Can I do Yoga?

[Lost_Wanderer]

Several posts have provided references to Church authority on the subject. You can choose to accept or reject these teachings just as many Catholics accept or reject other teachings. As I said, not my soul at stake here.

Problem: Those references =/= Church teaching. What you and the rest have given so far is your own spin, seasoned with the fallacious appeal to authority.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

I am wondering, theYamas & Niyamas are the foundational preliminaries of Yoga Philosophy befor the stretches:

**Yama refers to the five abstentions: how we relate to the external world. **
Ahimsa: non-violence,
Satya: truth in word and thought.
Asteya: non-covetousness,
Brahmacharya: abstinence, particularly in the case of sexual activity.
Aparigraha: non-possessiveness; non-hoarding

Niyama refers to the five observances: how we related to ourselves, the inner world.
Shaucha: cleanliness of body and mind.
Santosha: satisfaction; satisfied with what one has.
Tapas: austerity and associated observances for body discipline
Svadhyaya: study
Ishvarapranidhana: surrender to (or worship of) God.

Why would demons want anyone to practice non-violence, truth, non-covetousness, abstinance, Non-hoarding, cleanliness, satisfaction, body discipline? It makes no sense.

Yoga is simply a pre-Christian lifestyle with the purpose of bringing the mind to tranquility.

The other limbs besides Body postures and Breathing exercises prove it

Pratyahara : Control of the senses
Dharana : Concentration and cultivating inner perceptual awareness
Dhyana : Devotion, Meditation on the Divine (However one interprets “Divine”)
Samadhi : Union with the Divine

 

[miguel]

…Dhyana : Devotion, Meditation on the Divine (However one interprets “Divine”)
Samadhi : Union with the Divine

“I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have strange gods before me.” The first commandment forbids any fuzziness here that can open the door to our hidden enemy.

 

[miguel]

…You’re strongly implying here that someone can worship Hindu deities merely by doing yoga without meaning to do worship them.

If you are correct, then a Hindu or atheist actor can be playing a devout Catholic in a movie, and by merely saying the words of the Hail Mary with awareness that it is considered by Catholics to be a prayer, hey presto be really and truly praying to Mary. In spite of having absolutely no intention of praying to the Blessed Mother, and no belief even that she CAN be prayed to. What say you - can someone unintentionally and accidentally pray to Mary all the while intending and believing that they are not doing so?

I would say it isn’t completely limited to the intentions of specific individuals. There are other players. We know “Hindu deities” aren’t real. How could they be if there is only one real God? And we know that because the real God has infinite power…power without limit to be precise. If the real God has infinite power there can only be one. For any other gods to exist, they would impose limits on the power of the real God. Then we’re talking about finite gods. A finite god is not a real God. We also know evil spirits are real, because Jesus cast them out. And we know they are “liars and murderers”. Where did the Hindus get their notion of deities? If they are false, we know they didn’t come from the real God of truth. We don’t completely understand how evil spirits operate. We just know they do. Jesus said you would know them by their fruits. Can we pin every bad fruit on evil spirits? No. We don’t see things as clearly as God. We do know from history that human sacrifice has been a fruit of pagan religion. We also know that people were terrorized by this. Were any of these pagan rulers possessed by demons? That’s harder to see. But Jesus certainly confirmed the possibility by casting them out of various individuals.

 

[LisaA]

Problem: Those references =/= Church teaching. What you and the rest have given so far is your own spin, seasoned with the fallacious appeal to authority.

No I was referring to other posters’ links to Church teaching with regard to yoga. You can blow it off if you want. The pews are full of people who blow off other teachings. We’re all sinners and hopefully our desire is to avoid sin once we know what it is and can make an affirmative decision.

