Can non-Catholics explain what the Rosary focuses on?

[LilyM]

AlegreFe;1695756:

I can never pray “for” a Saint as they have no need of my prayers. I am merely praying “to” them to ask them to pray for me. “Praying to” just means “talking to.”===============================================Saints are here on earth.These are the ones I,m refering to.

So heaven is empty? Just God and the tumbleweed? Or those who are in there aren’t holy?

Read Revelations again - you will find heaven is very definitely inhabited, by people mind you, prior to the Second Coming. Everyone who is in heaven is a saint as well.

 

[Amicus7]

It’s amazing how the debates get reduced to Rosary beads and prayer cards, when the Doctrinal Issues point to so much more! I love your post!

 

[Amicus7]

Jeanette,

Funny, Catholics are not normally known for their “testimony” but I thought your post about your experience with the Rosary was great. I used to find the prayer long and tedious (just being honest), but as I grow in my faith I find it harder and harder to resist praying it!

 

[Jeanette_L]

As a former Protestant, I can tell you that to come to terms with the fact that the Rosary is not Mary worship, well, it brings about a panic like no other. I remember when I realized that everything I had previously thought to be true about the Catholic prayer life and doctrines had been falsely represented to me by people I had truly respected and looked up to in my faith, it was as if the whole world shifted under my feet, the jolt was so severe. I was reeling.

This is why you will find people mindlessly arguing over and over again, against logic and reason, without honestly thinking and evaluating what you are trying to explain to them. It’s not until they love the Light more than their own comfortable religious beliefs, will they ever truly think through what you are saying.

 

[Jeanette_L]

Jeanette,

Funny, Catholics are not normally known for their “testimony” but I thought your post about your experience with the Rosary was great. I used to find the prayer long and tedious (just being honest), but as I grow in my faith I find it harder and harder to resist praying it!

I actually feel a little ashamed, as I have not spent much time with the Rosary and my other devotions over this past holiday weekend, I need to get back on track! It’s funny how your whole life rythmn feels “off” when you go too long without something that has been so beneficial to your spirit as the Rosary is. I wish people could understand how meditating on the life of Christ is such a cleansing experience, always something knew to discover and share with Him.

 

[MariaG]

But that is what Maria is saying. You pray to others to pray for you in the name of Jesus Christ.

I can never pray “for” a Saint as they have no need of my prayers. I am merely praying “to” them to ask them to pray for me. “Praying to” just means "talking to."

For a Catholic to pray does not mean “to worship” as some Protestants might think we mean.

Think of it this way, I “talk to” my friends. I don’t normally say I “talk for” my friends when I am talking to them.

So as I pray, I pray to (talk to) the saints in asking them to pray for me.

Does that make it clearer for you?

Saints are here on earth.These are the ones I,m refering to.

The Catholic Church does not define Saint as only the Saints here on earth.

Clearly from Scritpure we can all agree that Saints refer to followers of Christ. In the Catholic Church, we do not try to separate out the saints in heaven from the saints on earth. They are alive in Christ, they are more alive than we are. Why would the stop being saints just becaus they are in heaven?

The question is not why do Catholic call the saints in heaven, saints. Nor is it why do Catholic include the saints in heaven as part of the Body of Christ. The question is why do non-Catholic exclude those in heaven from being defined as saints and try to separate the body of Christ just because they have died when as Christians we believe that Christ conquered death?

There is certainly no scripture that tells us that the saints in heaven are no longer to be called saints. They certainly are not dead as we know directly from Scripture that God is the God of the living and not the dead. And we can see from Hebrews and the “cloud of witnesses” that the Saints in heaven are in fact still working for His glory. How is that not defined as being a saint

I don’t think that you are saying that once a believer dies that God is no longer their God, but this is the implication if one tries to say that the saints in heaven are not saints anymore or no longer carry out wishes of God like praying for one another.

 

[valient_Lucy]

Saints are here on earth.These are the ones I,m refering to.

What are the people in heaven? Notorious sinners? Do we get to heaven and then God says, “Now that you’re in heaven, you can sin all your want!”
If the people in heaven are not saints, then I would like very much to know what the are.

 

[AlegreFe]

Jeanette,

Funny, Catholics are not normally known for their “testimony” but I thought your post about your experience with the Rosary was great. I used to find the prayer long and tedious (just being honest), but as I grow in my faith I find it harder and harder to resist praying it!

I started praying the Rosary about a year ago. I thought that it could probably be long & tedious also. But once you get to meditating on the life of Jesus, you can close your eyes and the time seems to stop as you’re in the life of Jesus and you don’t want to leave. But then once you’re done praying the Rosary, you feel, “what?.. it’s over already?” I’m sure you feel the same way as you find it hard to resist praying the Rosary.

