. I have shown that Scripture alone is a lie. I have shown you how you have taken thinkgs out of context, and now what you have done is commit the sin of Lucifer. In sitting in judgement over my, you have named yourself God,

 

[Hisalone]

Now, you have really pissed me off. Listen up, you arrogant snot: how dare you come onto a Catholic site and insult the Catholic Church and tell Catholics they are going to Hell for rejecting your flawed and worthless interpretations. You have nothing on your side but your own foolishness and pride. History shows that Protestantism, like all other heresies, was the invention of an individual and it all stems from Martin Luther whose own neuroses caused him to reject the Catholic Church outright and it was only because of the German principalities desire for increased power and the threat posed by the Ottoman Empire that prevented the Church from crushing the Protestant heresy.

You’re nothing, just a foolish Protestant with too much pride to accept the True Church. We don’t want to hear your drivel, just go back to your dumb Evangelical friends and you can all mouth off about how wrong the Catholic Church (and all the thousands of Protestant denominations) is and how right you are, so just leave.

So to answer the OP there is nothing you can learn from a Protestant.

Your personal insults should not be tolerated.

 

[nsper7]

So to answer the OP there is nothing you can learn from a Protestant.

Your personal insults should not be tolerated.

His attempting to try and convert Catholics away from the Truth should not be tolerated. Remember, you are a guest on these forums. You don’t see me going onto Protestant forums and condemning people to Hell, which is what JB was basically doing. From the Catholic standpoint, only God knows where someone’s final destination is and, you’ll notice, even in my post passionate posts, I do not start judging the person’s Salvation.

 

[Hisalone]

His attempting to try and convert Catholics away from the Truth should not be tolerated. Remember, you are a guest on these forums. You don’t see me going onto Protestant forums and condemning people to Hell, which is what JB was basically doing. From the Catholic standpoint, only God knows where someone’s final destination is and, you’ll notice, even in my post passionate posts, I do not start judging the person’s Salvation.

So you treat your guests by bashing them and insulting them and then you wonder why we dont want to be Catholic?

 

[nsper7]

So you treat your guests by bashing them and insulting them and then you wonder why we dont want to be Catholic?

I admit I got a little too hot under the collar and I am sorry about that. These are important issues and it is easy to get passionate: for me, when someone insults the Church, I take it as though someone were insulting my mother.

Further, what infuriated me was JB’s judging someone’s Salvation, especially because they were Catholic. If someone came into my house and did that, I’d throw them out pretty darn quickly.

 

[sckcd]

Now, you have really pissed me off. Listen up, you arrogant snot: how dare you come onto a Catholic site and insult the Catholic Church and tell Catholics they are going to Hell for rejecting your flawed and worthless interpretations. You have nothing on your side but your own foolishness and pride. History shows that Protestantism, like all other heresies, was the invention of an individual and it all stems from Martin Luther whose own neuroses caused him to reject the Catholic Church outright and it was only because of the German principalities desire for increased power and the threat posed by the Ottoman Empire that prevented the Church from crushing the Protestant heresy.

You’re nothing, just a foolish Protestant with too much pride to accept the True Church. We don’t want to hear your drivel, just go back to your dumb Evangelical friends and you can all mouth off about how wrong the Catholic Church (and all the thousands of Protestant denominations) is and how right you are, so just leave.

Gee, thanks. That’s pretty nice of you to insult every Evangelical Christian. Leave the rest of us out of your personal squabble. There are fools in every denomination who don’t know what they are talking about or are arrogant or condescending. Believe me on that!

 

[Michael_Francis]

Closed pending review by forum moderator Rachel Malloy.