Can Catholics Vote Democrat?

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estesbob, what do want to see happen? Assuming that Catholics who vote Democratic are not going to change their party affiliation and/or vote for other candidates, now what? Do you want Democratic voters to cease identifying as Catholics? Do you want them to cease attending mass? Do you want their local priest to preach about their poor discernment during his homily?
For Catholics who hold views contrary to the teachings of their Church (in this case vote for candidates who publicly support intrinsic evils, especially abortion, despite what the Bishops say), I would ask they refrain from trying to persuade others to agree with their position.

I would hope they would continue to pray on the subject and continue to learn more about the Church’s teachings.
 
Nobody here condones abortion.
Let see… trying to justify voting for a party that by their own self-admission claims to be the “pro-choice” party. A party that is in bed with PP. A party that has a hardcore record of opposing even the most inhumane practices such as abortion after 20 weeks and partial birth abortion.

Thank God for republicans when they banned partial birth abortion.
And in most states it is republicans who at least put barriers to the human butchery.
 
👍

‘Or they feared the political backlash it would generate’: that hits the nail on the head. Republicans are about power first, morals second. They know full well that they would lose power were they to tackle the abortion issue nationally. They would keep the ‘social conservative’ votes, but lose a lot of others. They only tackle abortion on the state level in states where they have nothing to fear power-wise.

To vote for Republicans nationally just because of abortion is gullible. But that is precisely the vote that Republicans cynically count on. They desperately need the ‘social conservative’ vote, that’s why they always talk about wanting to do something about abortion on the national level. But they will never actually do anything about it for the reason stated above, because they don’t want to lose the other votes.

Nothing in Church teaching says that I am morally obliged to vote in false hope for a party that in my judgment only pays lip service to an issue, morally grave as that issue may be.

As I said before:

In some states Republicans do work on the state level on restricting abortion. Were I to live in such a state, I might in my conscience feel bound to vote for the Republican state candidates, gubernatorial, state senate etc. (depending on judging things the way I could only do if I lived there). On the national level I do not see any compelling reason not to vote Democrat – and I myself do see compelling reasons to do just that.
A Catholic is not required to vote for someone just because they are pro-life-they just cant vote for them if they are not. As far as no compelling readon not to vote for a pro-abortion Democrat on a national level if one wishes to ignore Church teaching there is not
 
I am obliged to do what I think is right and if I believe the girl will die unless I give her my insulin then I have a moral obligation to do so, and the fact that mine is a prudential judgment doesn’t change that duty. If I believe she will die unless I act then I am morally bound to act.
OK, so far 100% of those who have commented have said that the right thing to do is to act. So let’s hold on to that thought for a bit.
This is unacceptably vague. If by “enabling” you mean cooperating with then we have already addressed when cooperation is acceptable.
Enabling is doing something, perhaps unintentionally, but still knowingly, that makes it more possible and likely for there to be abortions. As you no doubt see, I am setting up a comparison between the kind of enabling one does when he votes for a pro-choice candidate, and the kind of enabling that was done in my scenario. I have tried to make the comparison as valid as possible. But let me be the first to admit the comparison is not perfect. In the story, the actions of helping John get to work on time enable only one vote on one bill, whereas voting for a pro-choice candidate puts him in office where he can cast a lifetime of votes. But to balance that, note that my scenario saves only one little girl, whereas I might believe with my prudential judgement that the foreign aid vaccination program favored by the pro-choice candidate could thousands of lives. So that is a difference in degree only.

I don’t know if enabling is right word or not. But whatever the word is that best describes why voting for a pro-choice candidate is wrong, I want to use the same word to describe what John’s neighbor did for John.
. In any event, I cannot do evil that good may come of it so regardless of what the father does I cannot ignore my moral obligation to his child. My sin would be letting her die; I am not responsible for his sin even if saving his daughter allows him to commit it.
This is where the vagueness of “enabling” matters. There is no absolute prohibition against the remote, material cooperation with evil.
How is this different from saying that there is no absolute prohibition against voting for a pro-choice candidate over a pro-life candidate, particularly in light of the insight from the scenario?
 
