Can my parents take away a scholarship opportunity?

[ahollars]

http://th08.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE...t_you_for_u_s__army_by_razornylon-d39nw3f.jpg

I also moved out the day I turned 18, and it was the greatest thing I ever did. I had to give up a full-ride scholarship, but the Army turned me into the man I am today. Married now for 10 years, six children, I now live more than 1,000 miles away from my family, and I couldn’t be happier. I talk to my parents almost everyday on the phone. Sometimes, I dream of selling my house and moving back west, but I am right where I am supposed to be.

Take charge of your own life, and don’t look back. Your family will catch up to you when they see you are doing just fine. Not to mention, you’ll probably be the one taking care of them when they get old.

 

[maryjk]

I cannot imagine how an 18 year old college freshman, who is going to school full time, can possibly support himself completely. I don’t believe a part time job would suffice. He would be responsible for rent, food, clothing, books, insurance, travel, possibly a vehicle and gas, and medical costs, not only for the school year but for four full years.

I also cannot imagine that any school would be worth losing a relationship with parents, even if they seem bull headed.

It depends on what the scholarship covers. It may cover housing, food and books. I know a young lady that received a full ride scholarship including all of that plus tuition for all four years.

I am betting he has clothes. He won’t need a car or gas or travel money. And he might even be able to get away with not having insurance.

A part time job will give him some spending money. He might not need anything else.

And if he gets away from his parents, any school might be worth it.

 

[HouseArrest]

He doesn’t have an actual relationship with his parents. At least not one where he’s anywhere remotely close to an adult. He’s basically a four-year old to them.

I don’t believe any of Brad’s posts supported that he had no relationship with his parents. Strained, yes. In any event it doesn’t sound like he wants to sever ties.

 

[Cat]

Excuse me? I don’t know what your background is… but I do know for sure that college is a very serious decision and that it should be an adult decision (if he’s old enough to go to college, he’s old enough to be an adult).

The very first thing I advised was an honest talk with his dream college. He absolutely needs to know what his true options are. Will it be open for him if he postpones a year? Are there other options he hasn’t considered that they are aware of? They in turn need to know he is serious about wanting to attend so that they can justify working with him. Otherwise, he is just leading them on. If the solutions they as a college propose don’t work out for whatever reason, (like maybe he would have to re qualify for scholarship), then it might be time to tackle the parent situation. From the sound of it, his father is inflexible. I have met his type, and if he is as controlling as the OP is saying, I doubt there is any chance of changing his mind from bottom up. But, a top down might be helpful. Hence the bishop.

An informal friendly chat with the bishop is in lieu of a formal trial to be freed from the obligation of obedience in that particular respect (or all) from one’s parents. I outlined a way in which the parents can be satisfied (written agreement) and in which a successor of the Apostles can weigh in on the likelihood of Jr’s losing his soul in X university. I am not advocating civil/canonical emancipation here since it takes more than the OP probably wants to do, I am saying though with regard to specifically the college decision he can ask his shepherd to discuss this with him and his parents. It is almost an important decision as a vocational choice and that we are all forbidden (parents especially) to force anyone into any vocation.

I don’t know what the OP is thinking should he not get the scholarship. But if he does, he already is working part time which means that he does have work experience. So theoretically he could buy the plane ticket or movie ticket that his scholarship may not fund. He has already stated that with the scholarship all financial needs would be met so presumably he would have some extra spending money built into it.

Refer to boldface, mine, above–I disagree with this statement. There are a great many very immature college students who have a lot of growing up to do.

Also, in many cities, including ours, high school students are attending college part-time while they are still in high school. Some of these students essentially finish their general education requirements while still in high school–a magnificent savings on tuition!

But just because these young students are in college doesn’t mean that they are old old enought to be adults.

I do agree that the decision to attend college should be made by adults, mainly because most high school students (not all) have no concept of what twenty-thousand dollars a year for tuition, plus another ten thousand dollars for room and board, really means. For me (the mom), that means a half a year’s salary. For some families, it means an entire year’s salary. Teenagers often seem to think that Mom and Dad are made of money and just have to “write a check” or “charge it.” So yes, adult (name removed by moderator)ut is needed for the college decision.

