Can my parents take away a scholarship opportunity?

[Luna_Lovecraft]

Are there really parents who are that controlling?

My husband’s brother still lives in the parental home despite the fact that he’s almost 40, has advanced academic degrees, and has his own professional practice. Parental conniptions kept him at a local university BA-PhD so he could live at home. Mom and dad presented him with a choice of majors when he started college, and his choice (business) wasn’t among them. Tough. He studied what they allowed him to study.

His parents will not allow him to use the washer, the stove, or the oven. Mom has accompanied him on job and graduate school interviews, and mom and dad have shadowed him on dates. Yes, they have sat out in the parking lot while their 30-something-year-old son was in a restaurant having dinner with a woman. The only area of his life he has autonomy is with his money, but that’s because he’s scary smart with finances and investing. So while he’s savvy enough to have amassed enough money to ensure that neither he nor his folks have to work again, they won’t permit him make an omelette.

My husband’s escape was the military, and it was a couple of years before they wrapped their heads around the idea that they were going to have to treat him like and adult if they wanted to have a relationship with him. And so they treat him like an adult. I have no idea why my intelligent, insightful, and articulate brother-in-law hasn’t figured that out.

 

[Joe_5859]

My husband’s brother still lives in the parental home despite the fact that he’s almost 40, has advanced academic degrees, and has his own professional practice. Parental conniptions kept him at a local university BA-PhD so he could live at home. Mom and dad presented him with a choice of majors when he started college, and his choice (business) wasn’t among them. Tough. He studied what they allowed him to study.

His parents will not allow him to use the washer, the stove, or the oven. Mom has accompanied him on job and graduate school interviews, and mom and dad have shadowed him on dates. Yes, they have sat out in the parking lot while their 30-something-year-old son was in a restaurant having dinner with a woman. The only area of his life he has autonomy is with his money, but that’s because he’s scary smart with finances and investing. So while he’s savvy enough to have amassed enough money to ensure that neither he nor his folks have to work again, they won’t permit him make an omelette.

My husband’s escape was the military, and it was a couple of years before they wrapped their heads around the idea that they were going to have to treat him like and adult if they wanted to have a relationship with him. And so they treat him like an adult. I have no idea why my intelligent, insightful, and articulate brother-in-law hasn’t figured that out.

It amazes me to hear such stories. It makes me want to start having my 5yo wash the clothes. I need to strike while the motivation is still there to help. She wants to help with the cooking, cleaning, and laundry. It’s usually faster for me to do it myself, but now I’m going to make more of a point to get her involved. I definitely don’t want to go down that path!

 

[TheRealJuliane]

My husband’s brother still lives in the parental home despite the fact that he’s almost 40, has advanced academic degrees, and has his own professional practice. Parental conniptions kept him at a local university BA-PhD so he could live at home. Mom and dad presented him with a choice of majors when he started college, and his choice (business) wasn’t among them. Tough. He studied what they allowed him to study.

His parents will not allow him to use the washer, the stove, or the oven. Mom has accompanied him on job and graduate school interviews, and mom and dad have shadowed him on dates. Yes, they have sat out in the parking lot while their 30-something-year-old son was in a restaurant having dinner with a woman. The only area of his life he has autonomy is with his money, but that’s because he’s scary smart with finances and investing. So while he’s savvy enough to have amassed enough money to ensure that neither he nor his folks have to work again, they won’t permit him make an omelette.

My husband’s escape was the military, and it was a couple of years before they wrapped their heads around the idea that they were going to have to treat him like and adult if they wanted to have a relationship with him. And so they treat him like an adult. I have no idea why my intelligent, insightful, and articulate brother-in-law hasn’t figured that out.

Oh, I’m sure he has figured it out…He just may not be assertive enough to go against them. He can’t use the WASHER??? At almost 40??? He can’t cook for himself???

:bigyikes::bigyikes::bigyikes:

Unreal. They really clipped his wings, didn’t they???

 

[Cat]

This is a reply to “Cat”. Due to the length of Cat’s last response (and I do appreciate the (name removed by moderator)ut), I can’t include it here.

Your kids were doing their own laundry at 9? I am forbidden to touch the washer, dryer, dishwasher, and all of my Father’s powertools. I put the dishes in the sink. If I want a screwdriver, I have to ask for permission. I use a pushmower to mow the grass and am forbidden to even touch the one that uses gasoline. I don’t have a drivers license, because the thought of me driving is not something my parents can handle.

Make my own doctor/dentist appointments? I would be grounded for a month if I even tried.

My Mother takes me clothes shopping. I have some say in my choice of clothes, but I go shopping when she wants to go.

Do any kind of cooking? My Mother would have a fit.

I do have a part-time job and I have saved most of the money I have earned from it.