Nobody here condones abortion. If you say that voting Democrat does that, I would counter that in my judgement voting Republican does nothing less, since that party only pays lip service to the issue, at least when it comes to the big one, making all abortion illegal on the national level.
At the national level, the President does direct how foreign aid gets spent. Reagan instituted the Mexico City doctrine which prohibits non-governmental organizations that receive federal funding from promoting or performing abortions. Subsequent Republican presidents continued that policy, while Democratic presidents ended the policy.

Next, quite hard to get laws passed and avoid them being overturned with the judges Democrats appoint. Voting for a Democratic president gets us pro-abortion rights judges, who are a roadblock to getting common sense laws on abortion implemented.

Next, read this link that attributes a 13% drop in abortion in Texas to a recent law, House Bill 2:
houstonchronicle.com/news/politics/texas/article/Study-Abortion-rate-falls-under-new-Texas-law-5642369.php
Texas Catholics have a choice in the fall between Greg Abbott (R) or Wendy David (D). Wendy Davis, DEMOCRAT, initially filibustered this bill.
So please tell me that law passed by REPUBLICANS was just “lip service”. Looking at the role call vote on that bill, almost 97% of Republicans voted for the bill, and 85% of Democrats opposed the bill. Guess who if fighting in court to overturn the law? Democrats! If the law gets overturned, it will be judges supported by Democrats, quite possibly at the national level!
 
At the national level, the President does direct how foreign aid gets spent. Reagan instituted the Mexico City doctrine which prohibits non-governmental organizations that receive federal funding from promoting or performing abortions. Subsequent Republican presidents continued that policy, while Democratic presidents ended the policy.

Next, quite hard to get laws passed and avoid them being overturned with the judges Democrats appoint. Voting for a Democratic president gets us pro-abortion rights judges, who are a roadblock to getting common sense laws on abortion implemented.
When it comes to the biggie, Roe v. Wade, there is no will to overturn it by the Supreme Court. Just look at what Chief Justice Roberts said in his Senate confirmation hearing: he would not seek to overturn it because “it’s the law of the land”. So you think more Republican-appointed judges would make a difference and the Supreme Court would actually want to take on the issue? Dream on, ain’t gonna happen.
Next, read this link that attributes a 13% drop in abortion in Texas to a recent law, House Bill 2:
houstonchronicle.com/news/politics/texas/article/Study-Abortion-rate-falls-under-new-Texas-law-5642369.php
Texas Catholics have a choice in the fall between Greg Abbott (R) or Wendy David (D). Wendy Davis, DEMOCRAT, initially filibustered this bill.
So please tell me that law passed by REPUBLICANS was just “lip service”. Looking at the role call vote on that bill, almost 97% of Republicans voted for the bill, and 85% of Democrats opposed the bill. Guess who if fighting in court to overturn the law? Democrats! If the law gets overturned, it will be judges supported by Democrats, quite possibly at the national level!
You must have missed my remarks about voting Republican on the state level, where they actually do something about abortion.
 
At the national level, the President does direct how foreign aid gets spent. Reagan instituted the Mexico City doctrine which prohibits non-governmental organizations that receive federal funding from promoting or performing abortions. Subsequent Republican presidents continued that policy, while Democratic presidents ended the policy.

Next, quite hard to get laws passed and avoid them being overturned with the judges Democrats appoint. Voting for a Democratic president gets us pro-abortion rights judges, who are a roadblock to getting common sense laws on abortion implemented.

Next, read this link that attributes a 13% drop in abortion in Texas to a recent law, House Bill 2:
houstonchronicle.com/news/politics/texas/article/Study-Abortion-rate-falls-under-new-Texas-law-5642369.php
Texas Catholics have a choice in the fall between Greg Abbott (R) or Wendy David (D). Wendy Davis, DEMOCRAT, initially filibustered this bill.
So please tell me that law passed by REPUBLICANS was just “lip service”. Looking at the role call vote on that bill, almost 97% of Republicans voted for the bill, and 85% of Democrats opposed the bill. Guess who if fighting in court to overturn the law? Democrats! If the law gets overturned, it will be judges supported by Democrats, quite possibly at the national level!
The only thing that matters is that voting for a political candidate who does not believe the following should be illegal is a grave sin:
  1. Abortion
  2. Euthanasia
  3. Embryonic Stem Cell Research
  4. Human Cloning
  5. Homosexual “Marriage”
If you know the Church teaches it is grave and do it anyway, then it will be a mortal sin.