But the adults have to be sensible and able to correctly discern their teenager’s needs. It sounds more and more like the OP’s parents are not sensible, and have little idea that their son needs to be treated as a teenager on the verge of becoming an adult man. So sad.

 

[EasterJoy]

He doesn’t have an actual relationship with his parents. At least not one where he’s anywhere remotely close to an adult. He’s basically a four-year old to them.

I get the feeling that his dad is of the sort that treats his brothers, parents, co-workers, teachers of his children, and pretty much everyone else very much the same way. He sounds like someone who would hear the maxim: “If you want something done right, do it yourself” and agree that the sentiment was right on, but that the wording needed some work.

The example I gave of the mother who wouldn’t let her sons do their own laundry? Nobody touched her washer. I know others who don’t allow anyone else to do their yard work or their housework or any cooking in their kitchen, because they are the only ones who can do it “right”.

Even if his parents do treat him differently, it is different to have a parent-child relationship that is frozen in time than to not have one at all. The work of letting go is necessary, but it is not easy. This young man will do best if he appreciates how hard this is for his parents just as surely as he appreciates how necessary it is that the sea change in their relationship does take place. If he does that, he’ll be more likely to choose his battles carefully and to wage them sensitively and sensibly.

It is possible to have a relationship with parents who want to the control the whole world. It isn’t easy, and it doesn’t involve getting them to see that you are right and they are wrong. It involves getting them to see the ways in which you aren’t in their control and that there isn’t anything they can do about it, even if they don’t see that as a good thing. People who get used to having control and then losing it sometimes have to go through the stages of grief, a dance through many choruses of denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and (not all at once) acceptance. If this young man expects that his parents, and especially his dad, are going to have to work through all that before accepting that he has entered adulthood, his relationship with his parents will go much better.

 

[Brad17]

I get the feeling that his dad is of the sort that treats his brothers, parents, co-workers, teachers of his children, and pretty much everyone else very much the same way. He sounds like someone who would hear the maxim: “If you want something done right, do it yourself” and agree that the sentiment was right on, but that the wording needed some work.

The example I gave of the mother who wouldn’t let her sons do their own laundry? Nobody touched her washer. I know others who don’t allow anyone else to do their yard work or their housework or any cooking in their kitchen, because they are the only ones who can do it “right”.

Even if his parents do treat him differently, it is different to have a parent-child relationship that is frozen in time than to not have one at all. The work of letting go is necessary, but it is not easy. This young man will do best if he appreciates how hard this is for his parents just as surely as he appreciates how necessary it is that the sea change in their relationship does take place. If he does that, he’ll be more likely to choose his battles carefully and to wage them sensitively and sensibly.

It is possible to have a relationship with parents who want to the control the whole world. It isn’t easy, and it doesn’t involve getting them to see that you are right and they are wrong. It involves getting them to see the ways in which you aren’t in their control and that there isn’t anything they can do about it, even if they don’t see that as a good thing. People who get used to having control and then losing it sometimes have to go through the stages of grief, a dance through many choruses of denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and (not all at once) acceptance. If this young man expects that his parents, and especially his dad, are going to have to work through all that before accepting that he has entered adulthood, his relationship with his parents will go much better.

Well my Father has definitely said “If you want something done right, do it yourself”, but that is not his favorite expression. His favorite expression is “Make us both happy, do it my way”.

The stages of grief can take months or years to work through. My Father could take that long to change (assuming he does)? Wonderful.

 

[The_Bucket]

The stages of grief can take months or years to work through. My Father could take that long to change (assuming he does)? Wonderful.

It takes a long time for people to fully change. Same goes for you too.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Well my Father has definitely said “If you want something done right, do it yourself”, but that is not his favorite expression. His favorite expression is “Make us both happy, do it my way”.

The stages of grief can take months or years to work through. My Father could take that long to change (assuming he does)? Wonderful.

That doesn’t mean you have to hold his hand through the whole process. Go ahead with your life and let him handle it himself.