I have tried to talk to my Father about assuming some additional reponsibilities, and he said I was still “too wet behind the ears”. This was about a year ago. That comment really hurt me, and I now avoid talking to him if possible.

As for my going into “drama” mode, if you knew me you wouldn’t say such a thing. I am venting on this board because I really have no place I can express my frustrations.

I admit I am having real problems finding a “trusted adult”. Part of the problem is that I don’t think I know how to relate to anyone older. All of you are just authority figures to me. I know that isn’t true, but knowing that and being actually to relate to you are two different things.

There’s more I want to say, but I have to get ready for school.

Thanks for sharing all this. This is a hard way to grow up. Although I am only hearing your side of things, I am inclined to sympathize with you and condemn your parents for their lack of wisdom. They sound dreadful, like something out of a bad movie.

It seems to me that unless you are willing to completely separate yourself from your parents and be very poor, or join the military, you would probably be wise to lay low, swallow your eagerness to be out from under their thumbs, and allow them to pay for your college, since they are willing to do so.

I’m concerned that you don’t have the life skills or the resources to leave home and find your own place and hold down a job. It’s not your fault–your parents failed to raise you up to be an adult.

So it might be wise to stay close to home rather than going away to a college. You have so few “life skills” and a college away from home might be completely overwhelming. On the other hand, if you face all the challenges as “adventure” rather than “trial,” you will have fun learning to do laundry, make a grilled cheese sandwich, and getting on the right bus.

At any rate, I recommend that you take a deep breath, sigh over missed opportunities, and then square your shoulders, buck up, and go cheerfully to the college of their choice–it will all work out. Nowadays, many kids and adults are attending local community colleges due to lack of money, and it all works out–they earn their degrees and get jobs, and that’s the point of going to college. College is what YOU make of it, not what it makes of you . There are people who graduate from the best colleges in the country, and they make NOTHING out of their lives. There are others who only attend a tiny community college who use that education and make great things happen in their lives and for those all around them. Be one of THOSE people.

When you have a degree, you will hopefully be equipped to get a job, and that will enable you to move away from home and begin living life as an adult . In the meantime, seize any opportunity to learn life skills.

And once again, I urge you to seek out an adult and confide in them. I’m guessing that your schoolteachers and counselors already suspect that something isn’t right with your upbringing, no matter how intelligent and charming you are at school. They can sense when someone isn’t being raised properly. So if you were to go to one of your school counselors, they would probably not be surprised, and I’ll bet they would love to talk things over with you and help you to get through this difficult transition period (graduation to college). A counselor SHOULD keep your conversations confidential.

Good luck to you. This is tough. But you can make it through and you will be a better man for having toughed all of this out.

 

[monicatholic]

hi brad,

i’m a mom of 10 children, 5 adults and 4 of them are young adult men. my husband says: we’re not raising kids. we’re raising adults. it took me a while but now i appreciate his wisdom.

here’s the scoop from the catechism of the catholic church:

**2229 As those first responsible for the education of their children, parents have the right to choose a school for them which corresponds to their own convictions. This right is fundamental. As far as possible parents have the duty of choosing schools that will best help them in their task as Christian educators.38 Public authorities have the duty of guaranteeing this parental right and of ensuring the concrete conditions for its exercise.

2230 When they become adults, children have the right and duty to choose their profession and state of life. They should assume their new responsibilities within a trusting relationship with their parents, willingly asking and receiving their advice and counsel. Parents should be careful not to exert pressure on their children either in the choice of a profession or in that of a spouse. This necessary restraint does not prevent them - quite the contrary from giving their children judicious advice, particularly when they are planning to start a family.**

OK, so you’re on the cusp. you’re not yet an adult-- but soon, and it appears your parents may be exerting undo pressure.

…

…

so long as you need either their cash or their signature, it’s their call.

perhaps, though a quick review of the CCC might help them rethink?

here’s what I’m really thinking: you go to the school of their choice. you spend the year studying exceedingly well and growing in grace and wisdom. you spend the year being gracious, grateful and learning how to use a washing machine and frying an egg.

i’m not kidding, here.

then you transfer. when your transcripts are golden and your signature is good, you transfer.

you are obligated to obey your parents so long as you’re dependent on them. when you’re not, you’re free to make your own choices. if they refuse to allow you judicious counsel and offer authoritative dictates instead, then they’ve failed on their end.

if they fail, you forgive them because that’s what’s the right thing to do.

if they withhold a relationship with you “don’t darken my doorstep” and all that jazz, then you forgive them and pray for them that they overcome what would then appear to be emotional blackmail.

in a nutshell: never stay angry and learn how to pump your own gas, iron your own shirts and grill a hamburger. and pray for your parents-- they don’t trust that they parented you well enough.

