Can good strong Catholics really be secular leaders..?

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It’s been said that one cannot serve two masters. *** Do you think it’s possible to be a good Catholic and a worldly leader at the same time…? ***

Should someone even try to lower themselves enough to find this balance point…?
We need good secular leaders (legislators, executives of state, etc.), otherwise this world will go amuck.

The Church states that it is the role of the laity to govern the secular world in accord with divine law. That we don’t have very many good Catholic examples of good political leaders does not absolve us of this responsibility. So, go run for office. Go to the polls. Get involved with the community. Go do something instead of ranting about how it is not possible to be a good Catholic and a good worldly leader. Look forward to the City of God, ***without *** abandoning your post in the city of man.
 
Well, I only addressed the question in terms of “Catholics” because as a Catholic myself, I know that obedience to God and to Church teaching is mandatory. Catholics must follow the rules. This is not to say however that non-Catholics are any less pius than Catholics.

The issue I have is not with being flexible or inspiring people, I’m good at that. My problem is forcing others to do what I want.… Which is what my superiors demanded of me.
Can you imagine an army without a commander? Everyone just shooting when he wants to? A medical resuscitation without a team leader? Everyone pushing medications without being in charge, one person knowing everything which is going into her patient? The patient may have had a better chance at surviving, without the medical team, due to the overdosage of medications? Maybe someone will decide to go retract the radiographs of that broken hip from the radiology department…or not. A school without a principal? Students (and maybe even teachers) doing whatever they want, without regard to learning objectives, and nobody forcing the teachers to teach and the students to be quiet? No one in charge of a school? An orchestra without a conductor? Everyone interprets the music as he or she sees fit, and the audience hears a splendid cacophony? No one in charge of uniform interpretation of the music? A church without a bishop? We go to Mass one day, and the responses are like so. We go to another church next week…well, we don’t have a clue what is going on. The musicians are screeching into the microphone while the deacon is trying to chant the Gospel? There is no one to make sure that liturgical abuse is not rampant. No one in charge of the local church to make sure it is teaching right doctrine with reverent liturgy? And one more: what about families without parents, or with parents who let their children do whatever? No one in charge to make sure their children don’t act like bats out of hades and to teach them the life of the godly? 🤷

We need superiors. Good, godly superiors. Catholics, like all good citizens, should both be subject to the lawful superiors, and if need be, seek these positions of authority themselves, for the good of all and the glory of God.
 
Tepo,
I would ask you to please ponder and pray over these words: the just man suffers for his goodness, but the wicked prosper by their evils. Which of them *truly *gains from their actions? Isn’t sin itself a result of “the end justifies the means” mentality? Think about it. Why did Adam and Eve sin? The devil tempted them with a good; the devil could not sway us, if we were presented with an abject evil. Adam and Eve desired a good presented to them through an evil means. In order to achieve that good, they had to disobey God’s only commandment to them in the Garden. What was the immediate result? They were punished, expelled from Eden, and fell from God’s grace. The end cannot justify the means in the same way that we cannot justify ourselves in God’s eyes. Even though God is our ultimate end, we cannot justify sin as “a means to achieve union with God.” Only goods means can direct us to a good end. Sin has but one end - complete separation from God.
If the struggles and hardships are wearing you down, remember that Christ bore all things for you. Meditate on His Passion and on the sufferings of His Sacred Heart, whenever you can. Don’t give up on Him - He will never give up on you. Only the good truly prosper, for the way of the wicked vanishes. Pray and endure, and all things will be given unto you. I beg you not to fall into the trap of relativism. The enemy’s tactics are the most futile means of attack, for he knows exactly how to turn them back against you. Trust in God. He knows you and your troubles. The very hosts of heaven are ready to defend you, if you put your trust in its leader. I remember you in my prayers. If you persevere in the Spirit of Our Lord Jesus Christ, then you are a Catholic Leader in the secular world.

God love you,
sandomenico
 
Just an aggsaturation.Could a good Catholic priest become a legislator?I don’t think so.
By Canon Law priest are not to hold civil offices:

Can. 285 §1. Clerics are to refrain completely from all those things which are unbecoming to their state, according to the prescripts of particular law.

§2. Clerics are to avoid those things which, although not unbecoming, are nevertheless foreign to the clerical state.