There is a webinar coming up with much more detailed information from the Catholic perspective via Living His Life Abundantly. If you or anyone is actually interested in hearing the Catholic perspective maybe you will take time and watch. I used to do yoga frequently. I studied with a Sikh yogi who specialized in Kundalini Yoga (before I was Catholic) but after listening, reading and considering the Catholic perspective I no longer practice. Again it’s your body, your soul. I really don’t care what you do with the information. I just thought that some, like me, were unaware of the Church’s teachings on the subject and might be interested.

Lisa

 

[Michael_Mayo]

No I was referring to other posters’ links to Church teaching with regard to yoga. You can blow it off if you want. The pews are full of people who blow off other teachings. We’re all sinners and hopefully our desire is to avoid sin once we know what it is and can make an affirmative decision.

There is a webinar coming up with much more detailed information from the Catholic perspective via Living His Life Abundantly. If you or anyone is actually interested in hearing the Catholic perspective maybe you will take time and watch. I used to do yoga frequently. I studied with a Sikh yogi who specialized in Kundalini Yoga (before I was Catholic) but after listening, reading and considering the Catholic perspective I no longer practice. Again it’s your body, your soul. I really don’t care what you do with the information. I just thought that some, like me, were unaware of the Church’s teachings on the subject and might be interested.

Lisa

But what about the yoga practices of non-violence, truth, non-covetousness, abstinance, Non-hoarding, cleanliness, satisfaction, body discipline? Surely you have not abandoned those forms of yoga.

 

[LisaA]

But what about the yoga practices of non-violence, truth, non-covetousness, abstinance, Non-hoarding, cleanliness, satisfaction, body discipline? Surely you have not abandoned those forms of yoga.

I don’t practice yoga anymore. The characteristics you speak of are not necessarily the result of the practice of yoga or limited to those who are Hindu.

Lisa

 

[Michael_Mayo]

I don’t practice yoga anymore. The characteristics you speak of are not necessarily the result of the practice of yoga or limited to those who are Hindu.

Lisa

Not the “result of the practiceof yoga” but they are the practice itself.

But I think I know what you mean and I feel the exact same way about the stretches.

That is, they also are not limited to those with pagan beliefs and ultimate intentions.

 

[LisaA]

Not the “result of the practiceof yoga” but they are the practice itself.

But I think I know what you mean and I feel the exact same way about the stretches.

That is, they also are not limited to those with pagan beliefs and ultimate intentions.

Your first statement is patently ridiculous. Everyone who practices cleanliness is practicing yoga? There are many relatively universal practices related to bodily functions that have nothing to do with religion. Washing your hands does not make you a yogini, it just means you are practicing good hygiene.

I think the most reasonable post noted that you can get all of the supposed benefits of a yoga practice; relaxation, stretching, flexibility and balance WITHOUT practicing a single yoga pose. If your objective is to achieve those goals and if there is any question about the practice being perverted even unintentionally, why not just achieve the same goal through other means?

I find the ferocious defense of being able to do yoga astonishing. If all you want to do is work on stretching, flexibilty, balance or strength you do not need to watch a Rodney Yee video or attend a yoga class.

Lisa

 

[miguel]

Your first statement is patently ridiculous. Everyone who practices cleanliness is practicing yoga? There are many relatively universal practices related to bodily functions that have nothing to do with religion. Washing your hands does not make you a yogini, it just means you are practicing good hygiene.

I think the most reasonable post noted that you can get all of the supposed benefits of a yoga practice; relaxation, stretching, flexibility and balance WITHOUT practicing a single yoga pose. If your objective is to achieve those goals and if there is any question about the practice being perverted even unintentionally, why not just achieve the same goal through other means?

I find the ferocious defense of being able to do yoga astonishing. If all you want to do is work on stretching, flexibilty, balance or strength you do not need to watch a Rodney Yee video or attend a yoga class.

Lisa

I read an article on the incompatibiliy of yoga with Christianity several years ago in NewOxford Review…just found the link…the article is partly available online…and the whole thing available for a small fee…
newoxfordreview.org/article.jsp?did=0206-peters

 

[cheezey]

I gave up bowling because it was bad for my wrist. Now I only go “pumpkin-chucking.”