 

[IHS]

IHS;1696488:

So heaven is empty? Just God and the tumbleweed? Or those who are in there aren’t holy?

Read Revelations again - you will find heaven is very definitely inhabited, by people mind you, prior to the Second Coming. Everyone who is in heaven is a saint as well.

Thats not true. There are angels in heaven also.Not to be confused with saints for each ones have different roles.

 

[valient_Lucy]

LilyM;1696700:

Thats not true. There are angels in heaven also.Not to be confused with saints for each ones have different roles.

That’s true, the angels in heaven are spirit beings, seperate from the Saints, who are human beings.
The point is, the saints on earth who die become saints in heaven. They certainly don’t become sinners in heaven!

 

[LilyM]

LilyM;1696700:

Thats not true. There are angels in heaven also.Not to be confused with saints for each ones have different roles.

So who are the “elders” of Revelation 5:11 then - 'I heard the voice of many angels around about the throne [ie in heaven - note this is PRIOR to Christ returning to Earth] AND the beasts AND the elders". Clearly the elders are NOT angels, they are different - they are human. And as I said, they ARE there prior to the Last Judgement!

For someone who claims to follow the Bible you don’t read it very carefully at all, do you?

 

[MariaG]

LilyM;1696700:

Thats not true. There are angels in heaven also.Not to be confused with saints for each ones have different roles.

So there are in fact saints in heaven?

And what is the job of a saint?

To pray to God for one another. Ask other saints to unite their prayers with ours.

What do Catholics do?

Ask the saints (in heaven and on earth) to pray to God for us.

What about this is contrary to scripture?

God Bless,
Maria

 

[tptram]

… What kind of a relationship would you have with someone if all you said was the same thing over and over again? …

“Jesus, I love you” is the most beautiful thing that I can repeat to God all the time.
He will not get tired to hear me repeat it all day long.
I say it when some one cuts me off in traffic.
I say it when some one irritates me.
I say it when I feel anger rises in me.

Tak

 

[AlegreFe]

Yes, but it is “much speaking” by repitition and that’s vain to God. What kind of a relationship would you have with someone if all you said was the same thing over and over again? God is a real person. Talk to Him without the repititions.

One of these days you will come back to the Catholic Church and you will love it. I pray that happens soon. Only the Holy Spirit can make that happen.

For now, you just don’t seem to read anything that we post on here. You just don’t get it. But that’s okay. Apparantly God doesn’t want you to get it for now.

When we pray the Rosary, we are meditating on the Life of Jesus Christ. We are meditating on the Gospels. Do you ever meditate on the Gospels for any length of time between 20 minutes to half an hour? I mean really meditate on the Life of Jesus Christ in the Gospels. You cannot say that meditating on the life of Jesus Christ is vain in any way.

Just because we repeat words does not mean that it is vain. The words we are saying are not empty words. We say those words while meditating on the Gospels.

Jesus certainly prayed in repetition. He prayed like that in the Garden during His Agony. That is one of our mysteries btw, on which we meditate. Did you read any of my posts indictating all of the mysteries; there is one right after that one that I have linked here.

 

[JCPeacekeeper]

Let’s see what the Bible say’s about this subject:

Jesus himself said, “and when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” Matthew 6:7

In The Gospel of Luke he was with a crowd and a woman raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But he said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the WORD OF GOD and keep it!” LUKE 11:27-28

The Bible is like a wall of Steel, you can throw your Catholic Catechism at it and it will shatter. You don’t judge the Bible by other books, you judge other books by the Bible.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Let’s see what the Bible say’s about this subject:

Jesus himself said, “and when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” Matthew 6:7

In The Gospel of Luke he was with a crowd and a woman raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But he said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the WORD OF GOD and keep it!” LUKE 11:27-28

The Bible is like a wall of Steel, you can throw your Catholic Catechism at it and it will shatter. You don’t judge the Bible by other books, you judge other books by the Bible.

I don’t think I’m buying your agenda here. Many Catholics here are unconvince about Sola Scriptura.

In fact, the Angels in Heaven say repetitous prayer. "Holy! Holy! Holy! Lord! In the Revelations.

Jesus himself say a repetitious prayer.

Matt. 6:7 - Jesus teaches, “do not heap up empty phrases” in prayer. Protestants use this verse to criticize various Catholic forms of prayer which repeat phrases, such as litanies and the Rosary. But Jesus’ focus in this instruction is on the “vain,” and not on the “repetition.”

Matt. 26:44 - for example, Jesus prayed a third time in the garden of Gethsemane, saying the exact same words again. It is not the repetition that is the issue. It’s the vanity. God looks into our heart, not solely at our words.