 

[Kal2012]

I’m kind of surprised that nobody has mentioned how hard it is to apply to be an independent student at college.

The assumption being that an 18-22 year old isn’t going to have their own apartment/job/will be paying for their own education.

Proving to a college/university that you have no support from your parents is quite a process because they assume that when you aren’t in school, then you are still a legal resident of your parents house and are receiving some financial support from them - even if it is minimal - just housing or whatever. (Even into your 20’s).

My husband didn’t go to college until his mid-20’s and he was married, still, the financial aid people asked if his parents were going to be contributing to his education and he had to go through the paperwork to prove that he wasn’t going to be receiving any money from his (absent) mom/ (absent) dad. I think they have to ask until you are like 25-26.

Just please don’t assume that having the ‘conversation’ w/mom and dad is always the hardest part of the equation. What if the ‘unthinkable’ happens and you are able to go to the school that you want to go to, but mom and dad say, they aren’t paying for it and you can’t live at home anymore?

Are you willing to take out the loans and take on a job to pay your expenses (rent/food/clothes)?

I think getting a mediator is a good idea.

I think we live in fear-filled times and I know my dad was really emotional my senior year of high school because he knew I’d be leaving for college in a few months. It’s a big change for everyone.

Honestly, I didn’t want to go to the school my dad picked out for me. It was until I was there that I realized that it really was the best school for me. I was just too blinded by my desire to leave town (I really didn’t want to go to one of the colleges in my hometown - so I ‘compromised’ and said I’d go, but I’d live in the dorms) to see what my dad saw.

To this day, I am so grateful that I was ‘forced’ to choose this college because it changed my life in so many ways.

I still feel kind of weird when people ask me the ‘why did you decide to go to X question’ because I don’t think I decided. I think God did. He just used my dad and others to push me in the right direction.

I think it’s sad that your parents won’t talk to you like an adult, Brad. Mostly because I think that all of you could be a lot closer and understand each other better if you were open/honest with each other.

I know my dad (he was a single parent, BTW) was really emotional my senior year because he didn’t want me to be growing up and at a point where I’d be moving on to something new.

I totally didn’t see that when I was your age and it’s only now that I’m a parent that I kind of get what he felt during that time. All I cared about was getting out of that crazy house and moving on with my life and moving far/far away. So, I still find it pretty ironic that my dream college was really in my hometown and that my dad was right.

The transition is hard for everyone, regardless if anyone wants to say it or not. Regardless of what age you are.

Anyway, that’s my story. Glean from it what you want/need.

I can understand why your parents would be worried about you going to secular college. Still, if they raised you right, then they need to trust that you will find your own way and that you will make mistakes along the path.

From a parent’s perspective, it’s just really hard to watch your kid struggle and grow up and make their own decisions - especially when they agree with what you want for your kid as a parent.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[EasterJoy]

Well my Father has definitely said “If you want something done right, do it yourself”, but that is not his favorite expression. His favorite expression is “Make us both happy, do it my way”.

The stages of grief can take months or years to work through. My Father could take that long to change (assuming he does)? Wonderful.

Since you were born, he’s thought of you as someone who, with any luck, will have the good sense to grow up to be just like him. That dream is going to die hard. The good news is that he never has to agree with you in order to accept that you are a man who makes his own decisions. The bad news is that unless he has a life-changing epiphany of some magnitude, that realization that you are not him is going to grieve him for a long time.

Think of a lab mouse who is used to pushing a bar and getting a peanut. Then one day, no peanut. Hit, hit, hit, hit. If the mouse starts getting a peanut every once in awhile, it will actually hit the bar more. It learns that it can still get what it wants, just by hitting the bar enough times. Now, make that lab mouse into your dad. Your job is to teach your dad to predict accurately when hitting the bar more than once is going to do no good. Your goal is to give him cues about when you can be swayed and when you can’t. Don’t bite off more than you can chew, or you’ll have someone you know to be a very very persistent mouse dogging you to give him what he wants until he drives you nuts and succeeds.