 

[cheezey]

We’re splitting hairs here. The stretching and poses are called yoga. What else should we call it? Maybe it is a difference of yoga with a little y and Yoga with a capital y.

I do yoga. By that, I mean I practice the breathing, the stretching, the concentration, and the posing. We could be very generic and say I exercise… but that could mean I do cardio, or I do spinning, or I weight lift, or any other fill-in-the-blank exercise. I do not practice Yoga, where I am trying to become one with the world or chanting any mantras or paying homage to any false god.

also good…yoga vs Yoga. there CAN be a difference…a non demonic one…
thank you

 

[cheezey]

Our bodies are gifts.

We need to be good stewards of them, care for them and integrate them better into our spiritual lives.

 

[LisaA]

I read an article on the incompatibiliy of yoga with Christianity several years ago in NewOxford Review…just found the link…the article is partly available online…and the whole thing available for a small fee…
newoxfordreview.org/article.jsp?did=0206-peters

Yes very similar to what I’ve read or heard on various Catholic sites.I remember when I first learned that yoga practice is not compatible with being a practicing Catholic I was very skeptical. I was just doing it to relax and stretch and work on balance. It was a way to decompress,a way to unwind. Certain poses helped me get to sleep or helped me deal with tension headaches…I know all of the reasons WHY…and I know all of the justification. But as I learned more I realized I could no longer continue. Even if your intent is just to exercise, having been in many yoga classes, I know that the positions, the breathing, the chanting and music DO lead to an altered state. Believe me, the various poses were not devised as an ancient exercise program but as part of Hindu practice.

Again, if you aren’t practicing yoga, why the defensiveness? The reality is that if you are “touching your toes and breathing” you aren’t doing yoga. There are many other ways to stretch, work on balance and strength without Sun Salutations and Downward Dog or Warrior Pose. If there is a question about your practice, why not find an alternative approach to your physical issues? There are many that were not practiced by Hindus 5000 years ago.

Lisa

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

There are many relatively universal practices related to bodily functions that have nothing to do with religion.

Exactly, so your problem with people taking up those neutral positions and just happen to slap on the yoga label is… where?

And no, don’t give me the ‘Why call it Yoga?’ card. I might as well ask in turn, why NOT keep calling it yoga. It’s a circular debate that doesn’t go anywhere. All your proving is the stability of human language gets moot at some point.

Yoga, as popularly understood, is valid and can be stripped of religious/pagans ties.

End.

of.

Story.

I find the ferocious defense of being able to do yoga astonishing.

I find the religious fervor condemning it reminiscent of Puritan witch hunters. I’d love to do this all day but…

If all you want to do is work on stretching, flexibilty, balance or strength you do not need to watch a Rodney Yee video or attend a yoga class.

Right, just as you don’t need to watch Bruce Lee or take lessons from an old sensei just to punch and kick.

 

[LisaA]

Exactly, so your problem with people taking up those neutral positions and just happen to slap on the yoga label is… where?

And no, don’t give me the ‘Why call it Yoga?’ card. I might as well ask in turn, why NOT keep calling it yoga. It’s a circular debate that doesn’t go anywhere. All your proving is the stability of human language gets moot at some point.

Yoga, as popularly understood, is valid and can be stripped of religious/pagans ties.

End.

of.

Story.

I find the religious fervor condemning it reminiscent of Puritan witch hunters. I’d love to do this all day but…

Right, just as you don’t need to watch Bruce Lee or take lessons from an old sensei just to punch and kick.

I don’t have a problem with you doing whatever you want or calling it whatever you want. I don’t see any “Puritan witch hunts” on practicing yoga either but you are welcome to gin up what seems like a pretty reasonable debate into a historical event. What I find interesting are two approaches: I’m doing yoga but I’m not because I’m just exercising…or I’m exercising but I’m not doing yoga…but I defend the right to do yoga just in case I really am. The logic is about as contorted as some of the poses I used to hold.