§3. Clerics are forbidden to assume public offices which entail a participation in the exercise of civil power.

§4. Without the permission of their ordinary, they are not to take on the management of goods belonging to lay persons or secular offices which entail an obligation of rendering accounts. They are prohibited from giving surety even with their own goods without consultation with their proper ordinary. They also are to refrain from signing promissory notes, namely, those through which they assume an obligation to make payment on demand
 
We need good secular leaders (legislators, executives of state, etc.), otherwise this world will go amuck.

The Church states that it is the role of the laity to govern the secular world in accord with divine law. That we don’t have very many good Catholic examples of good political leaders does not absolve us of this responsibility .
No it does’nt, and I never said it did. But I believe the Popes latest encynical explained some things about worldly leaders, in that they need to express “Charity in Truth”.
This would not just apply to political or government leaders, but to every single leader of every kind…
vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xvi_enc_20090629_caritas-in-veritate_en.html

Now when I’m expected by my atheist peers and supervisors to act out in opposition to basic things like humility, patience, charity, and the other seven virtues, I’m in essence being asked to go against the call of the Church, which is Gods will.

This was something I was unwilling to do, and now my family suffers for my choice. But it was the right choice.

So I think you can probably come to understand how hard it’s going to be for any Catholic to get into office without abandoning basic virtues at times, thus dismissing the Popes call for Charity in Truth…
So, go run for office. Go to the polls. Get involved with the community. Go do something instead of ranting about how it is not possible to be a good Catholic and a good worldly leader. Look forward to the City of God, ***without *** abandoning your post in the city of man.
No, I’m not going to go running for anything or getting involved like that.

I’m trying to figure out how I can gain regain my position elsewhere, while at the same time balancing the Catholic call for Charity in Truth… I think I just learned first hand how difficult it really is.
 
Can you imagine an army without a commander? Everyone just shooting when he wants to? A medical resuscitation without a team leader? Everyone pushing medications without being in charge, one person knowing everything which is going into her patient? The patient may have had a better chance at surviving, without the medical team, due to the overdosage of medications? Maybe someone will decide to go retract the radiographs of that broken hip from the radiology department…or not. A school without a principal? Students (and maybe even teachers) doing whatever they want, without regard to learning objectives, and nobody forcing the teachers to teach and the students to be quiet? No one in charge of a school? An orchestra without a conductor? Everyone interprets the music as he or she sees fit, and the audience hears a splendid cacophony? No one in charge of uniform interpretation of the music? A church without a bishop? We go to Mass one day, and the responses are like so. We go to another church next week…well, we don’t have a clue what is going on. The musicians are screeching into the microphone while the deacon is trying to chant the Gospel? There is no one to make sure that liturgical abuse is not rampant. No one in charge of the local church to make sure it is teaching right doctrine with reverent liturgy? And one more: what about families without parents, or with parents who let their children do whatever? No one in charge to make sure their children don’t act like bats out of hades and to teach them the life of the godly? 🤷

We need superiors. Good, godly superiors. Catholics, like all good citizens, should both be subject to the lawful superiors, and if need be, seek these positions of authority themselves, for the good of all and the glory of God.
You’re misunderstanding what I’m saying… I’m trying to say that leadership can be taken advantage of when leaders abandon the things they’ve learned from the Church, not that leadership in itself is bad… I’ve seen leaders take on the aspects of animals where the ones with the most power adopt pride filled traits.

When you’re surrounded by pride filled peers, you tend to stand out like a sore thumb when you display the virtues… It becomes a sign of weakness.
 