 

[EasterJoy]

My husband’s brother still lives in the parental home despite the fact that he’s almost 40, has advanced academic degrees, and has his own professional practice. Parental conniptions kept him at a local university BA-PhD so he could live at home. Mom and dad presented him with a choice of majors when he started college, and his choice (business) wasn’t among them. Tough. He studied what they allowed him to study.

His parents will not allow him to use the washer, the stove, or the oven. Mom has accompanied him on job and graduate school interviews, and mom and dad have shadowed him on dates. Yes, they have sat out in the parking lot while their 30-something-year-old son was in a restaurant having dinner with a woman. The only area of his life he has autonomy is with his money, but that’s because he’s scary smart with finances and investing. So while he’s savvy enough to have amassed enough money to ensure that neither he nor his folks have to work again, they won’t permit him make an omelette.

My husband’s escape was the military, and it was a couple of years before they wrapped their heads around the idea that they were going to have to treat him like and adult if they wanted to have a relationship with him. And so they treat him like an adult. I have no idea why my intelligent, insightful, and articulate brother-in-law hasn’t figured that out.

Well, seventeen is not 40, but the OP ought to note that although this is an extreme example of what can happen to a young man who never stands up to his parents on behalf of decisions that need to be his, it is not extremely rare. He ought to also note the contrast with how this fellow’s sibling is treated by virtue of having an adult’s willingness to draw his boundaries like an adult.

Don’t go looking for fireworks, OP, but realize that you have to be willing to hazard some. If it weren’t your parents, it would be somebody. You don’t have to do it today, you do need to be prudent about this, but the day needs to come some time.

 

[Litcrit]

I’m concerned that you don’t have the life skills or the resources to leave home and find your own place and hold down a job. It’s not your fault–your parents failed to raise you up to be an adult.

So it might be wise to stay close to home rather than going away to a college. You have so few “life skills” and a college away from home might be completely overwhelming. On the other hand, if you face all the challenges as “adventure” rather than “trial,” you will have fun learning to do laundry, make a grilled cheese sandwich, and getting on the right bus.

I had very controlling parents who infantilized me as well - I was also not allowed to make myself tea, for instance, at age 18 - and I picked up life skills quite easily once I was out.

I couldn’t believe how easy all that stuff was - washing, cooking, paying bills, even earning a decent paycheck. It was all made out to sound extremely difficult and like something only my parents, the real adults, had any chance of getting right - and all I could do was be grateful they provided these things for incompetent, klutzy me.

Brad sounds like quite an intelligent young man and I’m sure he’ll manage fine once he’s out on his own.

Heck, there are now youtube tutorials for pretty much anything in the world - including frying an egg.

here’s what I’m really thinking: you go to the school of their choice. you spend the year studying exceedingly well and growing in grace and wisdom. you spend the year being gracious, grateful and learning how to use a washing machine and frying an egg.

i’m not kidding, here.

then you transfer. when your transcripts are golden and your signature is good, you transfer.

you are obligated to obey your parents so long as you’re dependent on them. when you’re not, you’re free to make your own choices. if they refuse to allow you judicious counsel and offer authoritative dictates instead, then they’ve failed on their end.

if they fail, you forgive them because that’s what’s the right thing to do.

if they withhold a relationship with you “don’t darken my doorstep” and all that jazz, then you forgive them and pray for them that they overcome what would then appear to be emotional blackmail.

in a nutshell: never stay angry and learn how to pump your own gas, iron your own shirts and grill a hamburger. and pray for your parents-- they don’t trust that they parented you well enough.

Great stuff here. Is that an option? Transferring after a year? Perhaps ask about this if you are offered that scholarship. Even if you DON’T get offered the scholarship, if a transfer is possible, you can revisit the issue a year from now.

I feel for you, Brad. I grew up in a cage, too.

 

[EasterJoy]

I had very controlling parents who infantilized me as well - I was also not allowed to make myself tea, for instance, at age 18 - and I picked up life skills quite easily once I was out.

I couldn’t believe how easy all that stuff was - washing, cooking, paying bills, even earning a decent paycheck. It was all made out to sound extremely difficult and like something only my parents, the real adults, had any chance of getting right - and all I could do was be grateful they provided these things for incompetent, klutzy me.

Brad sounds like quite an intelligent young man and I’m sure he’ll manage fine once he’s out on his own.

Heck, there are now youtube tutorials for pretty much anything in the world - including frying an egg.

Great stuff here. Is that an option? Transferring after a year? Perhaps ask about this if you are offered that scholarship. Even if you DON’T get offered the scholarship, if a transfer is possible, you can revisit the issue a year from now.

I feel for you, Brad. I grew up in a cage, too.

A young person from a sheltered background will never have more company than in their first year of college! Very few campuses allow anyone under 21 to live anywhere other than with family or in a dorm. In the dorms, all you have to do is keep your person and your clothing clean, and among some students, even that much is apparently optional. Cooking and home care “lessons” hit in the second year or later (depending on how soon dorm life becomes tiresome), so it is gradual.