The only reason I weighed in on the discussion was to explain my own evolution from being a relatively serious practitioner of yoga in the past to no longer engaging in the practice after reading, listening and gaining a better understanding of both my faith and how it’s incompatible with practicing yoga.

It’s your life and your soul and your state of mind. Isn’t free will a great thing!

Lisa

 

[miguel]

Yes very similar to what I’ve read or heard on various Catholic sites.I remember when I first learned that yoga practice is not compatible with being a practicing Catholic I was very skeptical. I was just doing it to relax and stretch and work on balance. It was a way to decompress,a way to unwind. Certain poses helped me get to sleep or helped me deal with tension headaches…I know all of the reasons WHY…and I know all of the justification.

It was suggested to me by a marriage counselor. I had just read this article and I mentioned some of the concerns. At that point, yoga was becoming quite a fad. And I was challenging conventional wisdom. Needless to say, I was outnumbered. But you know, being outnumbered is kinda fun.

Again, if you aren’t practicing yoga, why the defensiveness?

I think if the Catholic Church was in favor of yoga, yoga would have alot of critics.

 

[LisaA]

It was suggested to me by a marriage counselor. I had just read this article and I mentioned some of the concerns. At that point, yoga was becoming quite a fad. And I was challenging conventional wisdom. Needless to say, I was outnumbered. But you know, being outnumbered is kinda fun.

I think if the Catholic Church was in favor of yoga, yoga would have alot of critics.

No kidding! Much more fun to be ants at the picnic isn’t it If the Church is for it, I’m against it!

Actually serious practitioners of yoga find quite laughable the American theory that it’s just exercise. That was never the intent of the practice.

Lisa

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Your first statement is patently ridiculous. Everyone who practices cleanliness is practicing yoga? There are many relatively universal practices related to bodily functions that have nothing to do with religion. Washing your hands does not make you a yogini, it just means you are practicing good hygiene.

Then what *does *make you a yogini?

Then why must stretching in this organized method have to do with only the specific pagan Hindu religion?

I have been defending it because I have been doing it for nearly 40 years and it has been nothing but a blessing for my body, my mind, and my spirit. These stretches and these postures without the philosophy, without the Hindu belief, without the pagan religion have provided nothing but benefit to me. And while more serious practitioners of yoga may find my practice laughable, I will let them laugh. The fact is, they do not own it, nor does Hinduism, any more than they own the body.

My yoga practice is also my prayer, just as kneeling, fasting, genuflection, Sign of the Cross and prostration have their place in prayer. The Dangers warned about deal with belief, intention, world view, and self view. If these remain Catholic, as they have done for me, then Christ is with me in this discipline. It is a real and meaningful way to offer my body to the (Catholic) Lord in a prayer of the body.

Blessings and peace.

Enough said from me.

 

[LilyM]

No kidding! Much more fun to be ants at the picnic isn’t it If the Church is for it, I’m against it!

Actually serious practitioners of yoga find quite laughable the American theory that it’s just exercise. That was never the intent of the practice.

Lisa

This is a circular argument - I bet your definition of ‘serious practitioner’ would very conveniently exclude someone like Mr Mayo here who has been doing the thing for at least as long as most Hindus or others. Why? Because it doesn’t suit you or them to believe that someone with an other-than-Hindu spirituality can be serious practitioner.

Why? On what basis do you or anyone declare yourselves (but not Mayo apparently) authorised to decide who is defined as a ‘serious practitioner’ or not?

I mean Eastern martial arts are most all deeply rooted in Eastern spirituality. Kung fu is strongly connected with Buddhist monks and nuns, for example. I doubt, however, that you would dare say that one cannot be a ‘serious practitioner’ of Kung fu without buying into Buddhist spirituality.