What you want first of all, then, is to choose your battles very carefully, especially since at this point bluntly striking out on your own is probably a version of cutting off your nose to spite your face. Instead, bide your time, and don’t cross him without good reason. Where he is in control and you can’t change that, be willing to admit it. After all: What makes him respect someone’s opinion? Well, when they agree with him, of course. So when you disagree with him, you do it this way: I agree with you about a, and you are right about b; we just disagree on how to get there or we only disagree on c. What you avoid is personal comments (even if true) such as: You just want to run my life, you treat me like I’m five, etc. No, you have to show that, by and large, you respect his opinion and think he wants what is best for you. IOW: Do not get in ego battles!! Those will work out badly for everyone, but mostly you. (The great irony, of course, is that I would give him very similar advice. Ah well, he is not asking, and you are. It is a good thing that it only takes one sensible person to keep most battles civilized.)

This gets him used to the idea that you don’t disagree with him just in order to show him that you’re your own man. You only disagree when necessary. Your mother will also be in the position of hearing you and thinking: Hey, Brad isn’t trying to be rebellious. He agrees with his father on nearly everything. He’s a sensible kid; he just has this one thing that his father won’t back down on. He’s trying to get along; he just doesn’t agree about everything.* I know what that feels like, and I feel for him.*

You don’t want him to get used to the idea that it means nothing when you draw a line in the sand, that you’re just difficult for the sake of being difficult. You want to give him the idea that when you draw a line in the sand, you do it because you have to, and when you do it, you mean it. When you have the decision, you calmly and firmly stick to your guns. You don’t want to give him the pay-off of drama and hand-waving and all of that. This kind of thing encourages him to think you’re still five years old. If he drives you to tears of frustration, hold the back until you can indulge in private. I will guarantee he will not see them as a sign of how passionate you are. (Not fair, but we are interested in getting through this with the biggest piece left intact, not re-wiring your dad’s brain. Keep your eye on the ball!)

You might also ask your mother how she copes when she wants something and your dad will not give in. Trust me, there is something. If you show yourself as someone who wants to both get along with your dad and have some semblance of autonomy about something, I think she’ll relate, even if she doesn’t have much but sympathy to offer. If she thinks you are not trying to get out of hand and get carte blanche to do a full Prodigal Son on her, but just to convince your dad to go along with a course that is entirely in keeping with how she tried to raise you, though, she may turn out to be your ally. It is worth trying out.

 

[Brad17]

Well I thought I would let everyone know what happened.

In early January, I was contacted by the scholarship committee of the University I wanted most to attend for an interview. This was quite a big deal, as several hundred applicants had applied, and the school was going to interview the final 50 applicants for 20 full scholarships. Without going into all the details (although I should mention that a 15 hour/week job came with the award), the scholarship would have covered all reasonable expenses while school was in session.

A letter was received three days later with the interview information. My father contacted the school, informed them that I wasn’t interested, and thanked them for their time. My father then gave me an hour long lecture, complete with lots of yelling, that I was going to attend the college of his choice, and that was final.

I contacted the school and tried to get readmitted into the award process, but it wasn’t possible. In fact I was lectured for wasting their time and that another applicant could have been considered had I not applied in the first place.

I was devestated. For three weeks I was more or less a walking zombie. I went to school and did what was expected of me, but my heart was not in it. I avoided friends and kept to myself.

After three weeks, I finally woke up out of my haze and made a decision.

I’ll give a very short summary from this point as a lot happened. The events below occured over a timeframe of about 12 days.

1. I went to the Church and explained my situation.
2. The Church spoke to my parents and verified that I was telling the truth.
3. The Church informed my parents that they were exceeding their parental authority.
4. My Father didn’t react well and expressed his own opinion on the matter.
5. The Church made it clear to my Father that his actions and behavior were unacceptable.
6. My Father agreed to a compromise and will pay for an education at Fordham (which was my second choice) if I am accepted. I expect to be accepted at Fordham - my qualifications are significantly above the average for students admitted last year. I am supposed to hear from Fordham late this month.

I should point out, for those who didn’t read this thread in December, that my parents are extremely well off financially. I appreciate money does not grow on trees, but my point is that paying for my college education is not really a financial burden to my parents. I am grateful for their support.