When moving out into an apartment, even those of us who had domestic skills usually had to adjust to cooking for one or two every night instead of cooking for six or eight once a week, to making minor repairs with only a basic Sears starter tool set instead of with the whole array from the home shop, to paying bills and staying something like within a budget, and so on. Others beyond that find that they had restricted domestic experience–always did the bathroom but never the oven or always did laundry but never sewing on buttons or knew how to cook chicken pieces but not how to cut up a whole one–and still had to learn a few things. Some figure it out sooner than others, but it gets figured out.

 

[Brad17]

Thank you everyone for your responses.

When I started this thread, I expected the responses more or less to just tell me to hush up and obey my parents. The fact that this is not what happened has given me much to think about.

I have determined that I cannot just let my college opportunities slip away without trying to talk to my parents about the alternatives. If I do nothing, I think I will spend the rest of the life regretting missed opportunities.

So I need to figure out which one or two adults I will trust to mediate between myself and my parents. There is no obvious choice, so I have made a list of about 30 names and have started to eliminate the adults I cannot trust with this matter. When I get down to 3 or 4 remaining names, I will make a decision.

But this does not need to be completed immediately. My mind is overloaded from thinking about this issue, so I am going to give the matter a few days rest. My goal is to make a determination of one or two names by Christmas.

Thanks to everyone for their time.

 

[EasterJoy]

Thank you everyone for your responses.

When I started this thread, I expected the responses more or less to just tell me to hush up and obey my parents. The fact that this is not what happened has given me much to think about.

I have determined that I cannot just let my college opportunities slip away without trying to talk to my parents about the alternatives. If I do nothing, I think I will spend the rest of the life regretting missed opportunities.

So I need to figure out which one or two adults I will trust to mediate between myself and my parents. There is no obvious choice, so I have made a list of about 30 names and have started to eliminate the adults I cannot trust with this matter. When I get down to 3 or 4 remaining names, I will make a decision.

But this does not need to be completed immediately. My mind is overloaded from thinking about this issue, so I am going to give the matter a few days rest. My goal is to make a determination of one or two names by Christmas.

Thanks to everyone for their time.

The adults do not need to be your mediators with your parents. In fact, it is far better if they are not and they would be wise not to take that role unless you need legal emancipation. The adults do not need to be your substitute authority figure to “trump” your parents. It is also better to handle that yourself. The adults would be there to be your sounding boards, the ones who help you find what your options really are and what each is likely to cost (again: no guarantees, we’re grown-ups now), so that you do not overreact against your parents’ boundaries, so that you can use your imagination combined with their feedback to explore your boundaries.

Be prepared for these soundingboards to say, “Yes, but what about…” Do not interpret this as if your father was asking that question! Rather, take their “playing the devil’s advocate” as an invitation to thoroughly think out your position and to make sure it is the one you want to defend before you take it up with your parents and one that you are prepared to defend, as well.

Do you see? They can be your sparring partners and your coaches, so you can take up your own defense on your own behalf. That is what you are aiming at. You may decide, after talking to them, that while you need to make a break from your parents’ boundaries eventually and while you will in all likelihood have to make that break yourself rather than waiting for willing parental release, that you still want to bide your time before doing it. Be ready to accept that option, too, but do the work to arrive there on your own steam. You will feel much better about your course of action than if you had simply thrown up your hands and said, “I give in. Whatever you want, you know better than I do, tell me what to do.”

Good luck!!

 

[TheRealJuliane]

The adults do not need to be your mediators with your parents. In fact, it is far better if they are not and they would be wise not to take that role unless you need legal emancipation. The adults do not need to be your substitute authority figure to “trump” your parents. It is also better to handle that yourself. The adults would be there to be your sounding boards, the ones who help you find what your options really are and what each is likely to cost (again: no guarantees, we’re grown-ups now), so that you do not overreact against your parents’ boundaries, so that you can use your imagination combined with their feedback to explore your boundaries.

Be prepared for these soundingboards to say, “Yes, but what about…” Do not interpret this as if your father was asking that question! Rather, take their “playing the devil’s advocate” as an invitation to thoroughly think out your position and to make sure it is the one you want to defend before you take it up with your parents and one that you are prepared to defend, as well.

Do you see? They can be your sparring partners and your coaches, so you can take up your own defense on your own behalf. That is what you are aiming at. You may decide, after talking to them, that while you need to make a break from your parents’ boundaries eventually and while you will in all likelihood have to make that break yourself rather than waiting for willing parental release, that you still want to bide your time before doing it. Be ready to accept that option, too, but do the work to arrive there on your own steam. You will feel much better about your course of action than if you had simply thrown up your hands and said, “I give in. Whatever you want, you know better than I do, tell me what to do.”