Currently, voting for many (not all) Democrats is sinful because of these moral issues.

The only time it’s ok to vote for someone with these views is if all candidates share these views, then you must vote for the one who will do the lest harm.

Almost every time you vote for a Democrat, you risk burning in hell. I wish that wasn’t the case, but it is.

If Catholic & Pro Life Democrats all unite and vote Republican to send a message, then perhaps leadership change can happen. But until then… it’s a mortal sin to vote for most Democrats.

Go to Confession and repent like I did for voting for Obama and other pro-choice candidates.
 
The only thing that matters is that voting for a political candidate who does not believe the following should be illegal is a grave sin:
  1. Abortion
  2. Euthanasia
  3. Embryonic Stem Cell Research
  4. Human Cloning
  5. Homosexual “Marriage”
If you know the Church teaches it is grave and do it anyway, then it will be a mortal sin.

Currently, voting for many (not all) Democrats is sinful because of these moral issues.

The only time it’s ok to vote for someone with these views is if all candidates share these views, then you must vote for the one who will do the lest harm.

Almost every time you vote for a Democrat, you risk burning in hell. I wish that wasn’t the case, but it is.
It’s not as black-and-white, see the remarks by the Pope Emeritus that were discussed here, and also the USCCB voting guide.
 
Nobody here condones abortion. If you say that voting Democrat does that, I would counter that in my judgement voting Republican does nothing less, since that party only pays lip service to the issue (for reasons to do so see my post above), at least when it comes to the big one, making all abortion illegal on the national level.
washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2014/01/02/the-rapid-surge-of-state-abortion-restrictions-in-one-chart

Do you think any of these would of passed if Republicans had not had majorities in the legislatures that passed these?
 
The only thing that matters is that voting for a political candidate who does not believe the following should be illegal is a grave sin:
  1. Abortion
  2. Euthanasia
  3. Embryonic Stem Cell Research
  4. Human Cloning
  5. Homosexual “Marriage”
If you know the Church teaches it is grave and do it anyway, then it will be a mortal sin.

Currently, voting for many (not all) Democrats is sinful because of these moral issues.

The only time it’s ok to vote for someone with these views is if all candidates share these views, then you must vote for the one who will do the lest harm.

Almost every time you vote for a Democrat, you risk burning in hell. I wish that wasn’t the case, but it is.

If Catholic & Pro Life Democrats all unite and vote Republican to send a message, then perhaps leadership change can happen. But until then… it’s a mortal sin to vote for most Democrats.

Go to Confession and repent like I did for voting for Obama and other pro-choice candidates.
I wish people understood it so clearly.

They try and twist words of what someone in the Church say in order to justify voting (i.e. condoning) abortion.

For those who say that things are not just black and white I say, there is only heaven and hell. Purgatory is not gray but it is already saved people going purification of repented sins.

To not only condone but also not to do anything about abortion will have consequences.

If someone can’t even grasp the gravity of this human sacrifice that we are experiencing these times then I don’t know… I feel nothing but pity. Nobody knows if they are saved but we do know that certain sins are mortal. Meaning that we die when we commit them. And to condone murder, in the eyes of God, is the same thing as committing murder.
 
washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2014/01/02/the-rapid-surge-of-state-abortion-restrictions-in-one-chart

Do you think any of these would of passed if Republicans had not had majorities in the legislatures that passed these?
Once more, you must have missed my remarks about voting Republican on the state level, where they actually do something about abortion.

I have concluded that it makes no sense debating with people who don’t even care informing themselves about the actual positions of their discussion partners, and instead only preach fire and brimstone even when it is obviously not warranted.

Have a good day.
 
Once more, you must have missed my remarks about voting Republican on the state level, where they actually do something about abortion.

I have concluded that it makes no sense debating with people who don’t even care informing themselves about the actual positions of their discussion partners, and instead only preach fire and brimstone even when it is obviously not warranted.