However my parents and I are essentially no longer on speaking terms. My Mother will speak to me, but only when needed. I have been told to make plans to live somewhere else after my 18th birthday. My sisters have been told to avoid me as much as possible, and are doing so. They whisper about me all the time and stop talking when I approach.

So I won, but it is an incredibly bittersweet victory. I feel very alone and wonder if it was all worth it. I think it will be quite some time before I know the answer.

Parents, please don’t let pride conquer your relationships with your children. I can speak firsthand as to the pain it will cause.

 

[SlackerCatholic]

Man, I just want to hug you. I have five kids, my oldest is soon to be 15 and my second will be 13 this fall. So I am a parent of teenagers and can’t imagine treating my children the way your parents are treating you. My oldest has decided on her first choice, and we will move Heaven and Earth to get her there, even though it’s a secular school and completely out of our financial means even in our dreams.

Many parents can’t separate their own identities from their children. They see you as a vehicle of their own image, or a tool for serving their needs. They don’t recognize you as an independent human being with your own rights.

When it was time for me to go to college, I turned down a FULL RIDE to the University of Alaska at Fairbanks. My mother couldn’t handle the idea of me being so far away. I grew up in California. It is still and will always be the biggest regret of my life. What an experience that would have been! Once in a lifetime chance. But I was in an extremely enmeshed and emotionally unhealthy relationship with my mother and had not yet grown, enough to break free. A year later, I was ready and angry at myself, and transferred to my fiance’s school in Chicago. We got married right after graduation, and I’ve hardly seen my mother in the last 20 years. And when I have, it usually turns bad. She, and many other parents, like yours, is incapable of having a normal, functional adult relationship with her children.

You may have to accept that you will not ever have the kind of relationship you want with them. Hopefully your sisters will figure it out in time and you will be able to reclaim relationships with them. But, if they decide to let Dad buy their lives with his money, maybe not.

It will be painful, but I promise, if you use your freedom well, breaking away from their control will be worth it, whatever painful sacrifice it brings. :console:

 

[Litcrit]

Wow, Brad. I’m sorry your father did this, I’m sorry you’re out of the running for your first choice, and I’m sorry you’ve had to go through something very stressful and painful.

On the other hand, I congratulate you on your courage and maturity. I can’t think of a better way to handle this. You stood up for yourself in a calm, adult-like manner.

I hope Fordham is great for you and you’re not too disappointed you’re not going to your #1 choice of school. I hope you will be at peace with whatever happens between your family and you. If your parents are prepared to never speak to you again for making a choice about your life, then so be it.

You set an amazing example to your sisters. They know it is possible to stand up to their parents when it comes to decisions about their adult lives. They know you’ll be there to support them if they find themselves in similar situations as they grow up.

I’ll pray for you. Keep us posted, please.

 

[yellowantphil]

Brad,
For what it’s worth, I think you made the right decision. Once you move out and live on your own for a while, I suspect your life will be a lot better. Maybe your parents will mellow out eventually—and even if not, now you’ll have the freedom to live your own life. I realize it’s hard right now, but in the long term, this is better than living under your father’s thumb for the rest of your life.

Good luck, and thanks for updating us.

 

[HouseArrest]

Good luck, Brad… knock 'em dead at Fordham. Maybe go to the number 1 school for graduate work?

 

[yellowbird]

I know it’s bittersweet at this point, but congrats on getting that original scholarship. That’s quite an accomplishment. I’m so sorry it didn’t work out. I can only imagine how disappointing that must’ve been.

Your parents sound so unreasonable. I say that as a mother of 5, my oldest is in college. Silent treatment? Seriously - is that how they want to spend what little is left of your childhood? How foolish on their part.

Here’s the good news - you are right on the verge of adulthood - and it’s a long life, God willing - that you get to live as you choose. Be thankful that your parents provided you with a nice home - and hopefully good memories as well. I’m sure your parents love you - they just have a screwy way of showing it. Try to forgive them… parenting isn’t as easy as it looks and someday, if you’re a parent, trust me that you’ll make lots of mistakes. I’m not excusing their behavior - just stating what I know is true.