Good luck!!

EasterJoy, I was the one who suggested that the OP try to find a trusted older sibling, aunt, uncle, godparent, or close family friend, to help mediate the conversation between him and his parents. Since they will NOT listen to him, I thought perhaps a person they feel is more of an equal could start the conversation and intervene on his behalf. He would be present, if possible, but the presence of a rational, respected adult might help his parents have at least a conversation on the topic of his college selection. I think you and I have different perspectives on what is needed at this point. I think he should have someone on his side, but whom the parents will at least listen to, and give a little more credence to. Perhaps this could take place without him being present, but it would have to be someone who could REALLY be trusted. He didn’t answer me on two points. One, does he have any older siblings (it doesn’t seem as though he does) and two, are there cultural elements to this story? If there are cultural elements, then it will be important to choose a person who understands both worlds and can bridge any gaps between them.

 

[Luna_Lovecraft]

EasterJoy, I was the one who suggested that the OP try to find a trusted older sibling, aunt, uncle, godparent, or close family friend, to help mediate the conversation between him and his parents. Since they will NOT listen to him, I thought perhaps a person they feel is more of an equal could start the conversation and intervene on his behalf. He would be present, if possible, but the presence of a rational, respected adult might help his parents have at least a conversation on the topic of his college selection. I think you and I have different perspectives on what is needed at this point. I think he should have someone on his side, but whom the parents will at least listen to, and give a little more credence to. Perhaps this could take place without him being present, but it would have to be someone who could REALLY be trusted. He didn’t answer me on two points. One, does he have any older siblings (it doesn’t seem as though he does) and two, are there cultural elements to this story? If there are cultural elements, then it will be important to choose a person who understands both worlds and can bridge any gaps between them.

I also suggested he find a calm adult to mediate for him. The OP is afraid of “firworks” when he talks with his parents. Who knows what that means, but like I told him adults are less likely to go offon their kids if another adult is around.

The kid needs a big ol’ support system and should start building up one now; he’s going to need it in the coming months/years.

 

[nurseryworker]

EasterJoy, I was the one who suggested that the OP try to find a trusted older sibling, aunt, uncle, godparent, or close family friend, to help mediate the conversation between him and his parents. Since they will NOT listen to him, I thought perhaps a person they feel is more of an equal could start the conversation and intervene on his behalf. He would be present, if possible, but the presence of a rational, respected adult might help his parents have at least a conversation on the topic of his college selection. I think you and I have different perspectives on what is needed at this point. I think he should have someone on his side, but whom the parents will at least listen to, and give a little more credence to. Perhaps this could take place without him being present, but it would have to be someone who could REALLY be trusted. He didn’t answer me on two points. One, does he have any older siblings (it doesn’t seem as though he does) and two, are there cultural elements to this story? If there are cultural elements, then it will be important to choose a person who understands both worlds and can bridge any gaps between them.

I would advise caution on having an outsider talk to the parents. In a controlling family like this, it is liable to make things worse, not better. I fear the parents would view the OP’s actions as airing family laundry. This is not about Brad losing his faith - that’s just an excuse by the parents to exert control over him. Unless someone is going to tell me that using the kitchen can somehow cause Brad to lose his faith or doing his own laundry.

My advice to Brad is that he has to determine if this is the time he wants to make this college the event where he essentially declares he is an adult and will be paving his own way. Make up a pro and con list. Graduating debt free would give you a head start over a lot of other young adults. It is tough starting out having a loan payment over your head (you didn’t say whether this scholarship would cover 100% of your expenses). But of course, that means towing the line while your parents foot the bill. If there are abuse issues and you need to get out, loans + scholarships may be the answer. But you risk losing the relationship with your parents either temporarily or permanently. Or can you go to their choice of college for one year and plan a transfer. When you think of each option, which one gives you the most peace - that’s the one you should follow.

My answer is based on accepting at face value what you’ve written about your parents. You seem like a bright, articulate young man. You’ll know when the time comes to assert your independence. Pray to God in the meantime to help you discern the path you should take.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I would advise caution on having an outsider talk to the parents. In a controlling family like this, it is liable to make things worse, not better. I fear the parents would view the OP’s actions as airing family laundry. This is not about Brad losing his faith - that’s just an excuse by the parents to exert control over him. Unless someone is going to tell me that using the kitchen can somehow cause Brad to lose his faith or doing his own laundry.

My advice to Brad is that he has to determine if this is the time he wants to make this college the event where he essentially declares he is an adult and will be paving his own way. Make up a pro and con list. Graduating debt free would give you a head start over a lot of other young adults. It is tough starting out having a loan payment over your head (you didn’t say whether this scholarship would cover 100% of your expenses). But of course, that means towing the line while your parents foot the bill. If there are abuse issues and you need to get out, loans + scholarships may be the answer. But you risk losing the relationship with your parents either temporarily or permanently. Or can you go to their choice of college for one year and plan a transfer. When you think of each option, which one gives you the most peace - that’s the one you should follow.