Have a good day.
What matters is the position of the Church. It obviously conflicts with your politics but that is no reason to get mad at those who have been patiently explaining those positions to you. If you have a quote ftom any member of the magestrium that supports your view please post it.
 
You must have missed my remarks about voting Republican on the state level, where they actually do something about abortion.
But voting for Republicans on the state level can be all for naught if you vote for a Democrat president who appoints pro-abortion rights judges to the federal and supreme courts.

Perhaps Roe v Wade will not be overturned, but what about:
  • late term abortions bans
  • bans on public funding of abortions
  • stricter standards on existing abortion clinics
  • stricter requirements on abortion doctors
  • laws requiring ultrasounds before an abortion can be obtained
  • laws protecting doctors who refuse to provide abortions
  • laws protecting pharmacists who refuse to provide abortafacient drugs
Seriously…these all end up in courts. NEWSFLASH: Democrats appoint pro-abortion rights judges.

Do you not understand that voting for Democrats in national elections has profound impacts on abortion laws at the state level???
 
When it comes to the biggie, Roe v. Wade, there is no will to overturn it by the Supreme Court. Just look at what Chief Justice Roberts said in his Senate confirmation hearing: he would not seek to overturn it because “it’s the law of the land”. So you think more Republican-appointed judges would make a difference and the Supreme Court would actually want to take on the issue? Dream on, ain’t gonna happen.

.
No. Roberts said it was “settled law”. It is…until a subsequent court overturns it. If a person wanted to know the truth, one could look at the partial birth abortion ban passed by the (I think it was) Nebraska legislature. It went to the Supreme Court. The Justices who upheld the ban were Roberts, Alito, Scalia and Thomas, joined (perhaps surprisingly) by Kennedy. Every one was a Repub appointee. Those who voted to allow unrestricted partial birth abortions were the four Democrat appointees.

Case closed.
 
👍

‘Or they feared the political backlash it would generate’: that hits the nail on the head. Republicans are about power first, morals second. They know full well that they would lose power were they to tackle the abortion issue nationally. They would keep the ‘social conservative’ votes, but lose a lot of others. They only tackle abortion on the state level in states where they have nothing to fear power-wise.

To vote for Republicans nationally just because of abortion is gullible. But that is precisely the vote that Republicans cynically count on. They desperately need the ‘social conservative’ vote, that’s why they always talk about wanting to do something about abortion on the national level. But they will never actually do anything about it for the reason stated above, because they don’t want to lose the other votes.

Nothing in Church teaching says that I am morally obliged to vote in false hope for a party that in my judgment only pays lip service to an issue, morally grave as that issue may be.

As I said before:

In some states Republicans do work on the state level on restricting abortion. Were I to live in such a state, I might in my conscience feel bound to vote for the Republican state candidates, gubernatorial, state senate etc. (depending on judging things the way I could only do if I lived there). On the national level I do not see any compelling reason not to vote Democrat – and I myself do see compelling reasons to do just that.
Wonderful post, Al. Thank you. 👍
 
No. Roberts said it was “settled law”. It is…until a subsequent court overturns it. If a person wanted to know the truth, one could look at the partial birth abortion ban passed by the (I think it was) Nebraska legislature. It went to the Supreme Court. The Justices who upheld the ban were Roberts, Alito, Scalia and Thomas, joined (perhaps surprisingly) by Kennedy. Every one was a Repub appointee. Those who voted to allow unrestricted partial birth abortions were the four Democrat appointees.

Case closed.
On that note weren’t the only two Justices who voted against Roe V. Wade the only two Catholic Justices?
 
No. Roberts said it was “settled law”. It is…until a subsequent court overturns it. If a person wanted to know the truth, one could look at the partial birth abortion ban passed by the (I think it was) Nebraska legislature. It went to the Supreme Court. The Justices who upheld the ban were Roberts, Alito, Scalia and Thomas, joined (perhaps surprisingly) by Kennedy. Every one was a Repub appointee. Those who voted to allow unrestricted partial birth abortions were the four Democrat appointees.

Case closed.
The case I think you’re looking for is Gonzales vs Carhart (2007). The 5 seem to be in favor of allowing restrictions on abortions. I think that they’ll only allow restrictions so far, but restrictions are better than nothing.
 
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