God bless you, Brad17. I wish you all the best.

 

[monicatholic]

to my thinking, Brad, while the current status is disappointing, it’s NOT as bad as it was looking like. here’s how:

1. you appealed to the Church. you followed the Scriptural instruction and appealed to the Church. (matthew 15:18) nice.
2. the Church reiterated what you knew to be true-- as an adult, your parents are wrong to try and exert pressure on your choice of school/ vocation/ spouse. ( CCC 2230)
3. you’ll be enrolled in your second choice school.
4. though they are NOT obligated to, they are paying for it anyway.

… but they’re not talking to you.

many pages back, i urged you this:

if they withhold a relationship with you “don’t darken my doorstep” and all that jazz, then you forgive them and pray for them that they overcome what would then appear to be emotional blackmail.

in a nutshell: never stay angry and learn how to pump your own gas, iron your own shirts and grill a hamburger. and pray for your parents-- they don’t trust that they parented you well enough.

so,
*don’t stay angry
*pray for them
*learn self-sufficiency
*rock Fordham’s world. with cosmic grades, you may, once again, be able to transfer with a great scholaRSHIP
*live the FAITH your parents gave to you-- their greatest gift to you. even though their example has been less than perfect (as is true for ALL parents) they’ve given you FAITH. they had you baptized into the life of the Blessed Trinity. They’ve brought you to be strengthened by the very Body and Blood of the Lord. You were Confirmed in the Holy Spirit.

you have MORE than what you need to make a sturdy go of it, Brad.

go, dog. go.

 

[aloe]

Thank you for the update. You have accomplished quite a bit already and your future is very bright. Hang in there!

 

[Brad17]

I have been accepted to Fordham.

My Father no longer speaks to me, and my Mother speaks to me only when necessary. My sisters have been instructed to avoid me, and do so.

I spend my Saturday evenings at a Laundromat as my Mother no longer does my laundry. But…I now know how to do my laundry thanks to a girl I am friends with (she’s just a friend) who told me what to do without laughing at me.

One day my Mother sent me on a errand. When I got back, no one was home. Everyone had left to celebrate a birthday for one of my sisters at a local Pizza Hut. I had been sent on the errand to ensure I was not part of the celebration. I left a wrapped birthday present I had bought for my sister on my desk - when I returned from the errand I found it in the trash can outside the house.

The message is clear: You are no longer part of this family. We are simply putting up with you until you turn 18 and can move out.

My Father is not backing down on his promise to pay for my Fordham education, but he is making it very clear how he feels about my defying his plans for my future. I haven’t done anything wrong, but my Father feels otherwise.

I don’t see how going to the Church can help. You cannot force a person to like someone, let alone love them.

So I chug along one day at a time. I feel alone most of the time, but I assume sooner or later God will reduce my need to be accepted by my family.

 

[The_Bucket]

Brad that’s brutal, but one thing you can know right now is that you are more of an adult and more of a man than your father is. I don’t mean that to build up a false sense of pride. I mean that you’ve learned a very important lesson about what not to do with your children down the line.

We all have our crosses to bear. Know that this is your cross. It sucks but it’s the one thrust upon you and I think you’ll be able to handle it.

Forgive your father and your mother. Reach out to your sisters in ways that do not undermine your parents’ authority over them. Personally I think when parents do this kind of thing that they lose their moral authority, and I say that as a parent myself. Adult children are not entitled to a college education, but they are entitled to their own lives. And they are entitled to be loved regardless of their choices. Even if they are immoral choices! You most certainly have not made any choice that’s immoral. You made a choice to be your own man and you’re being lashed for it.

Be thankful to God that your father is at least a man of his word and providing you with the education he promises. Most kids don’t get that leg up. I look at my own childhood and thank God for the advantages I was given. Graduated with degrees and no debt. That’s a big-time advantage. Of course, I was disadvantaged in that my father is a sex addict who destroyed his marriage and poisoned the kids. My relationship with him, as you might imagine, is very strained.

But I try not to think about that and just focus on the blessings that I do have. You should do the same. I think you already are.