My answer is based on accepting at face value what you’ve written about your parents. You seem like a bright, articulate young man. You’ll know when the time comes to assert your independence. Pray to God in the meantime to help you discern the path you should take.

Not an outsider. A relative or close family friend that the parents respect and will be open to listening to.

 

[Brad17]

EasterJoy, I was the one who suggested that the OP try to find a trusted older sibling, aunt, uncle, godparent, or close family friend, to help mediate the conversation between him and his parents. Since they will NOT listen to him, I thought perhaps a person they feel is more of an equal could start the conversation and intervene on his behalf. He would be present, if possible, but the presence of a rational, respected adult might help his parents have at least a conversation on the topic of his college selection. I think you and I have different perspectives on what is needed at this point. I think he should have someone on his side, but whom the parents will at least listen to, and give a little more credence to. Perhaps this could take place without him being present, but it would have to be someone who could REALLY be trusted. He didn’t answer me on two points. One, does he have any older siblings (it doesn’t seem as though he does) and two, are there cultural elements to this story? If there are cultural elements, then it will be important to choose a person who understands both worlds and can bridge any gaps between them.

I am the oldest child. I have three younger sisters.

If I understand your question correctly, there are no cultural elements affecting this situation.

 

[XRU]

This is a reply to “Cat”. Due to the length of Cat’s last response (and I do appreciate the (name removed by moderator)ut), I can’t include it here.

Your kids were doing their own laundry at 9? I am forbidden to touch the washer, dryer, dishwasher, and all of my Father’s powertools. I put the dishes in the sink. If I want a screwdriver, I have to ask for permission. I use a pushmower to mow the grass and am forbidden to even touch the one that uses gasoline. I don’t have a drivers license, because the thought of me driving is not something my parents can handle.

Make my own doctor/dentist appointments? I would be grounded for a month if I even tried.

My Mother takes me clothes shopping. I have some say in my choice of clothes, but I go shopping when she wants to go.

Do any kind of cooking? My Mother would have a fit.

I do have a part-time job and I have saved most of the money I have earned from it.

I have tried to talk to my Father about assuming some additional responsibilities, and he said I was still “too wet behind the ears”. This was about a year ago. That comment really hurt me, and I now avoid talking to him if possible.

As for my going into “drama” mode, if you knew me you wouldn’t say such a thing. I am venting on this board because I really have no place I can express my frustrations.

I admit I am having real problems finding a “trusted adult”. Part of the problem is that I don’t think I know how to relate to anyone older. All of you are just authority figures to me. I know that isn’t true, but knowing that and being actually to relate to you are two different things.

There’s more I want to say, but I have to get ready for school.

17 . . . honestly. You parent really really make me mad. So mad that before I try and give you some helpful advice I asked my wife who is an RN as I am (I worked in psychiatry for years before retirement) about your above quoted comment and what she said is basically:

Your parents have been treating you like a five year old your whole life and their job is to teach you to be able to handle your decisions by yourself by the time you are 18 yo and they are not letting you do this.

She and I feel really bad for you that your parents are such control freaks. She’s not sure what you are going to do about it. BTW, my wife agrees with me that your parents actions are borderline child abuses.

My take on it is that you are going to have to fight to become an adult and that your parents are going to try and control your life for a time at least AND that the odds are its going to get ugly.

You are getting some good advice on this forum and . . . well, some not so good advice.

Listen Brother . . . there are adults out there that you can talk to. You just have to look. Maybe a friend who has had a similar problem. Or just keep posting here.

I want to emphasize again . . . don’t think this thing is over with your parents. They are control freaks big time. If you end up entertaining the thought of going to the school they want you to they will be telling you what classes to take, and calling the teachers you have and otherwise controlling your life. I think your parents have some rather serious psychological problems.

This is what being an adult is like. There are always people who would like to control you. Time to learn behaviors that will deal with them:thumbsup:

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I am the oldest child. I have three younger sisters.

If I understand your question correctly, there are no cultural elements affecting this situation.

Thank you for the answers. That clears up a couple of aspects of your situation. The cultural elements would be something such as your parents being 1st generation Asian immigrants (depending on the country). In general (and I am being very broad here), Asian parents push their children to achieve academically, they stay very involved in the choice of a college and even the major, and certainly have opinions about what careers are suitable/good/acceptable to the family. I am NOT saying that to denigrate Asian cultures, but from personal experience from my sons’ classes all the way through school. Thus, if your parents were Asian, we’d have to factor that in as well.