Tepo,
I would ask you to please ponder and pray over these words: the just man suffers for his goodness, but the wicked prosper by their evils. Which of them *truly *gains from their actions? Isn’t sin itself a result of “the end justifies the means” mentality? Think about it. Why did Adam and Eve sin? The devil tempted them with a good; the devil could not sway us, if we were presented with an abject evil. Adam and Eve desired a good presented to them through an evil means. In order to achieve that good, they had to disobey God’s only commandment to them in the Garden. What was the immediate result? They were punished, expelled from Eden, and fell from God’s grace. The end cannot justify the means in the same way that we cannot justify ourselves in God’s eyes. Even though God is our ultimate end, we cannot justify sin as “a means to achieve union with God.” Only goods means can direct us to a good end. Sin has but one end - complete separation from God.
If the struggles and hardships are wearing you down, remember that Christ bore all things for you. Meditate on His Passion and on the sufferings of His Sacred Heart, whenever you can. Don’t give up on Him - He will never give up on you. Only the good truly prosper, for the way of the wicked vanishes. Pray and endure, and all things will be given unto you. I beg you not to fall into the trap of relativism. The enemy’s tactics are the most futile means of attack, for he knows exactly how to turn them back against you. Trust in God. He knows you and your troubles. The very hosts of heaven are ready to defend you, if you put your trust in its leader. I remember you in my prayers. If you persevere in the Spirit of Our Lord Jesus Christ, then you are a Catholic Leader in the secular world.

God love you,
sandomenico
Thank you for this wise post…! It means more to me than you know.
 
First of all, may we disagree with you without being preemptively set up as violently radical? Thanks for setting up that imagery. Reasonable people might also disagree with you.

I’ve heard it said that GW Bush might be more accepted in future generations than he was today b/c of the “results” he got with his homeland security policies. I sincerely hope that future generations are NOT more accepting of giving up civil liberties for the sake of “gaining” security and safety. B/C as the famous saying goes, if you give up a little liberty for your safety you’ll lost both liberty and safety. You don’t have to be a liberal to be critical of Bush.

I’m sure if you look back far enough there are better choices for Catholic-ish presidents.
Bush made a statement yesterday that he didn’t care if they shot Osama or brought him in alive.Does that tell you anything about Bush’s morals?
 
Ridgerunner: If you didn/t know Bush was Methodist give me one example that would make one believe He’s Catholic.
 
Another thought on leadership

The “Jacobson Goldsmith Theory” of the 1950’s describes three personality types: A, B, and AB. The superintendent of the company I worked for explained his faith in this theory when I hired on, and I may have in fact been targeted as a “B Type”, which I am not. This theory has been proved obsolete in the psychology field almost entirely.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_A_and_Type_B_personality_theory

THIS WOULD EXPLAIN WHY LEADERSHIP USED TO REVOLVE AROUND ONE CENTRAL “INDEPENDENT LEADER”.

The newest and more widely accepted theory in contemporary psychology would be the study of the “Big 5 Factors”… en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits
In the Big 5 theory, the five factors in which human traits can be summarized consists of:
– Openness
– Conscientiousness
– Extraversion
– Agreeableness
– Neuroticism

TODAY THOSE WHO SHOW POSITIVE SIGNS OF “AGREEABLENESS” ARE KNOWN AS “INTERDEPENDENT LEADERS” (a sharp contrast from the outdated Independent leader).

As far as Church teaching goes, I would assume that the Church would reject any and all types of “theories”, since she ultimately makes the claim that the “Holy Spirit”, guides men through “Graces” offered by the Creator.

TO BE A “CATHOLIC LEADER” WOULD BE ONE WHO EXCEEDS BOTH “INDEPENDENT” LEADERSHIP, AND “INTERDEPENDENT” LEADERSHIP… THIS TYPE OF LEADER IS A “UNIVERSAL LEADER”, WHO LEADS WITH THE ACCEPTANCE OF GOD GIVEN GRACE. HE IS IN PARTNERSHIP WITH GOD.
 
Every single Catholic is called to be a Universal Leader, not just at home but more importantly on the jobsite. This is not a part-time faith… This is the best way we as Catholics can blend Charity with real world truth.

Being a Universal leader means that through love of God and what’s good, you put people first. It could mean that you are unswayable on certain issues like abortion, while at other times you might show some flexibility for the sake of others. Universal leaders never put profits or policies as a top priority; instead they seek to blend God’s call for Charity in Truth with real world situations, such as positive work practices, while being careful to never place the law of man above the law of God.

The world needs these types of leaders now more than ever and they should not start from the top down… We need to insert ourselves at every level and from all angles -after all, God is calling on us to take action. It’s not an easy call, and there is no way to calculate how it will impact our personal lives. Never the less, God has addressed us, so we can be sure that it is in our best interest to comply… Perhaps its up to us right now, to prevent animalistic / self-centered cultures from gaining control of the future world, where the common good will be forgotten as well as the Church Herself.
 
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