Luke 18:13 - the tax collector kept beating his breast and praying “God be merciful to me, a sinner.” This repetitive prayer was pleasing to God because it was offered with a sincere and repentant heart.

Acts 10:2,4 - Cornelius prayed constantly to the Lord and his prayers ascended as a memorial before God.

Rom. 1:9 - Paul says that he always mentions the Romans in his prayers without ceasing.

Rom. 12:12 - Paul commands us to be constant in prayer. God looks at what is in our heart, not necessarily how we choose our words.

1 Thess. 5:17 - Paul commands us to pray constantly. Good repetition is different than vain repetition.

Rev. 4:8 - the angels pray day and night without cessation the same words “Holy, Holy, Holy is the Lord God Almighty.” This is repetitious prayer that is pleasing to God.

Psalm 136 - in this Psalm, the phrase “For His steadfast love endures forever” is more repetitious than any Catholic prayer, and it is God’s divine Word.

Dan. 3:35-66 - the phrase “Bless the Lord” is similarly offered repeatedly, and mirrors Catholic litanies.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Let’s see what the Bible say’s about this subject:

Jesus himself said, “and when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” Matthew 6:7

In The Gospel of Luke he was with a crowd and a woman raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But he said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the WORD OF GOD and keep it!” LUKE 11:27-28

Mary heard the word of God and she said, “Be it done onto me according to your word.” So Jesus is calling his mother blessed.

The Bible is like a wall of Steel, you can throw your Catholic Catechism at it and it will shatter. You don’t judge the Bible by other books, you judge other books by the Bible.

The Bible doesn’t say it is the final authority. The Bible in 1 Tim 3:15 that the Church is the Pillar and Truth not the Bible.

 

[AlegreFe]

Let’s see what the Bible say’s about this subject:

Jesus himself said, “and when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” Matthew 6:7

In The Gospel of Luke he was with a crowd and a woman raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But he said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the WORD OF GOD and keep it!” LUKE 11:27-28

The Bible is like a wall of Steel, you can throw your Catholic Catechism at it and it will shatter. You don’t judge the Bible by other books, you judge other books by the Bible.

Former Catholic, just come back and you’ll get to know the Truth for what it is.

After reading your post, I gathered that you have not read any post in this thread at all.

You were in the light, but then you left if. So now you are in the dark.

If you believe that salvation is through Jesus Christ then you should believe that salvation is inside the Church.
If you believe that the Church is the Body of Christ then you should believe that Salvation is through the Church.
The Catholic Church has the Fullness of Truth.
The Catholic Church has the Full Means of Salvation.

In order to get to Heaven you need Sanctifying Grace.
If you want a share in Divine Life, then you would want Sanctifying Grace because that what it is, a share in divine life. And that’s the only way you will get to Heaven, with a share in Divine Life.

But just be glad that we have a Merciful God.
Jesus Christ is Mercy!

 

[jim1130]

"JCPeacekeeper:

Let’s see what the Bible say’s about this subject:

Jesus himself said, “and when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” Matthew 6:7

In The Gospel of Luke he was with a crowd and a woman raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But he said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the WORD OF GOD and keep it!” LUKE 11:27-28

The Bible is like a wall of Steel, you can throw your Catholic Catechism at it and it will shatter. You don’t judge the Bible by other books, you judge other books by the Bible.

Former Catholic, just come back and you’ll get to know the Truth for what it is.

After reading your post, I gathered that you have not read any post in this thread at all.

You were in the light, but then you left if. So now you are in the dark.

If you believe that salvation is through Jesus Christ then you should believe that salvation is inside the Church.
If you believe that the Church is the Body of Christ then you should believe that Salvation is through the Church.
The Catholic Church has the Fullness of Truth.
The Catholic Church has the Full Means of Salvation.

In order to get to Heaven you need Sanctifying Grace.
If you want a share in Divine Life, then you would want Sanctifying Grace because that what it is, a share in divine life. And that’s the only way you will get to Heaven, with a share in Divine Life.

But just be glad that we have a Merciful God.
Jesus Christ is Mercy!

JCPeacekeeper,

Your interpretations are inaccurate.

For Matthew 6:7, reference here is for those whose “vain repetitions” are directed toward to false gods (lowercase “g”) thinking that by praying over and over the false gods will be hear their prayers.

For Luke 11:27-28, Jesus redirected the credit to Mary where it belonged. Jesus was saying that Mary’s attentiveness to God’s word, her obedience, was more important than her biological relationship with Jesus.

As for the Bible: What is the origin of the Bible?

 

[AlegreFe]

As for the Bible: What is the origin of the Bible?

The Church!

Sorry, had to answer that. I don’t know if you wanted JC to answer that. I couldn’t resist.