 

[EasterJoy]

EasterJoy, I was the one who suggested that the OP try to find a trusted older sibling, aunt, uncle, godparent, or close family friend, to help mediate the conversation between him and his parents. Since they will NOT listen to him, I thought perhaps a person they feel is more of an equal could start the conversation and intervene on his behalf. He would be present, if possible, but the presence of a rational, respected adult might help his parents have at least a conversation on the topic of his college selection. I think you and I have different perspectives on what is needed at this point. I think he should have someone on his side, but whom the parents will at least listen to, and give a little more credence to. Perhaps this could take place without him being present, but it would have to be someone who could REALLY be trusted. He didn’t answer me on two points. One, does he have any older siblings (it doesn’t seem as though he does) and two, are there cultural elements to this story? If there are cultural elements, then it will be important to choose a person who understands both worlds and can bridge any gaps between them.

The “cultural” situation could be the culture of a particular family line. In our neck of the woods, talk about the German culture was thrown around, because so many of the old families that had been there forever were German, but it is funny how the Italians and the Swiss and the Irish and everybody else still had the same issues…all the way to The Fiddler on the Roof!

*Who, day and night, must scramble for a living,
Feed a wife and children, say his daily prayers?
And who has the right, as master of the house,
To have the final word at home?

The Papa, the Papa!..Tradition!*

This is my guess:
a) His dad respects his* own *opinion, and when it comes to raising *his *kids, he isn’t at all interested in hearing anyone else’s. The OP is hardly likely to be the only person in his father’s life that his father does not believe to be fully competent. Anyone whose opinion he does respect would see his stock plummet if the person were to take the side of a 17 year old over the kid’s obviously-more-competent father
b) This is a little bit more of a guess, but I’m guessing that his dad believes that his family ought to project a pretense of everyone being fully on board with his decision-making. IOW, he wants the world to think that his kids do what he wants in the end because in the end they can see that he is wiser than they are. He knows best. If one of the kids were to invite someone else in to correct him on that count, the kid who did that might be subject to reprisals and a harder crack-down.

More than that, the young man is going to have to learn to stake out his own territory with Dad, and to eventually do it without letting Dad make it into a fight. That doesn’t happen by magic. It does happen by getting the skills to do it and then, learning as he goes, giving Dad the experience that his son is a man. That usually takes more than a few run-ins, although there are parents who see their son or daughter patiently and firmly stick to a well-defended course of action and conclude, “Oh. Well. Hmmm. I guess he is capable of making decisions like an adult. Well, who knew? We have another man in the house!”

If the OP is exceedingly lucky, the experience of seeing their son conduct conflicts with his parents as an adult does will win them over rather more quickly than he could have hoped. He ought not hope for that. He ought to hope that if he starts getting guidance about how to stand up to his father more-or-less calmly when he’s 17, his dad might concede that he’s an adult when he’s 25 or 30. That might seem like a long time until he realizes that if he does not learn to stand up to conflicts with dad as an adult ought to, his dad will still be treating him like a 12 year old when he’s 50.

I’d say the best course is to try to learn to draw his boundaries with dad on his own, to learn to calm himself and stick with his principles even if his parents start lobbing the heavy emotional artillery, and to only call in a 3rd party mediator as a last resort. The goal is not just to get to the college he wants, after all. The end goal is to eventually have an adult-to-adult relationship with his dad. Even if Dad allows that grudgingly until he dies at 101, it is still a situation well worth working towards.

IOW, OP: Even if your first battles are spectacular failures, they are the first steps towards winning the war. Just don’t forget your goal! It is not to “beat” your parents or “show” your parents. It is not to “tell them like it is”. It is not about never failing to have the last word when you know you’re right! It is about picking those battles that are really important and waging them intelligently and compassionately, with your actual goals in mind. You want to avoid silly inter-family p**sing contests at all costs. Your goal is to firmly take your own decisions in your own hands, and to firmly but charitably deny anyone else the right to make them for you. Try to keep the heat of some moment from making you forget that. Words you don’t mean are well worth avoiding.

If your dad has a relative he respects, your uncle or your godfather or anyone who has some track record in the realm of actually changing your dad’s mind, try to make that person one of your confidants. That is actually someone who could help you by going to bat for you! Do stick to those who have some past record of changing your dad’s mind, though. If that is no one but your mom, then work on her. Many people have gotten out of this impasse by, over time, convincing Mom first of the good sense of their proposed plan. If no one has that record, well…I guess you’re going to have to be the first!!

Be ready for a very long haul, but you can do it!

 

[CakeState]

Hi Brad,

I think the posters who are calling you immature are speaking from experience, because typically most parents are reasonable people and most teenagers lack the wisdom to see that their parents’ concerns are valid and understandable. Because of this, they will automatically give the parents the benefit of the doubt. But, I don’t get the sense that this is the case here. I have similarly controlling parents who refuse to listen to anyone else’s concerns or objections, and it sparks a huge fight when anyone decides to make a choice they don’t agree with, even on the most trivial of matters. This type of parent sadly does exist, and I know it’s no exageration when you say they won’t let you even wash your clothes by yourself because mine wouldn’t let me either. The separation process when I became an adult was painful and difficult because these types of parents fear what might happen to their children if they don’t make the “right” choices. It’s understandable (I fear the same thing for my own children), but it’s also unhealthy. When children reach adulthood, the parents must accept that the time for control is over and they have no choice but to trust that they raised them to make good choices. You are 17, and yes it’s young (though IMO you come off as far more intelligent and levelheaded than most), but in a few months you will be 18, then 19, then 20 and beyond. If you don’t begin to separate, put up necessary boundaries, and learn to make your own informed choices, it will never happen. There will be a fight when you do this regardless of whether you’re 17 or 27, because our type of parent will never willingly relenquish control. You will have to decide for yourself when you will be in control of your future and start making your own choices without first asking their permission. As others have said, honoring your parents does not mean obedience to unreasonable demands for the rest of your life. Listen to their fears and suggestions and try your best to work with them, but don’t set yourself up for a lifetime of regret.

You are right to be concerned that your parents will not stop trying to control your choices well into adulthood if you allow them to. In my case, the fact that I am a married college graduate with my own home and my own kids does not stop them from still trying to make choices for me, no matter how big or how small. I regret it every time I allow them to influence my decisions, such as when they talked me out of buying my dream home because my dad did not like that it had a crawl space because he feared it would grow mold. My husband and I still kick ourselves over that. They have also done things like set up an appointment for a contractor they liked to come examine our garage and give us a quote for turning it into a fourth bedroom. We had no knowledge this man was coming - we simply got an email from my dad telling us the time they were both going to show up a day after I mentioned to him we were considering doing the project sometime in the future. For a month afterward I got calls and emails from him pressing me to spend the $16,000 to convert the garage right then because they had decided it was best, and it didn’t matter how much I told them we were not going to do it at that time or maybe even at all. Another time, I casually mentioned to my mom that I needed a new dentist, and she was adamant that I choose hers because she felt he was the best. I tried as gently as I could to explain that although I appreciated the (completely unsolicited) suggestion, I lived an hour away from him and would prefer one closer. She went nuclear, yelled at me, called me ungrateful, hung up the phone, and wouldn’t speak to me for days. I know I’m venting a bit here, but I want to show you where this sort of things this leads to if you don’t put up boundaries now that you are becoming an adult. I could give 100 other examples.

As for choosing a collegge, if their objection really is just that you will lose your faith once you get to college (which is a perfectly understandable fear) the only way to get them over it is to prove them wrong. Go to college, come out the other side with your faith intact, and eventually they will come around no matter how furious they are with you and how damaged your relationship was after the inevitable fight after you make your college selection. If they truly love you, they will not cut you out of their lives compeltely and forever no matter how mad they are. If they do, it will show how irrational they really are and that the problems lie more with them than with you. I would suspect, though, that standing up for yourself will help earn you their respect in the long run, and prove to them that you are a capable adult that they can trust to make good decisions and that they don’t need to fear letting go of the reins of your life.

I like the suggestion that you could come up with a list of colleges that would make both of you happy, but at the same time, I urge you to make informed choices that you are going to be comfortable living with your the rest of your life. Don’t make a choice simply to avoid a fight, because a fight is ineveitable. If it’s not about college, it will be about where you decide to live, or who you decide to marry, or something else. Being 17, it is so easy for others to brush this off as just a child being stubborn against a parent, but in cases like these the issues run very deep. A fight over where to attend college is just a symptom of a greater disease. It may very well be the case that your parents will cut you off completely and you’ll have to find a way to fend for yourself for choosing your own college, but doesn’t that say more about them than it does about you?

 

[Brad17]

…from EasterJoy’s last post:

This is my guess:
a) His dad respects his own opinion, and when it comes to raising his kids, he isn’t at all interested in hearing anyone else’s. The OP is hardly likely to be the only person in his father’s life that his father does not believe to be fully competent. Anyone whose opinion he does respect would see his stock plummet if the person were to take the side of a 17 year old over the kid’s obviously-more-competent father
b) This is a little bit more of a guess, but I’m guessing that his dad believes that his family ought to project a pretense of everyone being fully on board with his decision-making. IOW, he wants the world to think that his kids do what he wants in the end because in the end they can see that he is wiser than they are. He knows best. If one of the kids were to invite someone else in to correct him on that count, the kid who did that might be subject to reprisals and a harder crack-down.

You have described my Father almost perfectly. He is a bit less harsh with my sisters. He takes more of a lead in raising me, and my Mother takes more of a lead in raising my sisters. I assume this approach is typical.